Year 4

[thrasher31]

2 minutes ago, nustudent said:

Also means we really just need a stretch 4 in the portal 

Yep. Which makes sense with how quiet they've been portal wise so far. Probably have an idea of who or the kind of player they want, just waiting. Could be waiting for the assistant too. 

[Art Vandalay]

1 hour ago, nustudent said:

Also means we really just need a stretch 4 in the portal 

Would love a high scoring stretch 4 but just want a scorer from the portal.. With added size at every other spot I think we could get away with a small 4 (Griesel / Wilcher / Dawson) if we wanted to. Think we need someone to get buckets with the clock running down, not sure who that will be at the moment.

[thrasher31]

7 minutes ago, Art Vandalay said:

Would love a high scoring stretch 4 but just want a scorer from the portal.. With added size at every other spot I think we could get away with a small 4 (Griesel / Wilcher / Dawson) if we wanted to. Think we need someone to get buckets with the clock running down, not sure who that will be at the moment.

Griesel is a guy who fits that bill a bit, but he's a more all around guy who impacts in other ways. Getting a natural scorer at the 4 might be a bit hard to get as that's a hot target for a lot of teams

[nustudent]

1 hour ago, Art Vandalay said:

Would love a high scoring stretch 4 but just want a scorer from the portal.. With added size at every other spot I think we could get away with a small 4 (Griesel / Wilcher / Dawson) if we wanted to. Think we need someone to get buckets with the clock running down, not sure who that will be at the moment.

I can see why.   But I’d be skeptical that we can find that guy from the portal without it being a volume type guy.   We’ve had that.  We need some chemistry to start.  

[royalfan]

Would really help if Wilcher really bought in and found a way to be able to defend the 4 position in a traditional big ten alignment for 12-15 minutes.  I realize he is undersized to do so, but can see him having the body type to do it if he really takes it as a challenge. 

[AuroranHusker]

13 minutes ago, royalfan said:

Would really help if Wilcher really bought in and found a way to be able to defend the 4 position in a traditional big ten alignment for 12-15 minutes.  I realize he is undersized to do so, but can see him having the body type to do it if he really takes it as a challenge. 

 

Yeah, you said it, defense has been a challenge for CJ. Oh wait, you were saying Wilcher should take on a challenge to play competitive D.  (I agree with the 'D up at the 4' notion...) 

[hhcmatt]

What type or style of defense do people think would pair well with Hoiberg's offense and/or the roster we've compiled?

[thrasher31]

14 minutes ago, hhcmatt said:

What type or style of defense do people think would pair well with Hoiberg's offense and/or the roster we've compiled?

Still missing at least 1 starter, 2 pending treys decision. 

 

But a packline won't work for one due to no rim protector. Walker is fine at it, but that's not his strength. 

 

A ball pressure defense could work with a hedge philosophy. All depends how the 4 looks. If he has defensive awareness and can rotate to tag the roller, or stay home if he's on shooter, it can work

 

A drop scheme could work too with a fight over/under screen depending on shooter

 

Zone schemes all depend on who that final piece is. 

[HuscurAdam]

2 hours ago, hhcmatt said:

What type or style of defense do people think would pair well with Hoiberg's offense and/or the roster we've compiled?

 

The pack line that we currently run has always been a poor fit to pair with Fred’s system and its inherent trade-off of size for skill.  A ball pressure defense would mesh better by creating more opportunities for turnovers to run off of. If you’re going to give up some mismatches no matter what, might as well try to maximize transition opportunities. However, no defense is going to be effective unless we get more athletic on the perimeter, with the classic 3 & D guy being a glaring hole in our lineup. Trey could be that guy if he could knock down 38%.

[Norm Peterson]

Someone help me:

 

1. Sam Griesel

2. Blaise Keita

3. Jamarques Lawrence

4. Ramel Lloyd

5. Denim Dawson

6. Quaran McPherson

7. CJ Wilcher

8. Wilhelm Breidenbach

9. Oleg Kojenets

10. Keisei Tominaga

11. Trey McGowens

12. Lat Mayen

13. Derrick Walker

 

 

Unless someone else moves out, our roster is full up, right?

 

Are we still out recruiting like there will be more spots to fill?

 

If so, whose?

 

And, by the way, that's a really young team. Again.

[thrasher31]

1 minute ago, Norm Peterson said:

Someone help me:

 

1. Sam Griesel

2. Blaise Keita

3. Jamarques Lawrence

4. Ramel Lloyd

5. Denim Dawson

6. Quaran McPherson

7. CJ Wilcher

8. Wilhelm Breidenbach

9. Oleg Kojenets

10. Keisei Tominaga

11. Trey McGowens

12. Lat Mayen

13. Derrick Walker

 

 

Unless someone else moves out, our roster is full up, right?

 

Are we still out recruiting like there will be more spots to fill?

 

If so, whose?

 

And, by the way, that's a really young team. Again.

The expectation is lat is gone right now. Keisei is probably on the fence. Trey is trending in the right direction of coming back and Walker looks like he's coming back. So just 1 scholarship to fill

[basketballjones]

5 hours ago, hhcmatt said:

What type or style of defense do people think would pair well with Hoiberg's offense and/or the roster we've compiled?

If Hoiberg truly wants to play fast and get the ball out and go - he needs to stay away from Pack line style and even the switching stuff in my opinion. I feel like pack line and (if executed) quality switching teams force longer offensive possessions. And that isn't necessarily what we want... right? 

To me he needs to create a little more chaos and eliminate open 3's schematically. Everything needs to be forcing tough, flying in, shots at the rim - it's the most missed shot in basketball. This isn't necessarily "my philosophy" but what I feel would pair best with what he wants to do offensively. 

The ball is easier to get out of the rim and advanced off of made lay-ups, and it's easier to get outletted quickly off of missed lay-ups. If he wants pace, this is paramount. 3's lead to long, scramble rebounds which make outlets more difficult. 3's also lead to more offensive guys getting back on D while the ball is in the air. 

We should be a team that doesn't help off "1 pass away" dribble drive help, or ever help from the corners. This will force an emphasis on 1-on-1 defense, but it will create a faster pace. 

Edited March 28, 2022 by basketballjones

[Chuck Taylor]

I wonder how we're going to run Fred's offense with so little offensive firepower. Forget all the "well, he could shoot xx% better this year" stuff and expecting major player development. Seriously, who of this crew gets the ball at the end of the shot clock?

 

Griesel seems like the best bet at this point, only because of experience, because I'm not sure he's going to break down many Big Ten defenders. Wilcher's a good shooter, but he's not going break down anyone off the dribble either.

[Shawn Eichorst's Toupee]

1 hour ago, Norm Peterson said:

Someone help me:

 

1. Sam Griesel

2. Blaise Keita

3. Jamarques Lawrence

4. Ramel Lloyd

5. Denim Dawson

6. Quaran McPherson

7. CJ Wilcher

8. Wilhelm Breidenbach

9. Oleg Kojenets

10. Keisei Tominaga

11. Trey McGowens

12. Lat Mayen

13. Derrick Walker

 

 

Unless someone else moves out, our roster is full up, right?

 

Are we still out recruiting like there will be more spots to fill?

 

If so, whose?

 

And, by the way, that's a really young team. Again.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong (the COVID and transfer changes make me forget who sat out when) but that's

• 2 third-year starters in Derrick and Lat
• 2 fifth-year starters in Trey and Sam (counting Pitt and NDSU)
• 1 guy who played starter's minutes in CJ

To me, it feels like for the first time since Fred's been here that the team will actually be somewhat old.

 

[uneblinstu]

1 hour ago, Norm Peterson said:

Someone help me:

 

1. Sam Griesel  

2. Blaise Keita 

3. Jamarques Lawrence 

4. Ramel Lloyd

5. Denim Dawson

6. Quaran McPherson

7. CJ Wilcher

8. Wilhelm Breidenbach

9. Oleg Kojenets

10. Keisei Tominaga

11. Trey McGowens

12. Lat Mayen

13. Derrick Walker

 

Unless someone else moves out, our roster is full up, right?

 

Are we still out recruiting like there will be more spots to fill?

 

If so, whose?

 

And, by the way, that's a really young team. Again.

I'm guessing Lat leaves and Keisei stays. So, if Trey and Walker come back, the presumed starters of Trey, Walker, Griesel, Blaise and CJ would not be a young group. Then you add in Kiesei who'd be in his 4th year of college basketball. That'd be the most seasoned top 6 since 2018-19. You add in some pretty highly thought of young players after that, but it could sure be a lot worse in terms of experience. Not to mention 8 of those players would have a season in the program already. I guess technically 7 1/2...

Edited March 28, 2022 by uneblinstu

[uneblinstu]

49 minutes ago, Chuck Taylor said:

I wonder how we're going to run Fred's offense with so little offensive firepower. Forget all the "well, he could shoot xx% better this year" stuff and expecting major player development. Seriously, who of this crew gets the ball at the end of the shot clock?

 

Griesel seems like the best bet at this point, only because of experience, because I'm not sure he's going to break down many Big Ten defenders. Wilcher's a good shooter, but he's not going break down anyone off the dribble either.

Sam or CJ. If you can get it to the rim, Walker. 

Edited March 28, 2022 by uneblinstu

[Go Big Fred]

1 hour ago, Norm Peterson said:

Someone help me:

 

1. Sam Griesel

2. Blaise Keita

3. Jamarques Lawrence

4. Ramel Lloyd

5. Denim Dawson

6. Quaran McPherson

7. CJ Wilcher

8. Wilhelm Breidenbach

9. Oleg Kojenets

10. Keisei Tominaga

11. Trey McGowens

12. Lat Mayen

13. Derrick Walker

 

 

Unless someone else moves out, our roster is full up, right?

 

Are we still out recruiting like there will be more spots to fill?

 

If so, whose?

 

And, by the way, that's a really young team. Again.

Lat and Keisei seem to be on the way out, opens up two slots

[uneblinstu]

8 minutes ago, Go Big Fred said:

Lat and Keisei seem to be on the way out, opens up two slots

What are you basing that on for KT?

[Go Big Fred]

2 minutes ago, uneblinstu said:

What are you basing that on for KT?

Just from what I've read id be surprised if he's back next year

[uneblinstu]

5 minutes ago, Go Big Fred said:

Just from what I've read id be surprised if he's back next year

I see. I haven't seen any reporters mention him considering leaving and he seemed to be pretty engaged to the end. I don't think we're going to see any sort of statement from him, he's just gonna still be here when school starts next fall. 

[Norm Peterson]

I will say this might be one of our better recruiting classes in a while. Last year was over-rated.

 

I've seen some film on the two guards and I think they're pretty talented kids with some athleticism that should translate.

 

I'm very worried about Blaise Keita's knees. In what limited action I was able to review of his, it seemed like he was VERY slow running up and down the floor. He looked like he was in pain. He was running like an old man. He did NOT look like the guy he was his freshman year when he lead his team to the juco national title. I'm hoping and assuming he's still in recovery mode and that he'll return to the athletic form he had as a freshman. If that happens, he'll be very good.

 

I think Denim Dawson is really raw. Diving on the floor for loose balls in practice isn't going to get him on the floor.

 

But we have a couple of freshmen and a NDSU transfer who could give us an infusion of quality depth, so there is some slight reason for some optimism. But I am not going to engage in or pay attention to "if they improve to X%" or "team chemistry is better than last year" etc. I am totally in "show me" mode. Some small reason for some optimism, but they're going to have to prove it.

[nustudent]

3 hours ago, Norm Peterson said:

Someone help me:

 

1. Sam Griesel

2. Blaise Keita

3. Jamarques Lawrence

4. Ramel Lloyd

5. Denim Dawson

6. Quaran McPherson

7. CJ Wilcher

8. Wilhelm Breidenbach

9. Oleg Kojenets

10. Keisei Tominaga

11. Trey McGowens

12. Lat Mayen

13. Derrick Walker

 

 

Unless someone else moves out, our roster is full up, right?

 

Are we still out recruiting like there will be more spots to fill?

 

If so, whose?

 

And, by the way, that's a really young team. Again.

Is it really that young though in this day and age of CBB?

 

If the roster returns like that....we will have 5 guys in their 4th year or older of CBB.   Two more in their 3rd.   

 

As a comparison, Wisconsin, who is generally regarded as an older team only had 5 guys who fit that bill this year.

 

It'd be nice to find another experienced guy if Lat, Trey or Keisei end up leaving.   But if Trey stays...between Trey, DW and SG...you have three 5th/6th year players (without seeing who you add).   There aren't a ton of other teams that can say that.

 

While there are 5 freshmen, they are seemingly in the right spots: reserves and roll guys..   If Trey comes back  you are likely starting 4 guys who are in their 3rd year or older.  Again...it doesn't get too much older than that in today's day and age.

[jdw]

1 hour ago, Norm Peterson said:

I will say this might be one of our better recruiting classes in a while. Last year was over-rated.

 

I've seen some film on the two guards and I think they're pretty talented kids with some athleticism that should translate.

 

I'm very worried about Blaise Keita's knees. In what limited action I was able to review of his, it seemed like he was VERY slow running up and down the floor. He looked like he was in pain. He was running like an old man. He did NOT look like the guy he was his freshman year when he lead his team to the juco national title. I'm hoping and assuming he's still in recovery mode and that he'll return to the athletic form he had as a freshman. If that happens, he'll be very good.

 

I think Denim Dawson is really raw. Diving on the floor for loose balls in practice isn't going to get him on the floor.

 

But we have a couple of freshmen and a NDSU transfer who could give us an infusion of quality depth, so there is some slight reason for some optimism. But I am not going to engage in or pay attention to "if they improve to X%" or "team chemistry is better than last year" etc. I am totally in "show me" mode. Some small reason for some optimism, but they're going to have to prove it.

Isn't Keita's problem a foot not a knee.

[hugh42]

1 hour ago, Norm Peterson said:

I will say this might be one of our better recruiting classes in a while. Last year was over-rated.

 

I've seen some film on the two guards and I think they're pretty talented kids with some athleticism that should translate.

 

I'm very worried about Blaise Keita's knees. In what limited action I was able to review of his, it seemed like he was VERY slow running up and down the floor. He looked like he was in pain. He was running like an old man. He did NOT look like the guy he was his freshman year when he lead his team to the juco national title. I'm hoping and assuming he's still in recovery mode and that he'll return to the athletic form he had as a freshman. If that happens, he'll be very good.

 

I think Denim Dawson is really raw. Diving on the floor for loose balls in practice isn't going to get him on the floor.

 

But we have a couple of freshmen and a NDSU transfer who could give us an infusion of quality depth, so there is some slight reason for some optimism. But I am not going to engage in or pay attention to "if they improve to X%" or "team chemistry is better than last year" etc. I am totally in "show me" mode. Some small reason for some optimism, but they're going to have to prove it.

 

I like this class as well and agree that last year's class was overrated, but that is with the benefit of hindsight.

 

Regarding Keita and the way he runs, I think that is just the way he runs. I would agree that he looks like an old man when he's moving up and down the court, but he didn't seem hindered by the injury when he was posting up. I'm hoping that the coaching staff at Coffeyville were just being cautious as to how they were utilizing him and that it wasn't related to the injury.

 

Regarding Dawson, he may be raw but he has something that you can't teach and that is above average athleticism. That combined with his motor will get him on the floor just for his defense. His highlights from this past summer where he was going against better competition gives me hope that his offensive game is progressing and eventually will be a solid contributor on offense as well. Having said this, I'm in the show me camp as well regarding the newcomers and the team in general.

[Huskerpapa]

I am not sure where or how Keisei's name came out.  What I have heard is he will not choose to leave.  Meaning if he leaves it won't be his choice.

What I have heard is that Trey is a fairly heavy lean on returning.   Lat is a lean on leaving.

The deal with both of them is their pro options.  If you recall, that was the situation with Thor.  Once he knew he would have an assured contract, he left.