uneblinstu's postgame chatter: vol 13; ed 8 - @ Wisconsin

[REDitus]

1 hour ago, hhcmatt said:

 

He seems to have a routine.  He noticeably touches his neck as part of this. 

 

Interesting.  Maybe he has a tat that he is touching that means something to him.

 

Anyway, on one of his FT it looked like he got the ball and just fired it up quickly.   If he slowed it down,  maybe he could do the visualization thing.   Take a dribble or two, take a breath, visual the shot or a mechanic, clear your mind and letting it go.   4-5 seconds.  

 

I wonder if he was a good FT in Juco because he shot so much he was dialed in.  Maybe he isn't getting dialed in due to reduced number of shots. 

[BannedAccount]

2 minutes ago, REDitus said:

 

Interesting.  Maybe he has a tat that he is touching that means something to him.

 

Anyway, on one of his FT it looked like he got the ball and just fired it up quickly.   If he slowed it down,  maybe he could do the visualization thing.   Take a dribble or two, take a breath, visual the shot or a mechanic, clear your mind and letting it go.   4-5 seconds.  

 

I wonder if he was a good FT in Juco because he shot so much he was dialed in.  Maybe he isn't getting dialed in due to reduced number of shots. 

I think it has to do with his kid on his neck

[tcp]

31 minutes ago, REDitus said:

 

Interesting.  Maybe he has a tat that he is touching that means something to him.

 

Anyway, on one of his FT it looked like he got the ball and just fired it up quickly.   If he slowed it down,  maybe he could do the visualization thing.   Take a dribble or two, take a breath, visual the shot or a mechanic, clear your mind and letting it go.   4-5 seconds.  

 

I wonder if he was a good FT in Juco because he shot so much he was dialed in.  Maybe he isn't getting dialed in due to reduced number of shots. 

 

This happens to hockey goalies all the time. many goalies need to take a lot of shots to keep sharp, otherwise they start napping a bit. as an old Red Wings fan, that was one of their long-time achilles heels: finding a goalie that could handle being lonely for minutes on end because their defense was so good as to prevent shots from getting on net. 

 

when I played basketball as a kid (not my primary sport), I could only handle so much rust in a game before I just lost all sense of rhythm. 

[HB]

31 minutes ago, coughunter said:

I think it has to do with his kid on his neck

 

Well, a similar concept really worked for Jeff Hornacek.   So far not so much for Teddy.

[hhcmatt]

Post Game presser

 

Didn't mention Webster.

Hoiberg did mention that he thought "Teddy is falling off the line a little bit instead of finishing his shot" in regards to FTs.

 

 

[huskerbill85]

After watching this game can anyone tell me what Thorb does? I think calling him a JAG might be an overstatement at this point. That game showed this team needs some leadership when things get dicey and I'd expect that from the longest tenured player on the roster but I didnt see him do anything. 

[huskerbaseball13]

1 hour ago, huskerbill85 said:

After watching this game can anyone tell me what Thorb does? I think calling him a JAG might be an overstatement at this point. That game showed this team needs some leadership when things get dicey and I'd expect that from the longest tenured player on the roster but I didnt see him do anything. 

As horrible as Thor has been, apparently we don’t have anybody to replace him. I thought maybe Shamiel would get that chance but his minutes are dwindling. 
 

Per Robin Washut the analytics show had we made the shots we should have we win by 1 yesterday. Easier said than done in the conference this year but Atleast somehow encouraging.  The rest of the year should be about development and finding our key pieces for a run next year hopefully. Not sure what kind of turnover we will have but you look around the league and the teams having success have experienced players who have been together for years. 

[Jugular]

6 hours ago, Norm Peterson said:

 

Really? Why? I looked at the roster going into this year and looked at their historical 3-point shooting numbers and thought, "here we go again."

 

I really don't think we'll have adequate shooters for this offense until next year.

Well, he spoke VERY highly of Lat. He’s struggled terribly since the first couple games. Thor has been rough. I wasn’t expecting much from Shamiel and he’s been somehow less than what I was expecting. Not sure why they let him shoot jump shots.
 

Teddy has been OK, but what did he shoot on FT’s in JC last year...90%? His footwork on his shot seems odd compared to last year’s film too. Hell, he looked leaner and more explosive in JC too. Look at the film...he had an actual JUMPER last year. 
 

 

Edited December 23, 2020 by Jugular

[Nebrasketball1979]

41 minutes ago, Jugular said:

Well, he spoke VERY highly of Lat. He’s struggled terribly since the first couple games. Thor has been rough. I wasn’t expecting much from Shamiel and he’s been somehow less than what I was expecting. Not sure why they let him shoot jump shots.
 

Teddy has been OK, but what did he shoot on FT’s in JC last year...90%? His footwork on his shot seems odd compared to last year’s film too. Hell, he looked leaner and more explosive in JC too. Look at the film...he had an actual JUMPER last year. 
 

 

Weird and agree that mechanics look different and that it's like your watching a different player.  I also agree that it looks like he has bulked up.

[hhcmatt]

7 hours ago, Norm Peterson said:

 

Really? Why? I looked at the roster going into this year and looked at their historical 3-point shooting numbers and thought, "here we go again."

 

I really don't think we'll have adequate shooters for this offense until next year.

 

17 hours ago, millerhusker said:

Agreed on all points. 

Teddy's usage rate is higher than Luka Garza's is for Iowa. And he's obviously much less efficient than Garza. Nobody on Wisconsin's team has a usage rate anywhere near Teddy's. For an NBA comparison, his usage rate is greater than Damian Lillard's (a lead guard who had to carry his team) was last year for the Blazers. This isn't ideal for Hoiberg's offense.

 

 

If you sort of combine these together HCFH's Iowa St teams shot in the neighborhood of 36% from three and 3 of his 5 teams had future NBA draft picks taking the most shots. (Royce White-1, Georges Niang-2).  The shooting just hasn't been there for us and Teddy is probably a G-League guy at best.  Ideally Banton should be first or a close 2nd in usage but no idea if that would result in us being better or worse.

[REDitus]

2 hours ago, Jugular said:

His footwork on his shot seems odd compared to last year’s film too. Hell, he looked leaner and more explosive in JC too. 

 

Wow.  Thanks for posting the video.  It is different.  I thought he was always doing that odd little scissor kick but he wasn't.   Interesting, I wonder if it's a way to keep him going straight up on his jump vs falling back or jumping forward. 

[millerhusker]

3 hours ago, Jugular said:

Well, he spoke VERY highly of Lat. He’s struggled terribly since the first couple games. Thor has been rough. I wasn’t expecting much from Shamiel and he’s been somehow less than what I was expecting. Not sure why they let him shoot jump shots.
 

Teddy has been OK, but what did he shoot on FT’s in JC last year...90%? His footwork on his shot seems odd compared to last year’s film too. Hell, he looked leaner and more explosive in JC too. Look at the film...he had an actual JUMPER last year. 
 

 

His upper and lower body mechanics,  and his balance were pretty atrocious on his jump shot (it’s still not great). Upper body leans back and lower body kicks his legs out. It’s a two motion shot, so it’s slower than his set shot, which is one motion. It’s a jump shot, but he doesn’t have the ability to elevate much. He would not be able to get that shot off consistently at this level. You can tell Hoiberg has worked with him to make his shot more compact. The leg thing is probably because he’s so used to fading away and kicking his legs out (right leg further than the left in the video) on his jump shot.

[Jugular]

3 hours ago, millerhusker said:

His upper and lower body mechanics,  and his balance were pretty atrocious on his jump shot (it’s still not great). Upper body leans back and lower body kicks his legs out. It’s a two motion shot, so it’s slower than his set shot, which is one motion. It’s a jump shot, but he doesn’t have the ability to elevate much. He would not be able to get that shot off consistently at this level. You can tell Hoiberg has worked with him to make his shot more compact. The leg thing is probably because he’s so used to fading away and kicking his legs out (right leg further than the left in the video) on his jump shot.

Good info. Do you think he looks less athletic/explosive? I think he looked leaner last season.

[millerhusker]

18 minutes ago, Jugular said:

Good info. Do you think he looks less athletic/explosive? I think he looked leaner last season.

I really don’t know. I’ve seen guys do in-game windmill dunks in high school, but be below the rim players in college. It’s hard for me to tell whose athleticism can translate to the next level. Must not have an eye for it. 

[OurDecay]

Late to this discussion but a couple things worth mentioning from that box score:

 

- Wisconsin went 8-26 from 3.  We went 8-27.  Both teams shot poorly from three but made the same number.  Point is, technically not the difference in the game.

 

- Wisconsin went 15-of-15 from the FT line. Hadn’t seen anybody mention that.  Gotta just tip the cap on that.

 

- Banton, Allen and McGowens combined to shoot 7-of-12 from 3PT range, and all three scored in double figures.  Yvan might have played as good as he ever has.  He went 3-4 from the field...which is news.  So, 4 of your starters did some good things.  Banton, Yvan and McGowens combined for 20 rebounds!  
 

- Conversely, our bench combined to score 4 total points on 1-of-12 (!!!) shooting before Andre’s basket in the last minute of the game.  You just can’t have Webster score zero points.

[Jacob Padilla]

I definitely think some people are too down on Teddy in this thread.

 

If the floor-spacers like Thorbjarnarson and Mayen were hitting shots, then maybe more ball movement and set plays would be a better option. But they're throwing up bricks. McGowens creating offense isn't going very well at all, Nebraska obviously doesn't have an interior option and Webster has been incredibly hot and cold. 

 

Dalano and Teddy are the two guys that can create offense with any sort of consistent efficiency, and Teddy's better at it in the halfcourt when it doesn't really look like there's much there than anyone else. How many times when Teddy forces up something do you think Nebraska would actually create a better shot from someone else? Tough to say.

 

Nebraska just doesn't have enough guys playing well right now, and the overall offense is suffering because of it. Disregarding Andre and Lakes because of the small sample size, Webster and Banton are the only ones ahead of Allen in terms of eFG%, and Webster's is on a much smaller sample size; it seems like Kobe's been mostly an all-or-nothing player recently (20 on 9 shots against GT, 5 on 9 possessions against CU, 12 on 7 shots against Doane, 0 on 3 shots against Wisconsin). The free-throw shooting is absolutely a problem and he needs to find a way to get it fixed; if he was even shooting 76% (which would equal six more makes so far) he'd be right with Banton in terms of TS% at around 56-57%.

 

Basically, I think some of the way Teddy is playing is more a result than a cause. If guys start hitting shots around him or another playmaker emerges, then I think we can focus in more on Teddy's issues. 

[throwback]

5 hours ago, Jacob Padilla said:

I definitely think some people are too down on Teddy in this thread.

 

If the floor-spacers like Thorbjarnarson and Mayen were hitting shots, then maybe more ball movement and set plays would be a better option. But they're throwing up bricks. McGowens creating offense isn't going very well at all, Nebraska obviously doesn't have an interior option and Webster has been incredibly hot and cold. 

 

Dalano and Teddy are the two guys that can create offense with any sort of consistent efficiency, and Teddy's better at it in the halfcourt when it doesn't really look like there's much there than anyone else. How many times when Teddy forces up something do you think Nebraska would actually create a better shot from someone else? Tough to say.

 

Nebraska just doesn't have enough guys playing well right now, and the overall offense is suffering because of it. Disregarding Andre and Lakes because of the small sample size, Webster and Banton are the only ones ahead of Allen in terms of eFG%, and Webster's is on a much smaller sample size; it seems like Kobe's been mostly an all-or-nothing player recently (20 on 9 shots against GT, 5 on 9 possessions against CU, 12 on 7 shots against Doane, 0 on 3 shots against Wisconsin). The free-throw shooting is absolutely a problem and he needs to find a way to get it fixed; if he was even shooting 76% (which would equal six more makes so far) he'd be right with Banton in terms of TS% at around 56-57%.

 

Basically, I think some of the way Teddy is playing is more a result than a cause. If guys start hitting shots around him or another playmaker emerges, then I think we can focus in more on Teddy's issues. 

Well said - you have to give him a chance to show that he's a willing passer, but when your top 3-pt shooters go 1-for-14, with quite a few really good looks in those 13 misses, your better scoring option is him on a drive.

 

He's played a lot of basketball in a lot of places, and he knows forcing it up in traffic is not the best shot. But until we can force a defense to respect our 3 pt shooters, there aren't going to be many other options.  

 

To be fair, he's also learning on the fly, like Lat. With his previous D-1 experience, his learning curve should be shorter than a typical juco, but he hasn't played competitive D-1 basketball in 2 seasons. You have to give him some time.

 

I see a player who just wants to win above all else. Yes, he has some issues with shot selection and emotion on the court. But when you have that high level drive to win, that's a great place to start. The rest can be worked on.

 

Bottom line - If/when we have some additional/better scoring options, then it's fair to critique Teddy's shot selection, etc. Right now, our other scoring options are almost non-existent. I believe when/if we see a couple of guys get it going from 3, Teddy's perceived decision making and his overall game will be seen with a far different eye.

 

[TourneyBound]

20 hours ago, huskerbill85 said:

After watching this game can anyone tell me what Thorb does? I think calling him a JAG might be an overstatement at this point. That game showed this team needs some leadership when things get dicey and I'd expect that from the longest tenured player on the roster but I didnt see him do anything. 

 

Not to pile on but I did notice Thor's +/- was -22 against Wisconsin.....

[millerhusker]

Feel like I need to clarify a bit, as it probably seems like I’m trying to dog on Teddy. Pointing out that an individual’s usage rate is too high is just as much of an indictment on the team as a whole as it is on one player. I actually never said Teddy shoots it too much. Usage rate also factors in free throws, turnovers and minutes. Right now, Teddy has the 16th highest usage rate in the country. He has definitely forced it at times where kickouts are there. But maybe Dalano and Kobe need to be more aggressive (they have the the highest O-ratings on the team and it’s not really close). Maybe we need to emphasize different things on offense. My whole point has been, having a high volume - low efficiency type of player with that high of a usage rate will not lead to more wins than losses against quality teams. 

[uneblinstu]

Teddy played 25 minutes. Definitely felt closer to 12-15 while I was watching it. I hope he can get a few games where he can stay out of foul trouble.

[HB]

9 hours ago, Jacob Padilla said:

I definitely think some people are too down on Teddy in this thread.

 

If the floor-spacers like Thorbjarnarson and Mayen were hitting shots, then maybe more ball movement and set plays would be a better option. But they're throwing up bricks. McGowens creating offense isn't going very well at all, Nebraska obviously doesn't have an interior option and Webster has been incredibly hot and cold. 

 

 

And that seems to be how Fred wants it (perhaps its just that we haven't recruited to that yet, or Walker and Andre will bring it, but I always hear about the "5 out" stuff) .   Not sure that ever works in this league.   Northwestern's big, Ryan Young, was impressive last night.  Seemed to open up the offense from what I saw.  

[jimmykc]

And with a tinge of homer paranoia, it seems to me that the zebras are keeping a "special" eye on Teddy and conspiring to call at least one offensive foul on him early on just to "send a message" while established stars like Davison could bring a crowbar to the court and get away with it. 

[Huskerone]

Scanning the thread here and didn't see anything on the two new eligible players Lakes and Andre.  Full disclosure I only watched the first half and didn't see Andre play.  Lakes, looked a bit slow on Defense, maybe still getting up to game speed?

[hskr4life]

1 hour ago, Huskerone said:

Scanning the thread here and didn't see anything on the two new eligible players Lakes and Andre.  Full disclosure I only watched the first half and didn't see Andre play.  Lakes, looked a bit slow on Defense, maybe still getting up to game speed?

I actually thought Lakes was a little better on the D end than I expected.  Pretty active and goes hard for rebounds.  Anything we get from him

outside of 3’s is icing on the cake.

[hhcmatt]

4 hours ago, HB said:

 

And that seems to be how Fred wants it (perhaps its just that we haven't recruited to that yet, or Walker and Andre will bring it, but I always hear about the "5 out" stuff) .   Not sure that ever works in this league.   Northwestern's big, Ryan Young, was impressive last night.  Seemed to open up the offense from what I saw.  

 

John Beilein very much made this work