Support for Yvan

[Norm Peterson]

If you want to dump on Yvan, please don’t use this thread to do it. He’s the only available player we have right now who can D up against Big Ten bigs. We need him.
 

I am wondering what the coaches are doing to help him work on his shooting technique. If you have a chance, watch him shoot free throws. Most players (and by “most“ I mean everybody else) will cock the wrist of their shooting hand as they wind up for the shot. Yvan does not. It’s like a straight line from the back of his hand all the way down his forearm. This means he’s shooting primarily with the muscles of his tricep and shoulder. These are not the muscles where your fine motor touch comes from.

 

If it were me, and I am not a D-1 basketball coach, nor do I play one on TV, I would have him practice shooting one-handed shots down close to the basket, flat-footed or tiptoes, where he focuses on getting his wrist cocked. I believe this may be the reason he gets rejected inside. If you don’t cock your wrist, there is no way to get the ball going upward without moving it more or less behind your head where it can be easily swatted by an opposing player.

 

I’m curious what others have seen. Or what other thoughts people might have. I think Yvan is a good kid with a lot that he brings to the table, but he needs to get this shooting situation figured out. And I’m here to support him.

[cornfed24-7]

He hustles. He looks to me like he leaves it all out on the court every time he plays. I think thats why I like him so much. I like what he brings to the table on D. He looks stronger and able to hold his position better this year. And there is no question in my mind he will get stronger each offseason. He's going to play again a lot this year by default. That experience will pay dividends one day. And hey, I'm a Nebraska Basketball fan, I'm patient. I can wait. Been doin' it for years

[Handy Johnson]

As someone who spent years working with Special Needs students you’ve pointed out the main problem. He needs to work on his fine motor skills. And, the best way to do that IS shooting one handed shots right under the basket. His footwork/balance can be addressed at another time... He doesn’t need to be Lew Alcindor, just Andre Almeida with more “Hops”

[busticket]

I think the coaches need to have Yvan focus on his role and how he best helps the team.  I see a Ben Wallace (minus the shot blocking) type role.  Yvan likely will never have good hands or develop a strong post game.  What he does bring is a strong body and a good rebounding presence.  Yvan helps the team most when he is crashing the boards.  If he gets and offensive rebound and it isn’t an obvious dunk, know your limitations and kick it out.

 

I have always been a play to your strengths advocate.  Yvan does have a few tools where he can help.  And frankly nobody else on the team has them until our other two bigs are back.

[Keenan9595]

The one thing that I keep mulling over is how people have talked about walker and Andre coming in and taking Yvan’s minutes completely.  Don’t get me wrong I’d love to see a three big man rotation that allows fouls to be dispersed and won’t get one guy beat up all season (one thing I’ll always give Yvan credit for when it comes to last season.  Just got beat up and came back day after day.)  walker hasn’t been healthy or played a meaningful game in over two years and even then only averaged 4 points if memory serves me right.  Andre seems more from his high school tape as a stretch 4 who can play the 5 if need be, more like what Lat is doing now, but being a better defender and dribbler.  I’m not so sure he is Taylor made do bang down low in the post all game.  I mostly have just been kind of bummed that the me mentality on this board has been “which guy is going to absorb other guys minutes” I don’t think that helps us as a team to not have a seeker rotation and use all of our talent sets.  IMO. 
 

Second point is that yes Yvan has missed some layups, but can we maybe get him better passes in better positions?  I rewatched Nevada and NDSU and there were at least 5-6 instances where we our guards either needed to take it up themselves or bring it back out to set up the defense and either dumped it to him while double teamed or passed it to him late on a break where he has no reason getting the ball.  It’s just little things I think we will iron out with more playing time and more roles being defined.  We have a real shot to 5-1 and gelling before we go up against Creighton Poojays.

[Huskerpapa]

He's 18 years old.  Think a stronger and more motivated version of Mikey Moore.  Yvan is going to continue to improve.

Shoot, simply look at the beginning of last year to the end of the season.  He improved.   Same goes during this offseason.   Improvement.   

Not everyone can be like most husker fans...perfect...

[tcp]

1 minute ago, Huskerpapa said:

He's 18 years old.  Think a stronger and more motivated version of Mikey Moore.  Yvan is going to continue to improve.

Shoot, simply look at the beginning of last year to the end of the season.  He improved.   Same goes during this offseason.   Improvement.   

Not everyone can be like most husker fans...perfect...

 

that's it for me. he's just 18. he's still got a bit of growing to do. get layups and dunks under control, his primary mission in life should be controlling the paint on D the best he can. it's not like we lack other scorers. 

[Art Vandalay]

4 hours ago, Keenan9595 said:

The one thing that I keep mulling over is how people have talked about walker and Andre coming in and taking Yvan’s minutes completely.  Don’t get me wrong I’d love to see a three big man rotation that allows fouls to be dispersed and won’t get one guy beat up all season (one thing I’ll always give Yvan credit for when it comes to last season.  Just got beat up and came back day after day.)  walker hasn’t been healthy or played a meaningful game in over two years and even then only averaged 4 points if memory serves me right.  Andre seems more from his high school tape as a stretch 4 who can play the 5 if need be, more like what Lat is doing now, but being a better defender and dribbler.  I’m not so sure he is Taylor made do bang down low in the post all game.  I mostly have just been kind of bummed that the me mentality on this board has been “which guy is going to absorb other guys minutes” I don’t think that helps us as a team to not have a seeker rotation and use all of our talent sets.  IMO. 
 

Second point is that yes Yvan has missed some layups, but can we maybe get him better passes in better positions?  I rewatched Nevada and NDSU and there were at least 5-6 instances where we our guards either needed to take it up themselves or bring it back out to set up the defense and either dumped it to him while double teamed or passed it to him late on a break where he has no reason getting the ball.  It’s just little things I think we will iron out with more playing time and more roles being defined.  We have a real shot to 5-1 and gelling before we go up against Creighton Poojays.

Fred has said Walker is our best post player right now. Andre is also a 5, do not see him ever playing the 4 for us unless there is some odd match ups. Fred will not want to have 2 guys on the court who can’t shoot or create for others. Think that is why people wonder about minutes. Guessing one of them will not see much time when all are available.

[Red Don]

Thanks @Norm Peterson.    What are/can the coaches Do to correct Yvan's shooting seems the crux of the problem/solution, instead of 'He'll grow & learn' or 'better positioning' or 'maybe hes just not built for it' reasoning.  I once took a college mate trap-shooting.  He was a rather studious type; not particularly athletic or co-ordinated.  We used one of those spring-enhanced hand guns to launch the clay-pigeons.  Try as he could, he just could Not get the co-ordination, or maybe even the concept, of the wrist action necessary to launch.  Instead he would just try to swing the arm faster, thinking centrifugal force alone would do it. No he never did 'get-it'  but we only went out that one time.

[Nebrasketballer]

35 minutes ago, Art Vandalay said:

Fred has said Walker is our best post player right now. Andre is also a 5, do not see him ever playing the 4 for us unless there is some odd match ups. Fred will not want to have 2 guys on the court who can’t shoot or create for others. Think that is why people wonder about minutes. Guessing one of them will not see much time when all are available.

I was going to post this exact same thing based on Hoiberg press conferences, but you beat me to it.

[Keenan9595]

47 minutes ago, Art Vandalay said:

Fred has said Walker is our best post player right now. Andre is also a 5, do not see him ever playing the 4 for us unless there is some odd match ups. Fred will not want to have 2 guys on the court who can’t shoot or create for others. Think that is why people wonder about minutes. Guessing one of them will not see much time when all are available.

I read where Fred said that, I should have clarified, I’m not doubting he is, I’m just trying to pump the brakes on expectations for a guy who is going 2 years without meaningful minutes.  I’m afraid people read “he is our best post player” and automatically equate that to double digit points a game.  I also agree that Andre is a 5, but I just noticed the way his high school film looks he’s more of a out and run kind of 5 and not that smash mouth down low 5 that we may need.  But I’ve only watched 2 film compilations of him and I’m not saying that isn’t in his game, just curious if other people have seen more stuff that is out there.

 

as far as the minutes stuff is concerned I saw two different posts in the NDSU and Nevada post game threads wanting Thor and yvans minutes to be taken by Stevenson and Andre/walker and I just thought that was kind of ridiculous.  Hopefully I cleaned up my earlier post?  Come conference play we are going to need all of the bodies and fouls down low we can get and I think a solid 3 deep in that position puts us in better shape.

Edited November 29, 2020 by Keenan9595

[Norm Peterson]

I think Hoiberg said Walker is our best at posting up. That's only one aspect of being a post player. And important one, to be sure, but maybe not crucial for this offense. Better question is can he keep opposing bigs from establishing deep position?

[REDitus]

In the NDSU post game Hoiberg said that Yvan has been better at finishing in practice vs games so I am thinking some of it might be mental.  He's probably thinking about it too much.  I thought he was putting it up too hard in the first 2 games and for NDSU he put them up too soft.    I think it's a valid point that the guards should only dish him the ball under the right circumstances.   

[Norm Peterson]

2 hours ago, REDitus said:

In the NDSU post game Hoiberg said that Yvan has been better at finishing in practice vs games so I am thinking some of it might be mental.  He's probably thinking about it too much.  I thought he was putting it up too hard in the first 2 games and for NDSU he put them up too soft.    I think it's a valid point that the guards should only dish him the ball under the right circumstances.   

 

Get him some confidence like calling some high-percentage passing plays for a new QB.

[Brick]

34 minutes ago, Norm Peterson said:

 

Get him some confidence like calling some high-percentage passing plays for a new QB.

That, and you could ask him to do something out of his comfort zone - like an alley-oop. Huge confidence booster with teammates going nuts.

[thrasher31]

When big ten play comes, Yvan will be needed. We still haven't seen any of Andre so he's still a question mark along with Walker. He leaves a lot to be desired offensively, which I agree with, but we open against Wisconsin in big ten play and they start both Ruevers and Potter. Defensively, he's shown the ability to hold his own against these guys. Plus, he got better throughout the year last year, so I'd say the same will happen here. 

[hugh42]

One thing Yvan did very well last season was not fouling a lot when he was defending in the post. We will need him to do this again until we get Andre and Walker back.

[BannedAccount]

This team is way more athletic and talented overall then last year.  Unfortunately there isnt enough quality talent right now but its gonna get better.  I hate to say it but Yvan and Thor right now are liabilities for what this team could become and have to play.  Thor probably shouldnt get as much mins as well as Yvan but right now there arent other options.  Would like to see more productivity for the mins they get. Its early and hopefully things will click for these 2

[49r]

12 hours ago, Norm Peterson said:

If you want to dump on Yvan, please don’t use this thread to do it.

 

Well, it looks like it took exactly 17 responses for someone to completely ignore the purpose of this thread.

 

We gotta get better organized around here...

[basketballjones]

Yvan's biggest issue is it's incredibly difficult to practice the types of shots that he actually gets in a game. He can do Mikan and other lay-up drills all he wants - those will never address what his shots actually look like in a game. 

It's very hard to simulate the guys hanging on you, jump and wait, through hands stuff that he gets. Especially off of offensive rebounds. His lack of height is going to make it very difficult to get clean looks. He needs to play more, simply. Only way to get the looks he gets in game-like situations. 

[Keenan9595]

2 hours ago, coughunter said:

This team is way more athletic and talented overall then last year.  Unfortunately there isnt enough quality talent right now but its gonna get better.  I hate to say it but Yvan and Thor right now are liabilities for what this team could become and have to play.  Thor probably shouldnt get as much mins as well as Yvan but right now there arent other options.  Would like to see more productivity for the mins they get. Its early and hopefully things will click for these 2

Disagree, they obviously aren’t as athletic as some of our guards, but Yvan gives us muscle and size so we don’t have to worry about dropping lat or banton down low and Thor’s off the ball movement and passing makes this team click.  There is a massive difference in ball movement and shot selection when Thor is in the game.  He’s also a solid rebounder and a good defender, I’d also wager there’s maybe 2 guys who are better shooters then him on the floor as well.  IMO

[huskerbill85]

Hes only 18 ideally should have been redshirted but with the situation he was thrown out there. He didnt leave the program like nearly everyone else after last year. Theres some talent there hes just really green so not fair to put expectations on him and whatever production we get is an added plus. 

[Norm Peterson]

10 hours ago, hugh42 said:

One thing Yvan did very well last season was not fouling a lot when he was defending in the post. We will need him to do this again until we get Andre and Walker back.

 

This is an excellent point. I remember everyone worrying that he would be a fouling machine. Turned out not to be the case.

 

And he's actually a better rebounder than I had given him credit for previously. He's shown improvement in catching and leaping for dunks on those quick dishes when we get guard penetration into the paint. He still doesn't have touch around the rim, but if he can keep a possession alive with an offensive rebound and kick-out for an attempt at a three, that's a better overall shot than a post-up anyway.

[REDitus]

10 hours ago, hugh42 said:

One thing Yvan did very well last season was not fouling a lot when he was defending in the post. We will need him to do this again until we get Andre and Walker back.

 

You know I had to catch myself in the NDSU game.  I almost yelled at the tv when Yvan didn't challenge a shot underneath.  He basically stood there  arms straight up & holding his ground.    I then realized that's probably a good play on his part.   When your in the restricted circle, advantage offense.   He is not a shot  blocker so that eliminates the &1 scenario plus the other guy was a good FT shooter so their was no advantage to fouling.

 

Also,  refs whether they like it or not will sometimes let the big muscle guys get fouled more than the little guys.   It's probably because it's harder to notice the fouls due to their strength.  {Years ago (rec game) right before half as the clock ran out  I got a loose ball bouncing around and as I started to bring it up the other team basically hacked both of my forearms to stop me.  I had to use my wrists and flick the ball up underhand.  The ball crawled up and on to the rim, sat there briefly and then rolled off as the buzzer went off.   They blew a whistle for the foul  and I went to the line to get my free shots but the refs took the ball and ran off to get water.   I was confused and the opposing team was laughing.   When the refs came back they told me that I wasn't shooting and that ball flew up to the rim because I was hacked so hard.   I am still pi$$ed about this if you haven't figured it out yet.  

 

Finally,  Yvan's teammates still dish to him on a regular basis.  So they still have some confidence in him which must be coming from what they see in practice as reported before. 

Edited November 30, 2020 by REDitus

[BannedAccount]

9 hours ago, Keenan9595 said:

Disagree, they obviously aren’t as athletic as some of our guards, but Yvan gives us muscle and size so we don’t have to worry about dropping lat or banton down low and Thor’s off the ball movement and passing makes this team click.  There is a massive difference in ball movement and shot selection when Thor is in the game.  He’s also a solid rebounder and a good defender, I’d also wager there’s maybe 2 guys who are better shooters then him on the floor as well.  IMO

I'm saying for the time being they will have to work, but ultimately they are for lack of a better term, is what is not making this team really good.  Yvan is not a shooter and his missed bunnies and free throws could be a liability down the road if he doesnt improve.  Thor is serviceable and a great role player but not sure he deserves to start.  Hopefully with only 8 players they can grow and be more effective with the more talented players.