Another Vucetic Topic

[FredsSlacks]

Vucetic- 7'1 236 lbs

 

Tyson Chandler. NBA defensive POY: 7'1 240 lbs.

 

I'm sure Tyson has more natural strength and athletic ability, but this comparison makes me think Sergej would be getting minutes if he had any basketball skill. I don't think strength is a good enough reason not to play someone when the best defensive player in the world is the same size.

 

My guess is Sergej won't be around next year.

[MilesForPrez]

Agreed. Hate to say this, but beginning to wonder if Parker will be either.

[cipsucks]

Another Vucetic topic?

 

What was the first one?

[HB]

This guy has become an obsession on this board.  Wonder if folks will ever give it a rest.

[hhcscott]

This guy has become an obsession on this board.  Wonder if folks will ever give it a rest.

He's this year's Standhardinger, the guy we all think should be playing more but some guy who has dedicated his entire professional life to winning basketball disagrees.

[Chuck Taylor]

This guy has become an obsession on this board.  Wonder if folks will ever give it a rest.

He's this year's Standhardinger, the guy we all think should be playing more but some guy who has dedicated his entire professional life to winning basketball disagrees.

 

Well, that hits the nail on the head.

[TheGov21]

Just my opinion.

 

-I can understand why people are curious of why Vucetic isn't playing.  He's got size (height) and seems to have some offensive skill.  I also think the fact that he isn't redshirting and still not getting any minutes is confusing to some.

 

-I can also understand why he might not be playing.  Strength and speed might be too much right now.

 

But I think the fact of him not redshirting is a big sticking point.

[NUdiehard]

This guy has become an obsession on this board.  Wonder if folks will ever give it a rest.

He's this year's Standhardinger, the guy we all think should be playing more but some guy who has dedicated his entire professional life to winning basketball disagrees.

About the only question I have seen about Vooch is if he's not going to play, why didn't he RS.  That is a very different question.  And it is a legitimate question whether some people want to admit it or not.  Its not a huge deal to to me personally, but its almost laughable how some people get so defensive about it.  Like to even ask it is a criminal offense or a terrible insult about TM.

 

To put this in some context, I was listening to Dave Hoppen the other day on the radio and he said that Ubel should have RS his freshman year.  Now, we all know the team was in a pinch for big men that year, nd he even played decent minutes, but still, the best long-term solution would have been to RS him.  We have no idea if Vooch could be another Ubel who will gain strength and blossom, but I think we can all agree that if Brandon would have RS his freshman year he would be a FAR greater gain to us next year than anything he provided his freshman year.

[HuskerBB]

Just my opinion.

 

-I can understand why people are curious of why Vucetic isn't playing.  He's got size (height) and seems to have some offensive skill.  I also think the fact that he isn't redshirting and still not getting any minutes is confusing to some.

 

-I can also understand why he might not be playing.  Strength and speed might be too much right now.

 

But I think the fact of him not redshirting is a big sticking point.

 

I just don't understand the apparent obsession with redshirting guys who are not that good.  Miles took a shot with Vucetic based on his options at the time and it looks like it did not pan out.  I am not saying Miles has given up on him because I simply don't know - but I also doubt that is the case.   What I am saying is the I believe Miles plan is to have big men on the roster 4 years from now that are clearly better than Vucetic is going to be at that point.  Maybe that will happen - maybe it won't - but I for one at least like the fact that Miles may be thinking that way.  I am surprised Vucetic is not getting a few minutes a game given our circumstances this year - but I trust Mile's judgement in that area.  I just don't see the point arguing that he should have been redshirted. Having mediocre players on the roster for 5 years instead of 4 (or less) is not a good thing when you are trying to vastly upgrade the overall talent in your program.

 

FWIW I don't think any of this analysis applies to the comments about Ubel.  Brandon is simply a better player.   Would be nice to have him for another year but he got sufficient minutes as a freshman to justify playing him then.  With any senior contributor that did not redshirt you can look back in hindsight and say you wish you had them for another year.  But that does not necessarily mean that it was a mistake not to redshirt that player.  

[HB]

I get the redshirt issue, but it's not like its the biggest scandel ever to hit the program.  The attention and hand wringing it gets on here, and that it started happening before much of the season had even played out, is ridiculous.   Yes, the question can get asked, and people shouldn't get overly defensive, but wow, this is crazy over-amped.  A daily topic and second-guessing by those with limited information, on a daily basis for several weeks.  

 

Again, we don't know what discussions were had with Miles during recruiting.  Or whatever else is going on.  If it eventually turns out that this guy is a really good player, and we wasted a year, the lack of a redshirt can be criticized then.  It's a reach based on what i have seen and heard to do so now.  

[MandRHusker]

I can easily see why no redshirt was taken. From Coach Miles viewpoint, why waste a year on a kid who is a project. More importantly, from Sergej's viewpoint, he may need the redshirt if he decides to transfer. Move on everyone, nothing to see here!

[NUdiehard]

Just my opinion.

 

-I can understand why people are curious of why Vucetic isn't playing.  He's got size (height) and seems to have some offensive skill.  I also think the fact that he isn't redshirting and still not getting any minutes is confusing to some.

 

-I can also understand why he might not be playing.  Strength and speed might be too much right now.

 

But I think the fact of him not redshirting is a big sticking point.

 

I just don't understand the apparent obsession with redshirting guys who are not that good.  Miles took a shot with Vucetic based on his options at the time and it looks like it did not pan out.  I am not saying Miles has given up on him because I simply don't know - but I also doubt that is the case.   What I am saying is the I believe Miles plan is to have big men on the roster 4 years from now that are clearly better than Vucetic is going to be at that point.  Maybe that will happen - maybe it won't - but I for one at least like the fact that Miles may be thinking that way.  I am surprised Vucetic is not getting a few minutes a game given our circumstances this year - but I trust Mile's judgement in that area.  I just don't see the point arguing that he should have been redshirted. Having mediocre players on the roster for 5 years instead of 4 (or less) is not a good thing when you are trying to vastly upgrade the overall talent in your program.

 

FWIW I don't think any of this analysis applies to the comments about Ubel.  Brandon is simply a better player.   Would be nice to have him for another year but he got sufficient minutes as a freshman to justify playing him then.  With any senior contributor that did not redshirt you can look back in hindsight and say you wish you had them for another year.  But that does not necessarily mean that it was a mistake not to redshirt that player.  

I don't get this argument at all.  If Vucetic is not going to be good enought to ever be a major contributor, then he will not be on the roster for 4 years or 5 years no matter what.  We all know it!  Let's not deceive ourselves and pretend it is not reality.  Miles could have RS him this year and still cut him loose (errrr, allow Vooch to transfer under his own volition) at the end of this year, next year, or any other year.  And guess what, Vucetic's status would still be exactly same either way.  Even if he had RS this year, he still would have 3 years eligibility after sitting out a year.  The notion that Miles would somehow be stuck with Vooch for 5 years instead of 4 years is just silly.  No way Miles keeps a guy for 5 years who is not going to contribute at all.

 

As for Ubel, it was Dave Hoppen that made the point.  I'm guessing he knows a little someting about the development of big men.  And it is a valid argument.  I agree there are two-sides, but it is a valid discussion.  The reality is that NU has been a pathitic BB program for a long time. We cannot always act like the "other" schools do.  I have no problem RSing guys if it means we will be better in the long run.  Of course I would much rather get players that can come in and dominate right away as freshman.  And as soon as we get those guys, then lets roll.  I certainly am not suggesting that Webster should RS b/c I think he will be ready to play.  But big guys always take longer to develop, and sometimes a place like NU has to do things differently b/c we don't always get the elite freshman like other schools do.   

[NUdiehard]

As for why are we talking about it.  Well, its not exactly like we have much else to talk about.  This is Nebraska BB afterall.   Shall we talk about whether AA has gained 10 lbs or lost 10 lbs since the start of the season?  Maybe whether BP is 5'7 or 5'9".  Whether NU will win 3 or 4 games in conf. this year? 

 

The reason Vooch is a topic is b/c it is a legitimate question that can be debated on both sides.  It at least allows for discussion and it is probably one few questions that seems to remain unclear as of this point

[Norm Peterson]

I just tweeted with Vooch's girlfriend -- Lennay or something like that.  She says she asked him NOT to redshirt for her, and if anything happened to her, to honor her with the way he played.  Apparently, she was in a car accident just before the Ohio State game ...

[cozrulz]

Something about...you can't teach size.  It wouldn't be so bad if Ubel wasn't hurt and was filling the gap but going small hasn't worked yet.  To some degree it cost the Huskers a better chance at the Michigan State game.  Almeida needs spot minutes filled and we should be doing it with a guy that has size and maybe could do something on the offensive end.  Vooch had 4 points in 2 minutes against Ohio State.  Seems about right for a Nebraska coach to not care about offense.  I'm also not convinced he is a big liability on defense.  The same stuff was happening with Rivers and Shields earlier this year.

[HB]

Something about...you can't teach size.  It wouldn't be so bad if Ubel wasn't hurt and was filling the gap but going small hasn't worked yet.  To some degree it cost the Huskers a better chance at the Michigan State game.  Almeida needs spot minutes filled and we should be doing it with a guy that has size and maybe could do something on the offensive end.  Vooch had 4 points in 2 minutes against Ohio State.  Seems about right for a Nebraska coach to not care about offense.  I'm also not convinced he is a big liability on defense.  The same stuff was happening with Rivers and Shields earlier this year.

 

Coz, have you seen him play other than 2 garbage minutes at Ohio State?  Were you at the exhibition game in person?    If you did, I'm not sure you would be so sure this guy is ready to play.

[hhcmatt]

I can easily see why no redshirt was taken. From Coach Miles viewpoint, why waste a year on a kid who is a project. More importantly, from Sergej's viewpoint, he may need the redshirt if he decides to transfer. Move on everyone, nothing to see here!

 

I'd say this is the boiled down, though harsh version of the situation.

 

Unless you can get an established program like a Wisconsin or Gonzaga where redshirting is part of the culture of being on the team, you're not going to get most kids to even consider it.  

 

Redshirt years have become a transfer year if I don't like the program, not a year spent by a player to get better.

Considering that you can redshirt and then transfer to a "better" situation as a graduate student, it's also the move of a kid who doesn't have the right kind of influence in his life and/or cares little about the academic opportunity presented.

[Huskerpapa]

The thing about "Vooch" is that he really does have a sweet shot.  What he currently lacks is the strength and toughness to play.  I am part of the group that doesn't understand why he has not earned playing time, but I am not part of the inner circle who gets to make that decision.  I am not necessarily confinced that he is going anywhere but the weightroom and training table after the season ends, but I would not be shocked if he left...I guess am also concerned that if he does put on weight and bulk, that may have an adverse effect on his body...it just seems so many big men have problems with their feet and legs as they mature. 

 

By the way (I am too lazy to look), how much did Eliason weigh coming out of Chadron, and how much does he weigh now?

[Silverbacked1]

So that's why my knees and feet hurt so much.   

 

I have just matured too much.

 

Now I'm going to go mature myself a pizza for lunch.

[Huskerpapa]

So that's why my knees and feet hurt so much. 

 

I have just matured too much.

 

Now I'm going to go mature myself a pizza for lunch.

You are one lucky dude, I have to eat that green stuff...yuck.

[Silverbacked1]

Oh I eat all that before I have my meals... hey maybe that's why my waist keeps getting bigger.

[Bugeaters1]

This guy has become an obsession on this board.  Wonder if folks will ever give it a rest.

It's kinda like the second string QB for the football team. He can always do better than the starter.

[hhcmatt]

By the way (I am too lazy to look), how much did Eliason weigh coming out of Chadron, and how much does he weigh now?

 

If you're to believe the internet he's gone from 220 in HS to 260 this year.

 

[MandRHusker]

...I guess am also concerned that if he does put on weight and bulk, that may have an adverse effect on his body...it just seems so many big men have problems with their feet and legs as they mature. 

 

Short, wide guys have the same problem cwg!

[tcp]

This guy has become an obsession on this board.  Wonder if folks will ever give it a rest.

He's this year's Standhardinger, the guy we all think should be playing more but some guy who has dedicated his entire professional life to winning basketball disagrees.

 

Well, that hits the nail on the head.

I think it only grazes the nail. I can only speak for myself, but it's more of a "why, daddy, why?" situation for a few of us then a dead-set conviction that he should be playing. In my case, the public answer isn't especially satisfying. That said, I don't think Sergej was on the grassy knoll in Dallas, nor do I think Miles is hiding aliens in his basement.