unelinstu's postgame chatter: vol 15, ed 17: Illinois

[cornfed24-7]

3 minutes ago, hhcmatt said:

Only 1 more day until we find out if we're back to going to the tourney or we're having a roll call on the Tim Miles era. 

I'm here for ALL of it! 

[hskr4life]

1 hour ago, hhcmatt said:

Only 1 more day until we find out if we're back to going to the tourney or we're having a roll call on the Tim Miles era. 

 

I'll dust off the bubble thread.

[Dead Dog Alley]

 

The thing that hamstrung Miles the most was that he was coaching at the one place where nobody ever wins.

 

[Craytonhater]

2 hours ago, cornfed24-7 said:

Can't speak for Norm, but I'm sure that there are a few others in this board that share these two thoughts.

Sure, at the time Hoiberg > Miles. Looked like a great hire.

Miles was sand bagged by the administration. Not adding more years to his contract looks even more ridiculous today. At a time when length of contract mattered for recruiting.

You start Miles and Hoiberg from the point where the Huskers are today. Pfft Miles has the Huskers in the tournament before Hoiberg does. 

Debateable

[cornfed24-7]

46 minutes ago, Craytonhater said:

Debateable

We've come to the right place then

[Norm Peterson]

4 hours ago, Craytonhater said:

You said you were opposed to firing him because of a defestist attitude of who are we gonna get that is better.  The hire of Fred at the time was more promising then then Barry or Doc as head coaches.

Well, that and the fact we’ve only been over .500 in conference twice this century, both times by Miles.

[49r]

6 minutes ago, Norm Peterson said:

Well, that and the fact we’ve only been over .500 in conference twice this century, both times by Miles.

 

If you add up all of Hoiberg's conference wins during his time at Nebraska, including this year, and applied them all to one season it would make a third.

[49r]

Barely.

[cipsucks]

Since we're watching Back to The Future, lets take the Delorean back to the year 2000.  Had Danny Nee not been fired, he would have a team with Ffriend, Cochran, Bradford and Conklin on it. They would have made the tourney and maybe won a game or two, because he knew how to coach the style of play they would thrive in.  Nee would have retired a few years later being a hero. We never would know the names Collier, Sadler or Miles. Instead, we got Collier who didn't know how to coach players he didn't recruit.  He quit at a time where he screwed us to go after the best coaches.  This is not a knock on Doc or Miles.  This mess started long ago, which I'm sure everyone here agrees with.

[millerhusker]

23 minutes ago, cipsucks said:

Since we're watching Back to The Future, lets take the Delorean back to the year 2000.  Had Danny Nee not been fired, he would have a team with Ffriend, Cochran, Bradford and Conklin on it. They would have made the tourney and maybe won a game or two, because he knew how to coach the style of play they would thrive in.  Nee would have retired a few years later being a hero. We never would know the names Collier, Sadler or Miles. Instead, we got Collier who didn't know how to coach players he didn't recruit.  He quit at a time where he screwed us to go after the best coaches.  This is not a knock on Doc or Miles.  This mess started long ago, which I'm sure everyone here agrees with.

And that was Cookie Belcher's senior year. One of the most underrated Huskers - and Big 12 players - there ever was. Seemed like that team lost a ton of games by one possession. I agree, Nee would've taken them to the tourney. That was one of my favorite groups of players we've had. Darn near teared up a bit on senior night when Kimani Ffriend kissed the court as he was subbed out for the last time. 

[cipsucks]

Miller, he was on my list and I got to typing...  Cookie was phenominal. I remember Nee got in trouble for trying to play him x number of games before he shut him down.  Nee did some bonehead stuff, but never a dull moment.

[AuroranHusker]

56 minutes ago, cipsucks said:

Since we're watching Back to The Future, lets take the Delorean back to the year 2000.  Had Danny Nee not been fired, he would have a team with Ffriend, Cochran, Bradford and Conklin on it. They would have made the tourney and maybe won a game or two, because he knew how to coach the style of play they would thrive in.  Nee would have retired a few years later being a hero. We never would know the names Collier, Sadler or Miles. Instead, we got Collier who didn't know how to coach players he didn't recruit.  He quit at a time where he screwed us to go after the best coaches.  This is not a knock on Doc or Miles.  This mess started long ago, which I'm sure everyone here agrees with.

 

 

'Dollar Bill' Byrne is the primary culprit for the downfall of basketball & football (to a lesser degree), albeit he knew a lot about budgets & profiting off of sports; his own downfall as far as legacy is that he was not a good dude, imho, particularly for the longevity of Husker athletics. He tried to hire Bill Self for basketball but that wasn't happening, then landed on Collier--who did wind up being a better AD than a head coach. For football, Byrne knew he'd be leaving soon enough so he allowed Osborne to dictate his own successor & even how his successor had to have some of his coaches on staff going forward, which wouldn't have been terrible if recruiting had stayed at a very high level. Alas, it was Byrne who ought to be known as the centrifugal force that led to a downward spiral at NU. Tbh, he seemed more like a shyster than a genuine individual.

 

 

 

 

[Craytonhater]

4 hours ago, Norm Peterson said:

Well, that and the fact we’ve only been over .500 in conference twice this century, both times by Miles.

So you just settle and dont want more?  Thats an Iowa fb mentality.  Keeping someone who made 1 tourney luckily and more often finished in the bottom 4 is not worth keeping IMO.  With the $, fan support, resources, etc., this program should strive to be better and they finally did with Fred.  Unfortunately he was behind the current game and waited till year 4 to play a style that works while you build consistancy.

[Cowboy Kermit]

On 1/10/2023 at 11:48 PM, brfrad said:

My biggest wish for this team is to have an underclassman PG.  Someone who can learn to distribute the ball, and take care of the ball.  A Glenn Watson or Chucky Hepburn.  One of our biggest misses was losing out on Chucky.

They have an underclassman PG, he just happened to choose to redshirt this season. Still super odd to me

[Craytonhater]

2 hours ago, AuroranHusker said:

 

 

'Dollar Bill' Byrne is the primary culprit for the downfall of basketball & football (to a lesser degree), albeit he knew a lot about budgets & profiting off of sports; his own downfall as far as legacy is that he was not a good dude, imho, particularly for the longevity of Husker athletics. He tried to hire Bill Self for basketball but that wasn't happening, then landed on Collier--who did wind up being a better AD than a head coach. For football, Byrne knew he'd be leaving soon enough so he allowed Osborne to dictate his own successor & even how his successor had to have some of his coaches on staff going forward, which wouldn't have been terrible if recruiting had stayed at a very high level. Alas, it was Byrne who ought to be known as the centrifugal force that led to a downward spiral at NU. Tbh, he seemed more like a shyster than a genuine individual.

 

 

 

 

My understanding was Bill wanted to go outside and go after Mack Brown.  TO didnt allow it and convinced Frank to be the guy hence the downfall

[Faux Mike Peltz]

All this TO ruined the football program by hand selecting Frank and TO was a meddler is a bunch of BS. This seems to be a popular theory on Husker Twitter started by some 30 and under aged fans that didn’t get to see the 90’s dominance.  I was very much in it at the time and TO had just strung the greatest 5 year run in college football history, playing for four national titles, winning 3, and going 60-3. He could’ve named Nancy his successor and nobody would’ve questioned it. He built the program and dynasty on consistency and had the longest tenured assistant coaching staff in the nation. When he gave the reigns to Frank and all the assistants stayed, that was viewed as a VERY GOOD thing as the program was absolutely rolling. It saddens me that so many younger fans didn’t live thru our dominant run and therefore don’t know the impact TO had on our program other than thru reading about it. Ok, imma hang up now and listen…

[AuroranHusker]

3 hours ago, Craytonhater said:

My understanding was Bill wanted to go outside and go after Mack Brown.  TO didnt allow it and convinced Frank to be the guy hence the downfall

 

Interesting. . .

 

 

[AuroranHusker]

1 hour ago, Faux Mike Peltz said:

All this TO ruined the football program by hand selecting Frank and TO was a meddler is a bunch of BS. This seems to be a popular theory on Husker Twitter started by some 30 and under aged fans that didn’t get to see the 90’s dominance.  I was very much in it at the time and TO had just strung the greatest 5 year run in college football history, playing for four national titles, winning 3, and going 60-3. He could’ve named Nancy his successor and nobody would’ve questioned it. He built the program and dynasty on consistency and had the longest tenured assistant coaching staff in the nation. When he gave the reigns to Frank and all the assistants stayed, that was viewed as a VERY GOOD thing as the program was absolutely rolling. It saddens me that so many younger fans didn’t live thru our dominant run and therefore don’t know the impact TO had on our program other than thru reading about it. Ok, imma hang up now and listen…

 

FWIW, I lived the 90s and even attended the Huskers blasting Spurrier's Fun-N-Gun in Tempe. I still think Dollar Bill is the one to blame for how Husker Hoops slid and a much lesser degree as to how the football program went down a path that probably wasn't the best outcome as far as continuing the longevity of the 'highest highs' that Osborne ended his 25-year tenure. It's all a matter of opinion, of course, as a lot of folks blame Eichorst or Pedersen, but I believe the initial rumblings of NU's downfall in the men's primary sports had started before either of those two schmucks.

 

 

[jimmykc]

13 hours ago, cipsucks said:

Since we're watching Back to The Future, lets take the Delorean back to the year 2000.  Had Danny Nee not been fired, he would have a team with Ffriend, Cochran, Bradford and Conklin on it. They would have made the tourney and maybe won a game or two, because he knew how to coach the style of play they would thrive in.  Nee would have retired a few years later being a hero. We never would know the names Collier, Sadler or Miles. Instead, we got Collier who didn't know how to coach players he didn't recruit.  He quit at a time where he screwed us to go after the best coaches.  This is not a knock on Doc or Miles.  This mess started long ago, which I'm sure everyone here agrees with.

I managed to steal keys to the DeLorean and went back a couple of more years to that game against Colorado where Dave Hoppen messed up his knee and warned him not to play that day. Moe's team still went to the NCAA but was able to beat Western Kentucky and eventually, with Hoppen leading the way, reached the sweet 16. He never got fired and went on to coach at NU for more than a decade. When he retired, another young, defensive-minded assistant from UTEP took his place by the name of ....Doc Sadler. 

[Swan88]

9 hours ago, Faux Mike Peltz said:

All this TO ruined the football program by hand selecting Frank and TO was a meddler is a bunch of BS. 

The biggest mistake Tom Osborne made in the transition to Frank Solich is this: Tom needed to step into the Athletic Director role first (or simultaneously with that transition) so he could protect Frank's position.  By failing to do so, Tom left Frank at the mercy of others.

Edited January 13, 2023 by Swan88

[Art Vandalay]

10 hours ago, Faux Mike Peltz said:

All this TO ruined the football program by hand selecting Frank and TO was a meddler is a bunch of BS. This seems to be a popular theory on Husker Twitter started by some 30 and under aged fans that didn’t get to see the 90’s dominance.  I was very much in it at the time and TO had just strung the greatest 5 year run in college football history, playing for four national titles, winning 3, and going 60-3. He could’ve named Nancy his successor and nobody would’ve questioned it. He built the program and dynasty on consistency and had the longest tenured assistant coaching staff in the nation. When he gave the reigns to Frank and all the assistants stayed, that was viewed as a VERY GOOD thing as the program was absolutely rolling. It saddens me that so many younger fans didn’t live thru our dominant run and therefore don’t know the impact TO had on our program other than thru reading about it. Ok, imma hang up now and listen…

This is so true and the person most responsible for our position today is Harvey Pearlman, terrible person.

[Huskerpapa]

Frank made a tactical error retaining certain assistants that had lost their motivation to be all-around coaches.  By the time that was realized, and changes were made, Frank was a goner.  I also understand that a couple off the field issues also played a part.

[Norm Peterson]

5 minutes ago, Huskerpapa said:

Frank made a tactical error retaining certain assistants that had lost their motivation to be all-around coaches.  By the time that was realized, and changes were made, Frank was a goner.  I also understand that a couple off the field issues also played a part.

 

If I'm not mistaken, that kid should be in college by now.

[Norm Peterson]

15 hours ago, cipsucks said:

Miller, he was on my list and I got to typing...  Cookie was phenominal. I remember Nee got in trouble for trying to play him x number of games before he shut him down.  Nee did some bonehead stuff, but never a dull moment.

 

You also forgot Louis Truscott.

[Norm Peterson]

13 hours ago, Craytonhater said:

So you just settle and dont want more?  Thats an Iowa fb mentality.  Keeping someone who made 1 tourney luckily and more often finished in the bottom 4 is not worth keeping IMO.  With the $, fan support, resources, etc., this program should strive to be better and they finally did with Fred.  Unfortunately he was behind the current game and waited till year 4 to play a style that works while you build consistancy.

 

Listen, you're attacking me with strawman arguments. I'm not going to respond to this. Anyone can search what I said at the time. Time has proven that what I said back then was right. Miles was a better coach than we gave him credit for and he was being hamstrung by the AD's office. Go look at what Tim Miles is doing this year.