Question for the Husker insiders....

[Husker Hoops Penitent]

Someone recently wrote how the good news/rumors are coming so fast that it is necessary to check the board multiple times per day. I agree and want to pose the question regarding a few players still on the roster.

 

I don't think Thorbjarnerson nor Heiman will ever contribute especially considering the type of caliber player Hoiberg and staff are getting responses from. I also wonder about Karrington Davis and D. Davis as well. Amir Harris is the question mark, in that he may be the odd exception who is a poor shooter but so proficient as a lock-down defender that NU could overlook the shooting, but even this is fair game for debate considering how much value Hoiberg places on shooting proficiency. Haven't we long suffering fans seen enough athletes who can't shoot? Nevertheless, there are four scholarships locked up which might potentially be given to high-four, and even some legitimate five star players in the future. As of today NU is in communication with D. Johnson, Garcia, Suggs, Foster and a few others. This is unprecedented! Hoiberg seems to be aiming for the stars and his message is being received. I have no special qualifications but have watched college ball for decades, sometimes closely and it seems absurd to waste scholarships on players who will not see the floor in any meaningful way. More knowledgeable fans correct me if I am wrong.

[49r]

Indiana rolls out whole rosters of pretty much nothing but 4* and 5* guys, and yet since joining the Big Ten, Nebraska is 6-4 against them (3-2 in Bloomington) and we haven't lost to them since 2016.

 

Nebraska in that same time frame has struggled to get guys inside the Rivals 150.

[HuskerFever]

4 minutes ago, 49r said:

Indiana rolls out whole rosters of pretty much nothing but 4* and 5* guys, and yet since joining the Big Ten, Nebraska is 6-4 against them (3-2 in Bloomington) and we haven't lost to them since 2016.

 

Nebraska in that same time frame has struggled to get guys inside the Rivals 150.

 

This is why I'm excited to see what both Frost and Hoiberg are doing. They seem to get that building the right culture and mentality, inside the classroom and on the field/court, are critical to success. It doesn't take the highest stars to succeed, it can take the right culture and the right people who want to be part of that culture.

[75unlgrad]

We give Fred complete control over the roster.  Bring in the talent!!!

[Norm Peterson]

53 minutes ago, Husker Hoops Penitent said:

Someone recently wrote how the good news/rumors are coming so fast that it is necessary to check the board multiple times per day. I agree and want to pose the question regarding a few players still on the roster.

 

I don't think Thorbjarnerson nor Heiman will ever contribute especially considering the type of caliber player Hoiberg and staff are getting responses from. I also wonder about Karrington Davis and D. Davis as well. Amir Harris is the question mark, in that he may be the odd exception who is a poor shooter but so proficient as a lock-down defender that NU could overlook the shooting, but even this is fair game for debate considering how much value Hoiberg places on shooting proficiency. Haven't we long suffering fans seen enough athletes who can't shoot? Nevertheless, there are four scholarships locked up which might potentially be given to high-four, and even some legitimate five star players in the future. As of today NU is in communication with D. Johnson, Garcia, Suggs, Foster and a few others. This is unprecedented! Hoiberg seems to be aiming for the stars and his message is being received. I have no special qualifications but have watched college ball for decades, sometimes closely and it seems absurd to waste scholarships on players who will not see the floor in any meaningful way. More knowledgeable fans correct me if I am wrong.

 

I am responding to your question and not trying to belabor a point from earlier threads, by the way. Because this discussion has been held.

 

With Miles, I think there would have been legit fear that, given his lack of job security and lack of apparent support from the AD, we'd have had a difficult time replacing some of the current guys with players who were any better.  So, you hang onto them and then hope you can find some gems to fill in around them.

 

I don't think Hoiberg is obligated to retain Miles's players. I don't think we've opened up the checkbook to hire a coach and then turn around and saddle him with players who don't fit his system.

 

Having said that, there are certain players on the roster who I think have some of the tools and could potentially develop, and there are others who lack a certain, specific skill that I don't think makes it very likely they'll be long for this program.  I think Karrington Davis could make it if he returns to health and can regain the athleticism he would have had before his injury.  He has a lot of the tools we'd be looking for, including shooting ability.  I think Brady Heiman has something you can't coach, which is being 6'11". On top of his height, though, Brady has some skills and he's a fluid athlete for a guy his size.  His shot could use some work but I think he's got a foundation that you could tweak to get it where it needs to be.  We're not going to expect Brady to launch threes all game long, but if he's at least a threat to pick and pop from time to time, that's enough.  Dachon Burke will probably be a pretty solid contributor in a Hoiberg offense.  He has the skills we want.

 

The other guys seriously lack a jumper and they're so far off from having a decent J that I think the new staff is likely going to be able to find someone else who already has one and not have to hope that they can develop one in the couple of people you named.  I don't think Amir's athleticism is going to be enough of a plus to make up for his truly abysmal jumper.  I just don't.

 

So, anyway, yeah.  I think we'll see some more changes. And I think the list of visitors is an indication that we're going to be bringing in some people.  Probably more than what we currently have room for.

[Handy Johnson]

The days of having the Jabari Parker’s of the World visit campus will become the norm & not the exception. Our staff is plugged in at every level, AAU, transfers, NBA. I expect things to turn quickly & some guys will get left behind. Heiman tho I think will stick, the others I’m not so sure about.

[Art Vandalay]

1 hour ago, Norm Peterson said:

 

I am responding to your question and not trying to belabor a point from earlier threads, by the way. Because this discussion has been held.

 

With Miles, I think there would have been legit fear that, given his lack of job security and lack of apparent support from the AD, we'd have had a difficult time replacing some of the current guys with players who were any better.  So, you hang onto them and then hope you can find some gems to fill in around them.

 

I don't think Hoiberg is obligated to retain Miles's players. I don't think we've opened up the checkbook to hire a coach and then turn around and saddle him with players who don't fit his system.

 

Having said that, there are certain players on the roster who I think have some of the tools and could potentially develop, and there are others who lack a certain, specific skill that I don't think makes it very likely they'll be long for this program.  I think Karrington Davis could make it if he returns to health and can regain the athleticism he would have had before his injury.  He has a lot of the tools we'd be looking for, including shooting ability.  I think Brady Heiman has something you can't coach, which is being 6'11". On top of his height, though, Brady has some skills and he's a fluid athlete for a guy his size.  His shot could use some work but I think he's got a foundation that you could tweak to get it where it needs to be.  We're not going to expect Brady to launch threes all game long, but if he's at least a threat to pick and pop from time to time, that's enough.  Dachon Burke will probably be a pretty solid contributor in a Hoiberg offense.  He has the skills we want.

 

The other guys seriously lack a jumper and they're so far off from having a decent J that I think the new staff is likely going to be able to find someone else who already has one and not have to hope that they can develop one in the couple of people you named.  I don't think Amir's athleticism is going to be enough of a plus to make up for his truly abysmal jumper.  I just don't.

 

So, anyway, yeah.  I think we'll see some more changes. And I think the list of visitors is an indication that we're going to be bringing in some people.  Probably more than what we currently have room for.

 

Overall I tend to agree, except on Harris. He is a plus athlete and has potential to be a starting caliber big ten player. You should read the latest Hail Varsity article in which they discuss what the staff thinks of Harris. Do not think they will run him off at all.

Edited April 19, 2019 by Art Vandalay

[Norm Peterson]

Just now, Art Vandalay said:

 

Overall I tend to agree, except on Harris. He is a plus athlete and has potential to be a starting caliber big ten player. You should read the latest Hail Varsity article in which the discuss what the staff thinks of Harris. Do not think they will run him off at all.

 

I defer to the staff. They know a hell of a lot more than me about talent and what they're looking for.

[busticket]

I could see Amir having a role IF the other 4 guys are three point threats.  Amir flashed some nice drives his first year.

 

if you think back to Fred’s teams with Royce White, they used Royce as a point forward and spread the floor.  Royce would then just dominate the guy covering him one an one.  Obviously Harris is not Royce White but if we can spread the floor with shooters he could be a threat taking a guy to the basket one on one.

[tcp]

These are decisions I happily leave to coaches and players. They're in the best position to know who can do what and, more importantly, what NU needs to be successful. A lot more than I'll ever know, that's for sure. 

 

I do believe that you honor schollies unless the player violates the terms. This is still college, and I'd prefer we didn't completely abandon the illusion that education is still a virtuous pursuit. 

 

 

[throwback]

18 minutes ago, tcp said:

These are decisions I happily leave to coaches and players. They're in the best position to know who can do what and, more importantly, what NU needs to be successful. A lot more than I'll ever know, that's for sure. 

 

I do believe that you honor schollies unless the player violates the terms. This is still college, and I'd prefer we didn't completely abandon the illusion that education is still a virtuous pursuit. 

 

 

I agree to a point - if the player is doing everything he's asked to do on and off the court, I would prefer we aren't running them off.

 

However, coaches also need to be honest with players about how they do or don't fit into the system, especially after a coaching change. So maybe it's less about running players off and more about just being honest with them. If they want to play, it's best to move on.

 

I would imagine this is more of what's going on, because Coach Hoiberg has a specific system/emphasis, which is quite a bit different than what Coach Miles had, so naturally, some skill sets aren't going to translate well.

 

Now as I recall, Coach Miles, maybe after his 1st year, did exactly that with Benny Parker, telling him he didn't see Benny earning any playing time. And Benny basically said, I'm going to prove you wrong and earn playing time, which he did. So these things don't always work out as expected during coaching changes.

 

[Huskerpapa]

45 minutes ago, throwback said:

I agree to a point - if the player is doing everything he's asked to do on and off the court, I would prefer we aren't running them off.

 

However, coaches also need to be honest with players about how they do or don't fit into the system, especially after a coaching change. So maybe it's less about running players off and more about just being honest with them. If they want to play, it's best to move on.

 

I would imagine this is more of what's going on, because Coach Hoiberg has a specific system/emphasis, which is quite a bit different than what Coach Miles had, so naturally, some skill sets aren't going to translate well.

 

Now as I recall, Coach Miles, maybe after his 1st year, did exactly that with Benny Parker, telling him he didn't see Benny earning any playing time. And Benny basically said, I'm going to prove you wrong and earn playing time, which he did. So these things don't always work out as expected during coaching changes.

 

There may be a slight difference between then and now.  We have two top level recruiters, at least one of whom can recruit anywhere.  Think about it, back then, we could not recruit a PG that could outplay or out shoot Benny.  Benny could hustle his butt off, but almost every other element of his game was that of a two star, rather than a high three or four star player.  Given what we hear about our new staff, finding and landing high level talent should be less problematic...right?

[colhusker]

I will hold judgement on who will or won't be back until the verbal commitments start to roll in.  I think the will start soon, but until then, I've lived in the Show-Me State longer enough I need to be shown.

[hhcscott]

I'm pretty sure we hired Hoiberg to coach, so I look forward to watching the players already here develop. Many of them have athleticism, size, speed, vision. If they can be coached to shoot and to execute his offense then the U is getting their moneys' worth. If we are hoping that we will simply back up bus after bus of 5-star transfers and reload every year I don't think that is sustainable. There has to be a balance of development and timely additions of top recruits.

[Norm Peterson]

17 hours ago, tcp said:

These are decisions I happily leave to coaches and players. They're in the best position to know who can do what and, more importantly, what NU needs to be successful. A lot more than I'll ever know, that's for sure. 

 

I do believe that you honor schollies unless the player violates the terms. This is still college, and I'd prefer we didn't completely abandon the illusion that education is still a virtuous pursuit. 

 

If you're the coach who brought the player in, I agree. I would feel uncomfortable with a coach who did a spring Creaning every year.

 

However -- and I'm not trying to pulverize the dead horse, perhaps just tenderize it a bit -- we're not shelling out big bucks to a new coaching staff only to saddle them with players that don't fit what they want to do. Hoiberg will keep who he thinks can help. And there are enough offers out there, combined with the recommitted recruits, to fill a roster. So, if your name isn't Dachon Burke, I'd have a fall-back plan.

[Silverbacked1]

We have to have some quality players who are willing to work hard in practice and know they might not play but are ready at any time.

 

Walk ons are great and all but you still need the next layer.

 

Couple of our guys are likely to be able to graduate next year so they can grad. transfer if room is needed.

 

Also a couple would have there transfer red shirt after next year which would be their second year where they would transfer like most guys seem to do.

 

But like I have said all along The staff will do what they think is correct for everybody involved no matter what we think or say on this board.

Edited April 20, 2019 by Silverbacked1

[89Husker]

Not sure why we would want to run off the only guy on our roster who is taller than 6'6, especially since he is an in-state player, 6'11, with some skills (yeah, I know, not great skills).  I am guessing that Brady doesn't need to be a prime-time player; he might be perfectly happy for his next 3 years filling a role on this team.  Or maybe, when he adds 20 or 30 lbs, he might actually contribute more than that.

[Art Vandalay]

53 minutes ago, 89Husker said:

Not sure why we would want to run off the only guy on our roster who is taller than 6'6, especially since he is an in-state player, 6'11, with some skills (yeah, I know, not great skills).  I am guessing that Brady doesn't need to be a prime-time player; he might be perfectly happy for his next 3 years filling a role on this team.  Or maybe, when he adds 20 or 30 lbs, he might actually contribute more than that.

 

Plus you do not want to kill instate momentum by running off a local kid. I am guessing Fred and staff will see much they can coach up the returning guys this first year and then re-evaluate their potential.

[Norm Peterson]

3 hours ago, Silverbacked1 said:

We have to have some quality players who are willing to work hard in practice and know they might not play but are ready at any time.

 

Walk ons are great and all but you still need the next layer.

 

Couple of our guys are likely to be able to graduate next year so they can grad. transfer if room is needed.

 

Also a couple would have there transfer red shirt after next year which would be their second year where they would transfer like most guys seem to do.

 

But like I have said all along The staff will do what they think is correct for everybody involved no matter what we think or say on this board.

 

Ha! You didn't read all the way through Hoiberg's contract, then. Paragraph 7.C.2(a)(iii) specifically says, "... provided that all decisions on player personal matters, including recruitment and retention, have received prior WRITTEN approval of Norman Peterson of the Husker Hoops Central Board."  So ...

[tcp]

Heiman has to get stronger to play at this level. If he does, he'll be able to contribute. He should've redshirted, as most big men should. 

[AuroranHusker]

5 hours ago, tcp said:

Heiman has to get stronger to play at this level. If he does, he'll be able to contribute. He should've redshirted, as most big men should. 

 

Definitely should have redshirted, but thanks to Jordy bolting it wasn't meant to be in 2018-19. Would love to see Brady pack on 25# of lean muscle prior to 2019-20. He has skills at 6'-11" but he needs to boost the athleticism up a few notches to be a B1G-caliber post player. If he could stretch the court as a 3-pt. shooter, that would negate some of his slight-of-frame. I have hopes that Heiman will transform his body in the fairly near-term to become a factor for NU. We'll have to wait & see how much of a factor that will be, though. I hope it's a B1G factor, in due time.

 

[Silverbacked1]

Maybe Coach Zach could lend a hand for like 6 months, he seems to have done well with the football team.

[Huskerpapa]

13 hours ago, AuroranHusker said:

 

Definitely should have redshirted, but thanks to Jordy bolting it wasn't meant to be in 2018-19. Would love to see Brady pack on 25# of lean muscle prior to 2019-20. He has skills at 6'-11" but he needs to boost the athleticism up a few notches to be a B1G-caliber post player. If he could stretch the court as a 3-pt. shooter, that would negate some of his slight-of-frame. I have hopes that Heiman will transform his body in the fairly near-term to become a factor for NU. We'll have to wait & see how much of a factor that will be, though. I hope it's a B1G factor, in due time.

 

Is it a possibility, that if the planets align, we could still see Brady redshirt.  If he could take a year, build his body, improve movement and further improve his shot; perhaps he could be just what the doctor ordered in the middle.

[Cazzie22]

I like Thorir.  He is basketball savvy.  In an  open offense he can drive and dish to the shooters. Plus he is 6’6” and is willing to rebound.  Obviously, he will only be a role player but teams need role players. 

[AuroranHusker]

14 hours ago, Cazzie22 said:

I like Thorir.  He is basketball savvy.  In an  open offense he can drive and dish to the shooters. Plus he is 6’6” and is willing to rebound.  Obviously, he will only be a role player but teams need role players. 

 

Definitely true. Not all 13 guys on scholarship have to be huge contributors. All can serve a role, though. Thor would sure be able to carve out a role on a B1G team. He's a willing passer who can rebound some.

 

 

Edited April 22, 2019 by AuroranHusker