We have to change how we are using Ed Morrow

big red22 · December 31, 2015

We should be seeing games that Derek Pardon had from him. He has all the athletic ability in the world, but looks completely lost right now.

I sure hope Morrow looks at this game as a learning experience. Pardon is a true freshman as well, and was not as highly sought after.

This one to me falls directly on Miles, and not playing him at his true position.

I think some of you may think I'm crazy, but we need to see him at the 4. That may involve moving Shields/White to the 2 or not being on the court at the same time.

Make the right change Miles!

hhcmatt · December 31, 2015

I've said this in several other places, but how physically is Morrow hampered at this point?

Also, Pardon has 3-4 guys on the court who are 40%+ 3pt shooters who are ready to fire. We don't.

Otherwise yeah I hope what Pardon was able to do by simply rebounding, going back strong, and bringing energy on the court is something that Morrow sees when watching the tape today.

brfrad · December 31, 2015

For that to happen, we'll have to play Hammond. Unless we think Jacobson can play 40 minutes a game.

HuskerBB · December 31, 2015

What we need to do is give Morrow minutes and confidence. He was better his 2nd game than he has been lately. Now he is thinking too much and is too afraid of making a mistake that he doesn't play aggressively on either end.

Much of Pardon's success yesterday was caused by our perimeter players being beaten forcing the inside defenders to help off to stop a drive. The help often got the driver to miss the shot but no one rotated in quickly enough to get the rebound so Pardon would get an easy put back. Not the only way he scored but that happened a lot. FWIW Jacobson got 3 baskets for us in the 2nd half the same way.

Overall NW just had some designed things that worked to get Pardon easy baskets. It was not like they were just posting him up and letting him go 1-1 very often. Just screen and rolls or dives where the guard would make a good pass or he would get a put back or other garbage bucket. One of the reasons our posts don't score much is that the guys we have driving to the hoop are just not very good at making that pass when the post defender does help off. Watson and Webster can do it a little bit - but passing is not a strength of any of our guys. Morrow did get two buckets off nice passes yesterday though.

I have to say that I don't really see the argument about Morrow playing the 4. In some systems that might be the case but we really play in a fashion where our 4 has to play facing the basket and be able to make perimeter shots. Morrow does not strike me as that kind of player at all. I think we would have to drastically change the entire offensive system to have double post action if you were playing Morrow at a four. Regardless Miles seems to keep finding a way not to play either Jacobson or Morrow by themselves - really can't see him making a switch to play the two of them together.

big red22 · December 31, 2015

What we need to do is give Morrow minutes and confidence.   He was better his 2nd game than he has been lately.   Now he is thinking too much and is too afraid of making a mistake that he doesn't play aggressively on either end.

Much of Pardon's success yesterday was caused by our perimeter players being beaten forcing the inside defenders to help off to stop a drive. The help often got the driver to miss the shot but no one rotated in quickly enough to get the rebound so Pardon would get an easy put back. Not the only way he scored but that happened a lot.  FWIW Jacobson got 3 baskets for us in the 2nd half the same way.

Overall NW just had some designed things that worked to get Pardon easy baskets. It was not like they were just posting him up and letting him go 1-1 very often. Just screen and rolls or dives where the guard would make a good pass or he would get a put back or other garbage bucket.   One of the reasons our posts don't score much is that the guys we have driving to the hoop are just not very good at making that pass when the post defender does help off.   Watson and Webster can do it a little bit - but passing is not a strength of any of our guys.   Morrow did get two buckets off nice passes yesterday though.

I have to say that I don't really see the argument about Morrow playing the 4.   In some systems that might be the case but we really play in a fashion where our 4 has to play facing the basket and be able to make perimeter shots. Morrow does not strike me as that kind of player at all. I think we would have to drastically change the entire offensive system to have double post action if you were playing Morrow at a four.   Regardless Miles seems to keep finding a way not to play either Jacobson or Morrow by themselves - really can't see him making a switch to play the two of them together.

And that comment leads me to my next tirade. If I was Morrow I would be scootin right on out of here. You adjust to what your best players are. I think McVeigh and Jacobson are solid players, but they don't have the upside Morrow does. Change what needs changed for the better of the team.

Our style has got to change, or we won't be getting any good big man soon. I would love to land this Elijah Thomas, but he would also fail in this system if Miles doesn't change it. Ed Morrow worked Elijah Thomas in high school, I'm sure Thomas remembers that and sees how he(Morrow) is struggling in this offense!

big red22 · December 31, 2015

http://illinois.247sports.com/Board/12/Contents/The-Intrigue-of-Simeons-Ed-Morrow-27567744

How was he able to handle Cliff Alexander and Jahlil Okafor in high school and now he can't even defend Creighton's Giraffe Gazell<- isn't that his name? or a middle of the road 6'8 True Freshman (Dererk Pardon)

Miles has got to change his philosophy if he wants to succeed with these new guys!

HuskerBB · December 31, 2015

I disagree about changing the system although I agree we need to utilize Morrow better. I really think most college 4's even in more double-post systems have more perimeter skills than Morrow has at this point. To me Jacobson would be more effective in a 4 position than Morrow because he handles the ball better and is a much better jump shooter. But we don't have the inside depth to really play them both at the same time anyway.

Morrow is basically the same size as Derek Pardon. We just don't use him well - or enough. Part of that is our perimeter players are not as adept at opening things up for post players as what NW has in Demps etc. But most of it is Morrow for whatever reason just is playing very timidly. I think he has the ability to be an effective 5 at this level. We just are not doing a good job of getting that out of him.

ajb5856 · December 31, 2015

And now we need to ask the question again that Dimes keeps bringing up. Does Morrow playing timidly have anything to do with still being hampered by his foot injury? Or is it the system creating the timidness when he's on the floor? He looked real awkward when he went up for that layup he almost missed. From watching his film he should've just gone straight to the rim with that one.

hhcmatt · December 31, 2015

http://illinois.247sports.com/Board/12/Contents/The-Intrigue-of-Simeons-Ed-Morrow-27567744

How was he able to handle Cliff Alexander and Jahlil Okafor in high school and now he can't even defend Creighton's Giraffe Gazell<- isn't that his name? or a middle of the road 6'8 True Freshman (Dererk Pardon)

Miles has got to change his philosophy if he wants to succeed with these new guys!

You want Miles to play Morrow at the 4 like Pardon but Pardon wasn't playing the 4 yesterday...he and Van Zegeren were playing the 5. Pardon looked like a million bucks because he hasn't been injured, hasn't been worn down playing, and we didn't have much of a true 5 to throw at him. Having to grind against Diamond Stone next game should bring him back down to earth.

At what point are you watching Morrow and thinking "Boy, let's run some offense around him" as opposed to just thinking he has to be better because he was in high school? Sure we could run him at the 4 so he would pick up less fouls but then what exactly is he going to bring at the offensive end that compels you to do that? I don't think he's above Benny in terms of offensive firepower at the moment.

kldm64 · December 31, 2015

http://illinois.247sports.com/Board/12/Contents/The-Intrigue-of-Simeons-Ed-Morrow-27567744

How was he able to handle Cliff Alexander and Jahlil Okafor in high school and now he can't even defend Creighton's Giraffe Gazell<- isn't that his name? or a middle of the road 6'8 True Freshman (Dererk Pardon)

Miles has got to change his philosophy if he wants to succeed with these new guys!

You want Miles to play Morrow at the 4 like Pardon but Pardon wasn't playing the 4 yesterday...he and Van Zegeren were playing the 5. Pardon looked like a million bucks because he hasn't been injured, hasn't been worn down playing, and we didn't have much of a true 5 to throw at him. Having to grind against Diamond Stone next game should bring him back down to earth.

At what point are you watching Morrow and thinking "Boy, let's run some offense around him" as opposed to just thinking he has to be better because he was in high school? Sure we could run him at the 4 so he would pick up less fouls but then what exactly is he going to bring at the offensive end that compels you to do that? I don't think he's above Benny in terms of offensive firepower at the moment.

Great post as I was thinking the same thing. Whether Ed is asked to play the 4 or 5 is not going to make that much difference. It appears the game is moving a little fast for him right now.

big red22 · December 31, 2015

http://illinois.247sports.com/Board/12/Contents/The-Intrigue-of-Simeons-Ed-Morrow-27567744

How was he able to handle Cliff Alexander and Jahlil Okafor in high school and now he can't even defend Creighton's Giraffe Gazell<- isn't that his name? or a middle of the road 6'8 True Freshman (Dererk Pardon)

Miles has got to change his philosophy if he wants to succeed with these new guys!

You want Miles to play Morrow at the 4 like Pardon but Pardon wasn't playing the 4 yesterday...he and Van Zegeren were playing the 5. Pardon looked like a million bucks because he hasn't been injured, hasn't been worn down playing, and we didn't have much of a true 5 to throw at him. Having to grind against Diamond Stone next game should bring him back down to earth.

At what point are you watching Morrow and thinking "Boy, let's run some offense around him" as opposed to just thinking he has to be better because he was in high school? Sure we could run him at the 4 so he would pick up less fouls but then what exactly is he going to bring at the offensive end that compels you to do that? I don't think he's above Benny in terms of offensive firepower at the moment.

The point is he played against Jahlil Okafor and scored 18 <- I don't care that it was in high school he was 6'11 then too. Fine he is injured, I get it. That is not why he is completely useless right now. Miles is using him wrong, and the look... the feel.. the production... an the stats all prove my point

If he is indeed injured that bad... then sit his ass till he is better!

49r · December 31, 2015

I've said this in several other places, but how physically is Morrow hampered at this point?

Also, Pardon has 3-4 guys on the court who are 40%+ 3pt shooters who are ready to fire. We don't.

Otherwise yeah I hope what Pardon was able to do by simply rebounding, going back strong, and bringing energy on the court is something that Morrow sees when watching the tape today.

Good point on the three point shooting. It seems like #GATA ball always struggles against these #ShitBall teams.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

Norm Peterson · December 31, 2015

I agree with some of what HuskerBB has to say but I disagree with him on Morrow to be an effective 5 at this level. I think chances are better that he develops the tools to be an effective 4 than that he grows another 4 inches and gains another 40 pounds to be an effective 5.

All these people saying he can't be a 4 have me wondering how we were able to get along with David Rivers at the 4. What did Rivers have that Morrow doesn't?

hhcmatt · December 31, 2015

The point is he played against Jahlil Okafor and scored 18 <- I don't care that it was in high school he was 6'11 then too.

Morrow also fouled out and they lost that game.

hhcmatt · December 31, 2015

All these people saying he can't be a 4 have me wondering how we were able to get along with David Rivers at the 4. What did Rivers have that Morrow doesn't?

Bigger teammates who played.

I definitely think Morrow slots into a 4 on this level and hope/pray that he gets the teammates to make this happen.

Jugular · December 31, 2015

Morrow had ZERO rebounds. ZERO. That's effort and desire. The same with his defense. He is struggling on D right now too

jayschool · December 31, 2015

It's "Dererk," (with 2 R's, 28 points and 12 rebounds).

HuskerBB · December 31, 2015

I agree with some of what HuskerBB has to say but I disagree with him on Morrow to be an effective 5 at this level. I think chances are better that he develops the tools to be an effective 4 than that he grows another 4 inches and gains another 40 pounds to be an effective 5.

All these people saying he can't be a 4 have me wondering how we were able to get along with David Rivers at the 4. What did Rivers have that Morrow doesn't?

First I am looking at what Morrow is now in terms of skill set more than what he can become. Second Pardon was a pretty "effective" 5 yesterday and he is not really any bigger than Morrow. Morrow is undersized for a 5 - but there are lots of people that size who are effective in the post. He does not have to grow 4 inches or gain 40 pounds - not saying a little more weight and muscle would not help. But he is big enough to contribute at that spot if we get him playing more aggressively.

I am not sure David Rivers is a great example here. I loved David's effort but he was not a great 4 man either in terms of skills. Plus Rivers was playing with Pitchford most of the time and Walt was obviously unusual as a 5 because he hated to be in the lane. In that lineup you needed a 4 to be more of an inside player. I think the prototypical 4 that Miles wants is more like McVeigh - although more athletic. Wes Wilkinson would be a better example if you go back farther in time. Maybe Morrow can develop that kind of game facing the basket. I don really see that - but not saying it could not happen. In any event I don't think he is that kind of player now is my point.

Another post complained about the fact that Morrow had no rebounds yesterday. So I went back and counted and when Morrow as in the game we lost the rebound battle overall 10--11. Not great but much better than we did in the game overall 25-35. Sometimes it is not just about being the guy that gets the rebound.

I am not saying Morrow played great yesterday - he has struggled this season. But I do think he is a guy that could be helping us much more than he has this year and we need to figure out how to get more out of him. That is necessary primarily because we don't have very many other options and certainly we don't have a lineup this year that would allow him to play meaningful minutes anywhere but the 5 spot..

If the Samford and NW games proved nothing else they proved that we are a really bad team when we don't have any of those post players (Jacobson, Morrow, Hammond) on the floor. Playing without them is obviously not the answer. So we need to figure out how to get the most out of them - and I think we have a lot of room to improve in that area.

Dead Dog Alley · December 31, 2015

Morrow had ZERO rebounds. ZERO. That's effort and desire. The same with his defense. He is struggling on D right now too

That's not necessarily effort and desire. In this case it is having to think too much on defense and ending up out of position.

Fullbacksympathy · December 31, 2015

What I can't figure out is why on earth we can't field a true front court with a 4 and 5 at the same time during the game.

It looks like this:

Watson/Parker = 1

Webster/White/Shields = 2-3

Morrow/McVeigh/Fuller = 4

Jacobson/Hammond = 5

One of the things I was excited about this year was fielding an actual full roster (depleted or not). Why play guys out of position when they could potentially dominate their natural spot? Weird.

Fullbacksympathy · December 31, 2015

I think Jacobson is a tweener, but I agree that he's a more natural 4 at this point. I could see him swinging 4-5 down the road. Morrow, McVeigh, and Fuller should be playing the 4 100% of the time, however.

Jugular · January 1, 2016

Rebounding is effort and being tough when you have Ed's size, athletic ability and strength. Yes, he's swimming in it on both ends but when you are, you can still bust your ass and work harder than everyone else.

Morrow had ZERO rebounds. ZERO. That's effort and desire. The same with his defense. He is struggling on D right now too

That's not necessarily effort and desire. In this case it is having to think too much on defense and ending up out of position.

uneblinstu · January 1, 2016

Morrow had ZERO rebounds. ZERO. That's effort and desire. The same with his defense. He is struggling on D right now too

That's not necessarily effort and desire. In this case it is having to think too much on defense and ending up out of position.

Rebounding is effort and being tough when you have Ed's size, athletic ability and strength. Yes, he's swimming in it on both ends but when you are, you can still bust your ass and work harder than everyone else.

Mmmm, I know in situations in life where I've been "swimming in it", I could "bust my ass" as much as I wanted, but until things slowed down and started making sense, I was pretty ineffective. If it's truly a situation where he's in over his head, we just gotta wait it out. That's not always fun. If it's a situation where his attitude and effort are getting in the way, that's a whole other issue.

gobigredbrah · January 1, 2016

Morrow is best at the 4, using his athleticism to get to the basket. Needs more lobs thrown his way also

OLDDBC · January 1, 2016

Pardon looked 6'10" to me while Morrow looked 6'7". Are my eyes that bad?

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