What we thinking

[TourneyBound]

Curious where the board is right now on their opinion of Hoiberg and what should be done.

[tcp]

It's becoming like an AA meeting these days around here. 

 

"Hi,, I'm (.......) and I'm a Nebrasketcase fan. Please,  save me. I can't cheer like this again."

[aphilso1]

I said bring him back, but that's really just for logistics reasons.  Hoiberg has a big buyout.  There's about an 80% chance that we're looking for a football coach within the year, and football is the biggest revenue generator by a huge margin.  It just makes sense that Trev will give Hoiberg another year so that he can pinch pennies for next November's football coaching search.  That's not a vote of confidence for Fred, but sometimes business makes you do things you don't want to.

Edited January 10, 2022 by aphilso1

[Navin R. Johnson]

I think you bring him back.  The roster looks like it will turnover quit a bit either way and although it looks bad now, you can turn basketball around faster than say football.  The part that is most concerning is the effort or lack there of by the players.  

[busticket]

23 minutes ago, Navin R. Johnson said:

The part that is most concerning is the effort or lack there of by the players.  

This is actually why I voted don’t bring him back.  This is extremely concerning to me.  That is a culture problem.

 

That said, I interpreted the question as if money were not a factor.  Realistically, from a business perspective our hands are tied and we have to bring him back.  That is an insane amount of money to pay someone for their horrible performance.  We likely have to ride it out a little bit to make fiscal sense.

[cornfed24-7]

Time to part ways. I my view there is nothing you can state to support bringing him back except a large buyout. 

[Bugeaters1]

I voted wait and see

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[hskr4life]

I voted undecided.  Not that I have a ton of confidence in us turning it around, but the logistical side of things tells me there’s more to take into account than W’s and L’s.

 

However, we can’t keep going the direction we’re going, even when taking into account the money issue.  We’re going to have to show SOMETHING or I could see it going either way.  If we come back here and win 4-6 games, I think it’s an easy decision considering money.  Crazy that 10-12 wins in year three makes it an “easy decision” but that’s the state of where things stand both on the court and off (in terms of money and buyouts).

[Donkey]

From what I have been told, Hoiberg may be ready to retire.  I can easily see it being a mutual decision.  Who would take over is a complete unknown; however, I would love to see LaVall Jordan as the coach.  He has BIG experience as an assistant and has 5 seasons in the Big East.

[Cazzie22]

I voted to retain him but have been surprised and disappointed in the results.  I had hoped for a mid level ranking in the conference but we appear consigned to the basement.  We need to be doing our research on a young, energetic, charismatic coach to eventually take the job. If Fred retires I think he could be an asset somewhere in the Athletic Department.

[colhusker]

3 hours ago, Navin R. Johnson said:

I think you bring him back.  The roster looks like it will turnover quit a bit either way and although it looks bad now, you can turn basketball around faster than say football.  The part that is most concerning is the effort or lack there of by the players.  

Unfortunately, the part that needs to turnover may not be what needs to turnover.  

[HuskerFever]

Miles' first year: $1.4M

Hoiberg's first year: $3.57M

 

Let's go back to 2019 one more time just so we have some context from that time:

• This salary was higher than all but 10 coaches, nationwide, and only 2 coaches in the Big Ten had a higher salary
• Hoiberg was getting paid more than Archie Miller and Shaka Smart
• The Big Ten average was $2.7M
• Nebraska basketball and football combined coaching salaries was $8.57M
• The only coaches making more than Hoiberg at the time we're: Calipari, Krzyzewski, Izzo, Bennett, Self, Mack, Williams, Wright, Huggins, and Beilein

The bigger the pay, the higher the expectations. It's one thing if Hoiberg was getting paid $800K. It's another to be paid (at the time) as the 11th highest paying coach and you're in Year 3 with an NET ranking of #219 out of 358. Meanwhile there's a guy making $700K at a school in San Jose sitting at #226 in the NET.

 

At some point, you need to decide what kind of athletic department you want to run. Fortunately, Nebraska has a budget to work with. But at some point after many failures, we might not have that same luxury of trial by failure.

[Chuck Taylor]

"Bring him back" started off strong but now is under 50%. So optimistic people are early risers? 

[HuskerFever]

7 minutes ago, Chuck Taylor said:

"Bring him back" started off strong but now is under 50%. So optimistic people are early risers? 

 

Optimism had nothing to do with my decision. Quite the opposite.

 

Aside from our buyout obligations, creating a downward spiring coaching carousel at your university isn't quite the most attractive job opening to take. We're just over two years in a program (that isn't going well whatsoever), but I'd at least like to get to the point of "Okay, you've fully instituted your system and recruited your players. Now no more excuses." He's getting to that point, but 2 seasons isn't enough to right many ships. Nor is it great messaging to any future coach who has to look at this job as a historical desert, overrated expectations for its history, and you only have 2-3 seasons to turn it around.

[cornfed24-7]

50 minutes ago, HuskerFever said:

overrated expectations for its history,

If having the WORST 3 year stretch in program history is overrated expectations then we should all just pack it up.

[HuskerFever]

3 minutes ago, cornfed24-7 said:

55 minutes ago, HuskerFever said:

overrated expectations for its history,

If having the WORST 3 year stretch in program history is overrated expectations then we should all just pack it up.

 

My "expectations" is referring to future results, not hindsight/in-the-moment results.

 

Not even three months ago, people were talking about the Sweet Sixteen (sure, smaller population), many talking about NCAA or bust, and others expecting the NIT this season. HHCC predictions averaged out at 19-12 on the season.

 

We've made the NCAA tournament seven times since 1939 (all of them after the 1985 expansion era). We've had six seasons with 19+ wins since 2000.

 

Now if we're talking about coach's salary and ROI off of that, yeah you sure bet we better get a return off of that coach for how much we're paying. But if a prospective coach sees a program that has had the lowest of success and the expectation is to make the postseason every single year or they're out after three seasons, most will move on to another opportunity.

[cornfed24-7]

2 minutes ago, HuskerFever said:

But if a prospective coach sees a program that has had the lowest of success and the expectation is to make the postseason every single year or they're out after three seasons, most will move on to another opportunity.

In what world is the expectation here to make the post season every year. What coach believes that is the expectation here. Seems like a strawman argument based on statements from message boards.

[HuskerFever]

8 minutes ago, cornfed24-7 said:

In what world is the expectation here to make the post season every year. What coach believes that is the expectation here. Seems like a strawman argument based on statements from message boards.

 

Sure, it's valid to argue the source of these pulses of those expectations. I can only go based off of the diehards on this board, what we hear from friends and family, the media, and the unreliable social media folks. And even with HHCC. I've been running that for many years and some of it is rose-colored optimism, but the normal distribution is up there around 19 or so wins every single year.

 

My point was around prospective coaches. There's other programs out there that can achieve a level of "satisfactory" with results that we put more pressure behind. Not saying that's wrong. As I said before, if we're paying someone to be the #11 most expensive coach in the nation (at the time), then we expect more out of a coach than 5-win seasons (laughable how bad this has been).

[HuskerFever]

It always is interesting looking back:

 

 

[cornfed24-7]

6 minutes ago, HuskerFever said:

 

Sure, it's valid to argue the source of these pulses of those expectations. I can only go based off of the diehards on this board, what we hear from friends and family, the media, and the unreliable social media folks. And even with HHCC. I've been running that for many years and some of it is rose-colored optimism, but the normal distribution is up there around 19 or so wins every single year.

 

My point was around prospective coaches. There's other programs out there that can achieve a level of "satisfactory" with results that we put more pressure behind. Not saying that's wrong. As I said before, if we're paying someone to be the #11 most expensive coach in the nation (at the time), then we expect more out of a coach than 5-win seasons (laughable how bad this has been).

I guess I'm confused. They way I 1st read your post was that you argued the expectations here may be too high. Which could scare off future potential coaches. But this post makes me think you are arguing the opposite. Or possibly the expectations are high because the pay for the head coach supports higher expectations. 

Anyhoo, that we are having these discussions at this juncture of Hoibergs tenure absolutely blows.

[49r]

18 minutes ago, HuskerFever said:

It always is interesting looking back:

 

 

 

Jesus that was depressing...

[HuskerFever]

Just now, 49r said:

 

Jesus that was depressing...

 

Yeah.... Sorry. Probably should have put a trigger warning on that one.

[Silverbacked1]

2 hours ago, Chuck Taylor said:

"Bring him back" started off strong but now is under 50%. So optimistic people are early risers? 

Mail in votes vs standing in line…

[HuskerFever]

1 minute ago, cornfed24-7 said:

I guess I'm confused. They way I 1st read your post was that you argued the expectations here may be too high. Which could scare off future potential coaches. But this post makes me think you are arguing the opposite. Or possibly the expectations are high because the pay for the head coach supports higher expectations. 

Anyhoo, that we are having these discussions at this juncture of Hoibergs tenure absolutely blows.

 

Haha agreed (the last statement). I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

 

Yeah I felt the message on my side was getting clouded. And some of that is solely because the massive amount of money that's involved. And I think another element is time; all other coaches we've seemed to say "give them four years" (as an example) but we're very quick to jump on this one.

 

I'd just be curious to see a survey of college coaches and their response to a program with no significant history who fired a coach after three seasons and see how attractive of a job that would be (i.e., Does it signal lack of AD support? Lack of resources? Unrealistic fans? Not saying it's any of these, because we are fortunate to have resources, but curious on the perception.)

[hskr4life]

1 hour ago, 49r said:

 

Jesus that was depressing...

Cazzie posted that they just wanted to see effort and better play.  We don’t even have that to hang our hat on.