Charleston Classic: Success or Failure?

[ladyhusker]

I love the literary references.

 

And I think we won't know the success or failure of the tournament, from a holistic standpoint, for a while yet. If it means we lost two games against better opponents than the random-draw MEAC teams we get at the PBA BUT had a good come-to-Jesus that pulls the team together  (a la Miles' win-the-locker-room bit) then I don't think we can call it anything other than a success. I'll trade two early-season losses to semi-OK (UAB) to legitimately good (UMass) opponents at a neutral court for a potentially more cohesive unit that learned the trust and accountability that helps us sneak out a win or two over conference opponents later in the season.

 

If this was just a hug-it-out team meeting that doesn't result in any changes, though, then the rose-colored glasses can come off. But that's not something we'll see in one game against a not-good SEC team...we'll have to wait and let it play out more, I think, to be able to determine if this was a success or failure.

[Handy Johnson]

The optimist says : the glass is half full

 

The pessimist says : the glass is half empty

 

The exitentialist says : what glass?                                                     Hemingway says: The Sun Also Rises

[Concrete]

It's way too early to tell, but if I had to make a pick right now I would say it was a success.  I'm basing this on our performance Sunday vs Thurs/Fri.  We looked like a different team on Sunday- giving effort on both ends of the court, sharing the ball, Tai letting the game come to him rather than trying to force things, etc.  I obviously would've liked us to win more games than we lost in Charleston, but I think it was a great wake up call for our team, i.e. you aren't good enough to just out score teams, you're going to have to play solid basketball within the system offensively and defensively.

 

We also learned a lot about Leslee Smith and the leadership/dedication to winning he brings to the team.

[Dean Smith]

 

 Icedragon: I like the short sentences. They are to the point. Hemingway would be proud.

Faulkner, on the other hand, would have seen the prose of Icedragon and rent his clothes at the thought of so many words wasted through want of use, as though they might atrophy while waiting in the dictionary of the mind, waiting unsummoned, in a purgatory of endless verbiage, forgotten and neglected while brevity doffs his victor's cap and scans the field of battle for the scattered remnants of verbosity, which have taken their leave to nurse their wounds and live to fight another day.

 

I thought about dropping out of college when I was forced to read The Bear.

[bball23]

I love this board....(Actually I really do).  So many complained for years about not playing enough "quality" teams.  Now Miles sets out a decent OOC schedule and some would rather just "get wins"  Miles almost has a way of "beating the system" when it comes to getting a high RPI and SOS.  I'll trust Miles.  Miles made it pretty clear as well that year 2 would be tough.  We have seven new players trying to gel together.  I'm going to go out on a limb and say we look pretty good by the end of the year.  We live in such a "win now" society with social media that everybody wants to win every time out.  We are playing an EXTREMELY young team this year, with a lot of new faces on top of that. Its going to take some time.  I think Miles learned a lot about his team over these 3 games.  I mean, look at what he did in game 3 by going to a zone more.  I bet that he wishes he would have done that vs UAB in the 2H as well....but at least he recognized it quickly and made the adjustment in game 3.  Keeps guys out of foul trouble and also it keeps athletic guards from hopefully getting into the lane easier. 

 

I was disappointed with the UAB loss for sure, but I think we got a hell of a lot more out of this tourney than beating a bunch of cupcakes!

[icedragon101]

Thanks for the feedback.  I am only frustrated because I care. If we make a post season it would make a difference. 

[Norm Peterson]

Nevermind.

[Nighthawk]

Thanks for the feedback.  I am only frustrated because I care. If we make a post season it would make a difference. 

Let me guess...you are going to be calling for coach to be fired if we don't make post season.  All of us care...but getting frustrated this early into the season and this early into the Coach Miles Era is just kind of stupid IMO. Yes...he's done great things at the other schools he was at...but look at this:

2007–2008 Colorado State 7–25 0–16 9th   2008–2009 Colorado State 9–22 4–12 8th   2009–2010 Colorado State 16–16 7–9 5th CBI First Round 2010–2011 Colorado State 19–13 9–7 4th NIT First Round 2011–2012 Colorado State 20–12 8–6 4th

NCAA Second Round

 

It was 3 years before under Coach Miles that Colorado State made post season. 5 years before they made it to the NCAA.  Sit back and enjoy the games with the rest of us. Yes there will be frustrating moments...but there will be amazing moments too.Take a breath and chill out.

[Hooper]

I don't look at the Charleston Classic as a success or a failure. It was a mix of good and bad. Keep in mind that this decision was made over a year ago. Miles didn't know for certain what type of team he'd have this year, or even the full roster of players who would comprise it. It was a bit of a roll of the dice. The Huskers drew a very tough bracket as well, which was unfortunate. 

 

For the first time this season, the team got a chance to face real adversity and the staff got to see how they responded to it. Honestly, I would only consider the CC a failure if the team doesn't show that it learned the lessons of its failures there and made the appropriate modifications. Based on what I've seen and read since UAB, I feel that the team emerged from the CC as a more cohesive unit with a better understanding of what they weren't doing well and what they needed to do in order to improve. This should prove beneficial against the upcoming slate of stronger non-conference opponents. I'd hate to be facing our first real adversity against Miami or Creighton. 

 

Again, I really feel this tournament could only be considered a failure if the lessons learned there are ignored. Hopefully it accelerated the team's development, which is a definite positive.

[Chad A]

In the world of college basketball where the tournaments at the year are what matters - it's better to get beat up early learn some early lessons, than late.  The scheduling was spot on.  That's something Doc's old teams lacked - a good tough non-con tournament (with consecutive days of basketball) where the team has to rely on each other and not just show up at home and beat a cream puff team.  I don't think we saw much improvement from UMASS to UAB because they just had to come back the day.  Now give them a day to decompress - and they came back with a well fought victory two days later doing it right.  Hopefully this sinks in - that play selfishly and out of system and lose.  Play within the system, let the game come to you and have a chance to win.  And that much needed confidence that what we do can work, and we can beat BCS level teams with this concept.

 

1.  Was the Charleston Classic a success or failure? success in long term goals, failure in short term

2.  Was it to much too soon or just what NU needed?  just right... just when we got our hopes up - our dreams were crushed, and for good reason - the selfish basketball will not win you games against good teams

3.  Is Miles making good decisions with scheduling or is he pushing to quickly?  Very good decisions.  You'll find out in our SOS and RPI at end of year when we're a bubble NIT team or looking for the Dance
 
 

[Swan88]

My vote is a qualified "success."  Played good teams, worked through adversity, played the best as a team in the last part of the last game, developed team leadership, went through a steep learning curve on foul issues, saw significant development for Webster toward the end, saw Petteway emerge as a major force, saw Smith's contribution develop dramatically, saw improvement for Shields at the end, etc.  The qualification is this: it's early in the season, and progress is never a straight line--it's still a matter of where they go from here.  

[Ron Mexico]

Assuming the team has learned something from this experience, then I would say it was a success.  I believe this experience will help us grow and play better as a team.  Coach Miles asked the question at the Omaha luncheon today if his team learned more playing in that tournament, or would have learned more playing against three random teams at the PBA.  He believed his team learned more from this tournament...and I have to agree with him.

 

Also, he talked some about what was reported in the paper about the team meeting after the UAB game.  It definitely sounds like Leslee Smith will be one of our team leaders.  He mentioned that Smith called some players out by name, which shocked Miles (Miles also pointed out that Smith talked about mistakes he made himself).  I got the feeling Miles was very happy with what went down amongst the team after that UAB game.

It was great listening to coach Miles speak. I got the feeling that he scheduled this tournament to tests his team metal. He knows that we have a tough road ahead of us and he needed to find find out what this team is made of and find out which players he can go to when the chips are down.

I really liked the X's & O's portion with coach Harriman..

[atskooc]

 

 Icedragon: I like the short sentences. They are to the point. Hemingway would be proud.

Faulkner, on the other hand, would have seen the prose of Icedragon and rent his clothes at the thought of so many words wasted through want of use, as though they might atrophy while waiting in the dictionary of the mind, waiting unsummoned, in a purgatory of endless verbiage, forgotten and neglected while brevity doffs his victor's cap and scans the field of battle for the scattered remnants of verbosity, which have taken their leave to nurse their wounds and live to fight another day.

 

My mother is a fish.

[49r]

 

 Icedragon: I like the short sentences. They are to the point. Hemingway would be proud.

Faulkner, on the other hand, would have seen the prose of Icedragon and rent his clothes at the thought of so many words wasted through want of use, as though they might atrophy while waiting in the dictionary of the mind, waiting unsummoned, in a purgatory of endless verbiage, forgotten and neglected while brevity doffs his victor's cap and scans the field of battle for the scattered remnants of verbosity, which have taken their leave to nurse their wounds and live to fight another day.

 

 

Like Faulkner, Kerouac would have read the prose and, while being appreciative of contemplation involved, he would have felt some of the details, the sights and sounds and emotions that go along with the Charleston Classic to be lacking and Charleston is just a single stop on this crazy road we call life, we're always on the road to the next place.  Maybe Chicago, maybe Minneapolis, Bloomington or Vegas or Maui or even Cancun.  Cancun, with it's sand as white as the snows over Berthoud Pass in January and skies that are so clear and blue you feel you can see into the universe of the soul of God himself.  Cancun is the kind of place where a person can enter the realm of that state of the Mind that hovers between what is real, what is alive, what is a dream, and what is really the truth in Cancun anyway?  Mañana, baby, it's always mañana.

[Silverbacked1]

Dr. Seuss would have had fun at the games, because there wasn't many people there for him to be around.

[jimmykc]

And somewhere Allen Ginsberg gently weeps.

[cipsucks]

And somewhere Allen Ginsberg gently weeps.

 

And somewhere Ruth Bader Ginsberg just shattered another mirror.   Sorry, I'm rather shallow.....

[49r]

And somewhere Allen Ginsberg gently weeps.

 

Yeah, Norm did a way better job on his.  Mine pretty much sucked.  I just liked the concept and wanted to run with it.

 

Sorry, I'll just sit over here in the corner with my dunce cap and let the grownups talk amongst themselves.

 

Somebody want to tacke Steinbeck?

[Norm Peterson]

And somewhere Allen Ginsberg gently weeps.

 

Yeah, Norm did a way better job on his.  Mine pretty much sucked.  I just liked the concept and wanted to run with it.

 

Sorry, I'll just sit over here in the corner with my dunce cap and let the grownups talk amongst themselves.

 

Somebody want to tacke Sallinger?

If you really want to hear about the Charleston Classic, the first thing you'll probably want to know is how Coach Miles scheduled too aggressively and put us in position to face tough teams before we were ready and how we've hurt ourselves with the tough scheduling and all that David Copperfield kind of crap, but I don't feel like going into it, if you want to know the truth.

[trickey]

It's way too early to tell, but if I had to make a pick right now I would say it was a success.  I'm basing this on our performance Sunday vs Thurs/Fri.  We looked like a different team on Sunday- giving effort on both ends of the court, sharing the ball, Tai letting the game come to him rather than trying to force things, etc.  I obviously would've liked us to win more games than we lost in Charleston, but I think it was a great wake up call for our team, i.e. you aren't good enough to just out score teams, you're going to have to play solid basketball within the system offensively and defensively.

 

We also learned a lot about Leslee Smith and the leadership/dedication to winning he brings to the team.

I was at the Omaha lunch with Coach Miles...He expanded on the much reported meeting where Smith got up to talk.

While he mentioned no players by name (it will be easy to figure out) he discussed other players sharing their thoughts.

At the meeting another player got up and admitted he had not yet bought into the system, as he was used to starting and he was still dealing with the switch so he had not fully bought in.

Another player stood up and stated he was aware he was shooting way to much and he needed to work more within the system. He was surprised (eyes opened) when he reviewed the stats sheet.

 

So, it was not so much one player calling others out as it was a group "therapy session" that ended on a very positive note. Smith may have started the boulder down the hill...but others kept it rolling. Miles had intended to read them the riot act of what they needed to know and the players proceeded to stand up and tell him they already knew. Acknowledging out-loud helped them on Sunday to act on their beliefs. The problems worked themselves out. We will see if it is a lesson learned and retained or if some continued reminders need to be given.

 

On a separate subject, I asked Coach Miles about using zone. He stated they did not want to show it before Charleston but they had worked on it quite a bit. It is obvious he is a man defense proponent but he recognizes the need for zone given our lack of big depth and the new rules re:block/charge (which he deplores). He characterizes his zone as a 2-2-1, as he does not want the guards to have to be moving as much as a 2-3 requires, so the forwards come up to assist on the wings. I would characterize it as he accepts it as a necessary evil to be used when necessary, yet avoided as much as possible. (So much for us being the Syracuse of the Plains!)

 

I say, if you learn and remember this much as a team by participating in one tournament it has been a huge success!