Would you play for Coach Hoiberg's Huskers?

[hhcmatt]

On 3/24/2021 at 10:08 AM, basketballjones said:

Consider me a bit skeptical at the moment. But I have to be honest - at this point - I would turn down a Husker offer. I was born and raised here, and have been going to games since 1986. I actually think I like Nebrasketball more than I like Husker Football. 

But at this point, if I was a top prep prospect, even in state, I think I would tell Coach Hoiberg, "thank you, but no thank you." For my hypothetical - I am an out-of-high school, scholarship-worthy player, not a "leave after first year as an NBA prospect," but I've certainly been recruited because I have the size/skill to play at this level. Let's call me, "Isaiah Bass," from Great Peninsula, Nebraska. 

If I were to say yes, here's the questions/concerns I would need answered/addressed before I committed:
1. Who the hell else is going to be on my team from year to year? I plan on being here 3-4 years. This is my team, my family, the people I am going to spend the most time with. Is every year going to be like Freshman Orientation at the dorm?

2. Are you committed to developing me and letting me learn/grow? Or am I going to be shown the door after year 1-2 because I did not come in completely ready-made?
3. Will I be surrounded by high character guys? Or are you going to be brining a bunch of dudes in who have been shown the door at other places? 
4. Am I going to be recruited-over every single year? I understand the job is to bring in the best players you can and build the best team you can. But I'm not feeling a lot of confidence when I notice you've contacted EVERY SINGLE KID IN THE TRANSFER PORTAL. 

What say you? You in no matter what? Are my questions unfounded? Are they legit? 

 

 

Would you turn down our 2nd offer when you hit the transfer portal after you left what you thought was your ideal school?

[Norm Peterson]

Hoiberg kept, what, 1 of Miles' players? And he had to scramble to fill a roster with whoever was available in April 2 years ago? And, so, maybe some of those guys didn't work out? And we just got done with year 2? And kids transfer at a higher rate now than they did 10 years ago and so it's almost commonplace that players will transfer? But we're supposed to feel like it's some sort of bad sign when the guys you really wouldn't want to keep off this year's roster announce, in the most gracious ways I think I've ever seen from any departing player, that they're going to continue their careers elsewhere? And this is supposed to be some sort of damning indictment of Hoiberg as a coach? Such that you wouldn't want to play for him? As if transfers aren't a common occurrence across the landscape of college basketball?

 

Which of the guys who transferred do you think we should have kept?

 

You think 2 years is a reasonable sample size to say, based on number of transfers, you wouldn't want to play for him?

 

Really?

[Norm Peterson]

On 3/25/2021 at 8:12 AM, basketballjones said:

What an incredible paragraph. Excellent point. Maybe Coach Hoiberg and Co. have seen the future before everyone else and they're just completely bought into it. Matt Abdelmassih is effectively our roster management GM. Hoiberg just coaches whoever he brings in. 

 

Creighton does. Return a core group almost every year. Guys mostly stay. Bigs develop. Wisconsin certainly. Iowa. 

I feel there's plenty of teams who do a great job of returning a core group year in, year out. Maybe take some sit-out transfers, or an immediate gap filler, but the core remains the same. Could be wrong though. 

 

Strong disagree. Most Coaches absolutely hate it. Some thrive in it, but still can't stand it. And honestly I think a lot of players really don't like it as much as you'd think they like the "freedom." That's just a hunch though. 

 

I know you're a big McDermott fan, but he brings in a lot of transfers, and if you think his players don't transfer, Davion Mintz says hello. But you think only our transfers have character issues? That's what CU fans claim too, that their guys are all high-character guys.

[Vinny]

12 minutes ago, Norm Peterson said:

Hoiberg kept, what, 1 of Miles' players? And he had to scramble to fill a roster with whoever was available in April 2 years ago? And, so, maybe some of those guys didn't work out? And we just got done with year 2? And kids transfer at a higher rate now than they did 10 years ago and so it's almost commonplace that players will transfer? But we're supposed to feel like it's some sort of bad sign when the guys you really wouldn't want to keep off this year's roster announce, in the most gracious ways I think I've ever seen from any departing player, that they're going to continue their careers elsewhere? And this is supposed to be some sort of damning indictment of Hoiberg as a coach? Such that you wouldn't want to play for him? As if transfers aren't a common occurrence across the landscape of college basketball?

 

Which of the guys who transferred do you think we should have kept?

 

You think 2 years is a reasonable sample size to say, based on number of transfers, you wouldn't want to play for him?

 

Really?

[basketballjones]

11 hours ago, Norm Peterson said:

 

I know you're a big McDermott fan, but he brings in a lot of transfers, and if you think his players don't transfer, Davion Mintz says hello. But you think only our transfers have character issues? That's what CU fans claim too, that their guys are all high-character guys.

I know it's the Cardinal sin of this website and Husker-Fandom to say this... But Greg McDermott runs an incredible program and does things the right way. 

Edited March 29, 2021 by basketballjones

[cornfed24-7]

7 minutes ago, basketballjones said:

I know it's the Cardinal sin of this website and Husker-Fandom to say this... But Greg McDermott runs an incredible program and does things the right way. 

Soooooooo I assume we're ignoring the FBI investigation when when we say "the right way" and "incredible program"?

[basketballjones]

Just now, cornfed24-7 said:

Soooooooo I assume we're ignoring the FBI investigation when when we say "the right way" and "incredible program"?

Every program in the nation does something like that. Just some got caught. If you don't think we're right there doing things like that, I've got some land in the Sandhills with an Ocean view I'd like to sell you. 

[cornfed24-7]

1 minute ago, basketballjones said:

Every program in the nation does something like that. Just some got caught. If you don't think we're right there doing things like that, I've got some land in the Sandhills with an Ocean view I'd like to sell you. 

Ahh everyones dirty. Got it. Thats your excuse. Yup great program

[49r]

47 minutes ago, basketballjones said:

Every program in the nation does something like that. Just some got caught. If you don't think we're right there doing things like that, I've got some land in the Sandhills with an Ocean view I'd like to sell you. 

 

I can guarantee with absolute 100% certainty that not every program in the nation is "doing something like that", and very certainly the vast majority of the few who might, don't cheat to the extreme extent that Creighton has been caught red-handed doing.

 

This pathetic hand-waving away of the obvious and disgusting flouting of NCAA rules that a few bad actors are engaging in is part of the problem in college athletics, not the solution.

 

Please don't continue to be a Husker supporter if you think what they are doing up there is okay.  And it is most certainly NOT "doing things the right way".

[basketballjones]

46 minutes ago, 49r said:

 

I can guarantee with absolute 100% certainty that not every program in the nation is "doing something like that", and very certainly the vast majority of the few who might, don't cheat to the extreme extent that Creighton has been caught red-handed doing.

 

This pathetic hand-waving away of the obvious and disgusting flouting of NCAA rules that a few bad actors are engaging in is part of the problem in college athletics, not the solution.

 

Please don't continue to be a Husker supporter if you think what they are doing up there is okay.  And it is most certainly NOT "doing things the right way".

I stupidly exaggerated. You are right. But, I will say that I have first-hand experiences with this subject. 

[hhcmatt]

This is a thread about landing HS kids.  Given the nature of how we build rosters, we don't need a ton. Ideally I think we want to land 1-2 high end HS recruits a year and fill in the rest with transfers, JUCOs, and lesser regarded HS guys.

 

Here is the 8 man rotation for Arkansas under Eric Musselman who has lived just as much in the transfer portal as Hoiberg over the years

 

G - JR, Transfer from Jacksonville

G - Frosh who is from Arkansas (Top 150)

G - SR, transfer from N. Kentucky

F - Frosh who is from Arkansas (Top 150)

F - SR, transfer from Indiana

C - Frosh from Arkansas (Top 150)

C - Jr transfer from Cal

G - Jr from Arkansas

 

Musselman landed four Top 150 kids from the state of Arkansas in 2020.  (one of them isn't in the rotation)

To me bringing in local stars and filling in with transfers seems like a good way to build a team.  It's virtually impossible to replicate what Arkansas has done with local kids because we don't have that much talent to recruit from. Correct me if I've forgotten someone, but we've had 4 top 150 guys in this state between 2012 and 2020:  (Gisell, Akoy Agau, Justin Patton, Max Murrell). 2021 and 2022 has been banner years and we're talking 4 guys (Sallis, Hepburn, Traudt, Green) I think local kids have natural built-in buy and will always advocate to land them but fortunately/unfortunately the payoff for building a pipeline into this state isn't very many guys. We need to look everywhere and if part of that expense happens to be not recruiting well in this state, it's a relatively small price to pay.

 

 

 

Here are the HS kids we've landed thus far:

2019

Kevin Cross (transferred out 1 year)

Samari Curtis (transferred out ~1 year)

Yvan Ouedraogo (transferred out 2 years)

Akol Arop (transferred out 2 years)

2020

Elijah Wood (transferred out 1 year)

Eduardo Andre (here)

2021

Bryce McGowens (here) (Top 150)

Wilhelm Breidenbach (here) (Top 150)

 

To me in our first two years trying to establish this thing we got lucky with Andre as he was essentially a dart throw recruit like Wood and Curtis (We-need-to-fill-these-schollies-guys). Cross, Yvan, and Arop are likely relegated to the bench. We almost got Sanogo and a couple of other guys. We finally caught some breaks with Byce McGowens and Breidnbach. (The highest HS recruit in our history was actually a product of our transfer culture).  We pulled 2 highly regarded HS guys. 

 

Ideally, we would start winning some games in 2021 to start landing those 2022 guys we been recruiting since Fred got here and land 2+ more. If not, we'll just go get some more transfers and try it again. Either at some point it will work or at some point Fred is no longer the coach here.

 

[Shawn Eichorst's Toupee]

10 minutes ago, hhcmatt said:

This is a thread about landing HS kids. 

They don't pay you enough to try and keep everyone on topic here, but you do a great job at it

[hhcmatt]

1 hour ago, Shawn Eichorst's Toupee said:

They don't pay you enough to try and keep everyone on topic here, but you do a great job at it

 

This actually had nothing to do with the Creighton stuff. It was more a comment about the questions from the first post mostly being relevant to a HS kid.

[Art Vandalay]

2 hours ago, basketballjones said:

I stupidly exaggerated. You are right. But, I will say that I have first-hand experiences with this subject. 

 I have no doubt we play some of the games everyone is playing. However Creighton straight up offered a kid $100K and job for his parents. I actually hope we are doing the same because it seems no one cares but I have a hard time believing we are. Either way Creighton has not been a clean program since they moved to the Big East. They hired Murphy to go buy high end east coast  players and he did a good job.

[basketballjones]

29 minutes ago, Art Vandalay said:

I actually hope we are doing the same because it seems no one cares but I have a hard time believing we are. 

I'd hope we WEREN'T - because if these are the results...... 

[cornfed24-7]

1 minute ago, basketballjones said:

I'd hope we WEREN'T - because if these are the results...... 

I was literally just typing the same comment but stopped to read yours.

[cornfed24-7]

33 minutes ago, Art Vandalay said:

I actually hope we are doing the same

If we were I don't know if I could take knowing my team sucks at cheating too.

[Fullbacksympathy]

5 hours ago, basketballjones said:

I know it's the Cardinal sin of this website and Husker-Fandom to say this... But Greg McDermott runs an incredible program and does things the right way. 

 

Did you seriously just make this statement given everything linked to McDermott in the last 2-3 seasons?  He literally purchases players and talks about how they need to stay on the plantation.  There are better examples of people who do things the right way in college basketball.  Wow.  

 

Give Hoiberg a minute to show who he is and what he can do.  He's already more successful as a coach than McDermott will ever be, and he's as high character as a coach can get.  Truly.  

[HuskerFever]

Charles Barkley weighs in:

 

 

[basketballjones]

18 hours ago, LK1 said:

 

Did you seriously just make this statement given everything linked to McDermott in the last 2-3 seasons?  He literally purchases players and talks about how they need to stay on the plantation.  There are better examples of people who do things the right way in college basketball.  Wow.  

 

Give Hoiberg a minute to show who he is and what he can do.  He's already more successful as a coach than McDermott will ever be, and he's as high character as a coach can get.  Truly.  

I made a pretty egregious mistake and error in how I worded what I said. I'll apologize for that but I'll let it up so everyone can keep dragging me. I enjoy the pain. I am a Nebrasketball fan, after all. 

I should have been more specific in saying that I love the basketball part and roster management aspects of the way Coach McDermott runs their program. Admittedly though, I tend to look past most illegal recruiting activity half these schools do because 1. The difference between most programs is some have gotten caught and some haven't and 2. I believe these players should be able to get market value for their skills, so I believe the system enables this poor behavior. 

But to the original point of the post. In my opinion, I hate this style. I hate the way college basketball is getting. And I thoroughly enjoy the programs who have guys who go through their system and stay until junior/senior years. Those are the teams I've chosen to watch and enjoy. I can't stand have to make flashcards each year to learn our roster. My favorite teams of all time are the UNC teams that brought dudes in as freshman and you knew everything about them, and watched them go from failure to National Champions. Obviously that world is gone. Doesn't mean I can't dislike it. 

[Fullbacksympathy]

18 minutes ago, basketballjones said:

I made a pretty egregious mistake and error in how I worded what I said. I'll apologize for that but I'll let it up so everyone can keep dragging me. I enjoy the pain. I am a Nebrasketball fan, after all. 

I should have been more specific in saying that I love the basketball part and roster management aspects of the way Coach McDermott runs their program. Admittedly though, I tend to look past most illegal recruiting activity half these schools do because 1. The difference between most programs is some have gotten caught and some haven't and 2. I believe these players should be able to get market value for their skills, so I believe the system enables this poor behavior. 

But to the original point of the post. In my opinion, I hate this style. I hate the way college basketball is getting. And I thoroughly enjoy the programs who have guys who go through their system and stay until junior/senior years. Those are the teams I've chosen to watch and enjoy. I can't stand have to make flashcards each year to learn our roster. My favorite teams of all time are the UNC teams that brought dudes in as freshman and you knew everything about them, and watched them go from failure to National Champions. Obviously that world is gone. Doesn't mean I can't dislike it. 

 

Appreciate the clarification and what you say makes sense.  

 

On my end, I'm liking the free agency more because it gives Nebraska a chance to compete.  I do miss the nostalgia of the NCAA bluebloods battling in the tournament, but not more than I like Nebraska's chances moving forward.  I also like that players have more power than they used to be in terms of their personal choices.  Once player likeness/image $$ gets ironed out, I'll be thrilled for both the players and Nebraska for our chances at regularly landing big time recruits.  That deregulation will hopefully get rid of the bagman, and I think our dense little market will be able to compete quite well economically (in basketball, football, and volleyball) since we have zero other teams around here.    

[huskerbill85]

Depends on offers, playing time, etc.

 

If I can start a duke or KU no.

 

If my choices with everything said are equal between teams like Illinois, Missouri,  Alabama, etc. I'm going Nebraska.

 

I think were starting to get there with the latter. This was something that was really a struggle a decade ago. Now not so much. While we haven't had the success we'd like I think the progress is undeniable (making it to the dance, winning 20+ games, getting an elite coach, getting a 5* recruits etc.)

[Art Vandalay]

On 3/29/2021 at 8:58 AM, basketballjones said:

I know it's the Cardinal sin of this website and Husker-Fandom to say this... But Greg McDermott runs an incredible program and does things the right way. 

I think you jinxed him. Two transfers so far including Bishop and rumored to be one more at least. Plus Zegorowski going pro and no seniors returning, they will have a whole  different starting 5.

 

Hopefully the start of a nice downturn where we can get the series lead back.

[Nebrasketballer]

8 minutes ago, Art Vandalay said:

I think you jinxed him. Two transfers so far including Bishop and rumored to be one more at least. Plus Zegorowski going pro and no seniors returning, they will have a whole  different starting 5.

 

Hopefully the start of a nice downturn where we can get the series lead back.

Creighton players that, at this point, are assumed to be leaving:
-Marcus Zegarowski
-Damien Jefferson
-Mitch Ballock
-Denzel Mahoney
-Christian Bishop

-Alex O’Connell

 

Rumblings that one or both of the following may also enter the transfer portal:

-Antwann Jones

-Shereef Mitchell

[Dead Dog Alley]

11 minutes ago, Nebrasketballer said:

Creighton players that, at this point, are assumed to be leaving:
-Marcus Zegarowski
-Damien Jefferson
-Mitch Ballock
-Denzel Mahoney
-Christian Bishop

-Alex O’Connell

 

Rumblings that one or both of the following may also enter the transfer portal:

-Antwann Jones

-Shereef Mitchell

 

No one in the Mitchell family would ever dream of transferring.

 

Except for his dad Alvin.  If he doesn't leave after 97, we have guard depth in 98 and maybe win a couple more games, have a better seed, maybe win a tourney game; we don't have Joe Holmes at PG in 99 and definitely win a couple more and make the tournament; and maybe 2000 wouldn't have been such a train wreck; and maybe we would then remember Barry Collier as the failed ex-coach of the Iowa Hawkeyes or somewhere else.