Fast forward a year

[Norm Peterson]

1 hour ago, GoBigFred said:

 

Based off what I've seen, and how I think these guys can improve before next year...I would guess:

 

Mack

Allen

Banton

Stevenson 

Walker

 

Off bench:

Burke

Cross

Thor

 

Yvan needs to get stronger, ideally he could redshirt next year because he is so young. With Walker, Banton, Mayen all here, we have a good number of 6-8, 6-9 options, and Cross and Stevenson are undersized guys who can still hold their own down low. 

 

I think Mack is a no-brainer. Banton is getting too much buzz to ignore (coming especially from inside Hendricks.) The rest is pretty wide open.

 

I think Cross, Stevenson and Allen are all about 6'6 and 230#, give or take. They may be listed differently, but I really think they're all pretty much the same size. Moreover, I think they all have a pretty similar skill set. Cross might lean more inside and Allen more outside, but similar tool bags and similar sizes. It's very possible we see just one of those three guys starting, at the "4" position if you will. That would open another guard spot for either Thor, who can shoot FTs and makes Mack a better PG, or Burke, who is quick as hell but misses too many freebies.

 

With Walker being eligible, you'd have a battle at the proverbial 5 among Walker, Ouedraogo and Mayen.  Until I see more from either of the new guys, I'm going to assume Yvan holds the starting job. But his inability to finish around the rim like last night could mean he has a short leash.

 

The additions of Mayen and Walker allow Cross to shift to his (more natural?) wing/stretch 4 spot. So, Cross, Shamiel, Teddy. I think maybe Teddy Allen is the favorite to win that job because he's just quicker and a better shooter than the other two. Just from what I've seen.

 

So, that's kinda the long-winded way of saying:

 

Starters:

 

PG Mack

SG Burke/Thor

SF Banton

SF Allen

PF Yvan

 

Bench:

 

Thor/Burke

Green or Easley

Walker

 

We have to have a backup PG. I think Green is more naturally suited to that role, but things will have to change, including his willingness to accept a diminished role. Otherwise, Easley? I mean, who's your backup point?

[khoock]

28 minutes ago, Norm Peterson said:

We have to have a backup PG. I think Green is more naturally suited to that role, but things will have to change, including his willingness to accept a diminished role. Otherwise, Easley? I mean, who's your backup point?

 Jervay Green and Dalano Banton would more than likely be your options at PG during the 5 to 8 minutes Cam Mack is not on the court.

 

Also, no Shamiel Stevenson included in the rotation. Was that purposeful or accidental? I know we have a lot of pieces to work with at the moment!

[Art Vandalay]

3 hours ago, GoBigFred said:

 

Based off what I've seen, and how I think these guys can improve before next year...I would guess:

 

Mack

Allen

Banton

Stevenson 

Walker

 

Off bench:

Burke

Cross

Thor

 

Yvan needs to get stronger, ideally he could redshirt next year because he is so young. With Walker, Banton, Mayen all here, we have a good number of 6-8, 6-9 options, and Cross and Stevenson are undersized guys who can still hold their own down low. 

This is a fun exercise. I agree with you for the most part. Think Yvan will be much improved next year and will get time behind Walker. I don't believe they would sign a JUCO they did not think would contribute so I expect Mayen to have some role at least. That leaves Green on the way outside but I still think he has potential if he gets his head right.

 

A ten man rotation is not in heard of but guessing, transfer, suspension, or injury will shorten that to 8-9. It’s nice we seem to have option and they are not done recruiting.

[Art Vandalay]

Teddy Allen might be shooting a lot of threes now but he is a terror inside. If they put a smaller guy on him he will kill them. I see SS and Cross having that ability as well from the wing. Fred will have a lot of toys / mismatches to play around with and that should be fun.

[khoock]

Just to get a better idea of what rotations will look like under HCFH, here is his five year sample size from his time at Iowa State.

 

**DISCLAIMER** i only added info based off of what i could tell from the individual player logs of season stats. I did not dig deep enough to see how injuries, suspensions, or mid season transfers affected this. If you would like to dig deeper or know more info, feel free to build on this.

 

2010-11: Seven players that played in basically every game. He also had an additional player that played in 25 games at 9 MPG. So an 8 man rotation you could say.

 

2011-12: Eight players that played in all or almost all of the games. He also had an additional player that played in 21 games at 13.8 MPG. So (what i like to call) an 8+1 man rotation.

 

2012-13: Again, eight players that played in all or alkost every single game. However, this year he had two additional players that contributed on a semi-regular basis. One player at 17 games/12.5 MPG akd the other at 18 games/6.9 MPG. Dare I call this a 8+2 man rotation 

 

2013-14: This year he was down to seven guys that played every/almost every game. Once again we see two semi regular contributors. One at 24 games/5.8 MPG and the other at 20 games/5.7 MPG. In this season one is guard the other is a forward, so maybe it was a matchup thing. 7+2 man rotation

 

2014-15: This year looked to be a solid 8 man rotation. There was an additional player that played in 16 games/9.3 MPG. This was player was a forward who seemed to get more clock bc another player, Jameel McKay (25 games/27.2 MPG), who must have been injured or suspended. 8 man rotation.

 

 

[Norm Peterson]

3 hours ago, khoock said:

 Jervay Green and Dalano Banton would more than likely be your options at PG during the 5 to 8 minutes Cam Mack is not on the court.

 

Also, no Shamiel Stevenson included in the rotation. Was that purposeful or accidental? I know we have a lot of pieces to work with at the moment!

 

Probably inadvertence as much as anything. I was trying to limit myself to only three additional players. Shamiel might make that cut, he might not.

[Fullbacksympathy]

I think our lineups are going to largely depend on matchups.  If we need bangers, Yvan and Walker should get the 5 slot.  If we don’t and want to speed up the game while maintaining our size, it could get very interesting.

 

Cam (6’2”)

Banton (6’8”)

Mayen (6’8”)

Allen (6’5”)

Stevenson (6’6”)
 

^^ this lineup can 1. Handle the ball. 2. Rebound 3. Have 5 three point shooters.  4. Switch on screens.  5. Have interchangeable positions on offense and still be a terror in transition.  
 

Or, when we play, say, a physical team like Rutgers, we could add more beef. 
 

Cam 

Teddy (225)

Stevenson (245)

Cross (230)
Yvan (245)

 

Small ball:

 

Cam

Burke

Thor

Teddy

Stevenson

 

Point being, the versatility of next year’s lineup looks pretty remarkable.  

[Fullbacksympathy]

I think Mayen is a guard.  He’s a good enough rebounder to play the 4 but I think he’s going to perfectly comfortable as a 2-3.  He’s very similar to Banton’s skill set.  

[huskerbill85]

Another year of development with the Frenchman, Banton, and Walker. Improve the free throw shooting and become more consistent shooting the ball next years team will be a tournament team.

[GoBigRed]

Hard to say between Walker and Yvan who is better. Yvan is doing OK as a very young freshman, just OK. Walker barely played at Tennessee in two years but he was on a really, really good team and had NBA guys ahead of him. If Yvan were on those rosters I doubt he sees much playing time. So I lean Walker based on him being a man and Yvan still growing into a man. Yvan needs to get way stronger finishing at the rim. 

 

And regarding Banton...we've been hearing that he has NBA potential and that he is one of our best players in practice. On the Italy trip he did things no one else on our roster could do. With all due respect, we are Nebraska basketball and can't afford to not start guys like that. 

 

Putting it another way, here's the order of confidence I am that they will start games next year:

 

Mack

Allen

Banton

 

big drop-off

 

Walker/Yvan (one of them will start, coin flip IMO)

Stevenson

Burke (feels weird putting him down here, so maybe he would get the nod over Shamiel)

Thor (having a fantastic year, but still can he shoot this well all season? He's a good player to have come off the bench if you want to be a really good team IMO)

Cross

Mayen

Green

Easley

Arop (I'll be surprised if he doesn't find somewhere else to play next year)

 

[Norm Peterson]

Re: Thor and shooting. I don't think this is smoke and mirrors anymore. I was assuming there would be some regression to the mean. But he shot 50% from three against Iowa on 3-6 shooting, and did you see where his attempts came from? He shot some of those balls from downtown Waverly.

[Norm Peterson]

Here's the highlight vid and it has all three of Thor's made treys. You'll find them at the 1:25 mark, 4:30 and 4:37. He's catching and shooting from a long way off and getting the ball out of his hands fast.  (You'll also see Yvan getting stuffed at the rim and Kevin throwing it down on the same basic plays.)

 

 

[cornfed24-7]

The narrative that there is a "big drop" in talent amongst certain players and Thor is not bearing out by evidence on the court. Does that continue? Who knows? But with each passing game I am becoming more convinced we see a lot more of Thor on the court next year than many are predicting.

[cornfed24-7]

23 minutes ago, Norm Peterson said:

Here's the highlight vid and it has all three of Thor's made treys. You'll find them at the 1:25 mark, 4:30 and 4:37. He's catching and shooting from a long way off and getting the ball out of his hands fast.  (You'll also see Yvan getting stuffed at the rim and Kevin throwing it down on the same basic plays.)

 

 

What I have noticed is the confidence it seems he has in taking those shots.

[Norm Peterson]

Just now, cornfed24-7 said:

What I have noticed is the confidence it seems he has in taking those shots.

 

Yeah, he doesn't even stop to think about it. WHICH IS KEY! It needs to be reaction and muscle memory. That's why guys who have a wide open shot and take a second to think about it often miss.

 

There's a reason they call good shooters "unconscious." There's a place in your brain you tap into when you're allowing muscle memory to work and not thinking too much. Thor isn't thinking about these shots; he's just taking them. If he keeps that up, the results should continue.

 

It's all about feel.

[Cazzie22]

I have been a fan of Thor from the beginning.  He had no opportunity to play his first two seasons.  I noted when he did play, the ball moved and that he understood the game.  Even when forced to play he, I believe, deferred to Palmer, Roby and Watson. Hoiberg has encouraged him to shoot and Thor clearly understands the offense.   Defensively, he has to matchup with 4’s and works to hold his own.  He is the type of player every team needs, selfless, smart and sensible.

[uneblinstu]

4 hours ago, Norm Peterson said:

Here's the highlight vid and it has all three of Thor's made treys. You'll find them at the 1:25 mark, 4:30 and 4:37. He's catching and shooting from a long way off and getting the ball out of his hands fast.  (You'll also see Yvan getting stuffed at the rim and Kevin throwing it down on the same basic plays.)

 

 

Yvan posting up and scoring over Garza is in there, too.

[Handy Johnson]

6 hours ago, Norm Peterson said:

 

Yeah, he doesn't even stop to think about it. WHICH IS KEY! It needs to be reaction and muscle memory. That's why guys who have a wide open shot and take a second to think about it often miss.

 

There's a reason they call good shooters "unconscious." There's a place in your brain you tap into when you're allowing muscle memory to work and not thinking too much. Thor isn't thinking about these shots; he's just taking them. If he keeps that up, the results should continue.

 

It's all about feel.

My Father was a Boxing Coach for 20 years, he always said, “if you have to think about which punch to throw, it’s time to retire”...

[HuskerFever]

6 minutes ago, Handy Johnson said:

My Father was a Boxing Coach for 20 years, he always said, “if you have to think about which punch to throw, it’s time to retire”...

 

That explains everything. So AWIII went to Syracuse to retire. That makes so much more sense!

[REDitus]

20 hours ago, LK1 said:

I think Mayen is a guard.  He’s a good enough rebounder to play the 4 but I think he’s going to perfectly comfortable as a 2-3.  He’s very similar to Banton’s skill set.  

 

I think it was Coach Miles who said players are what they can guard.  Personally,  I think Mayen lacks the lateral quickness to guard a 2.  He can match up better 3's but IMHO he's a closer match to 4.  Just my opinion.  

[REDitus]

7 hours ago, Norm Peterson said:

 

Yeah, he doesn't even stop to think about it. WHICH IS KEY! It needs to be reaction and muscle memory. That's why guys who have a wide open shot and take a second to think about it often miss.

 

There's a reason they call good shooters "unconscious." There's a place in your brain you tap into when you're allowing muscle memory to work and not thinking too much. Thor isn't thinking about these shots; he's just taking them. If he keeps that up, the results should continue.

 

It's all about feel.

 

To your point Norm, this is something that I have heard about as a golf technique.   You practice your shot in your mind and take a couple of practice swings while visualing the results.   Then when you step up to do it you empty your mind and rely on muscle memory. 

 

Also, I think it shows he's been shooting a lot of treys in off-season/practice and seeing the ball go in which breeds confidence.  Also think he launching the ball earlier in his jump so it's closer to a set shot.   So really he's using more legs than arms.   He's got his elbow in line which is key too.    Definitely tip the hat to him for that.

 

I think Kavas and Green are struggling and it's all mental.  Especially Kavas!  I do have one theory but not sure if it's worth anything.   It could be Kavas was dialed in to the old 3-pt line and he hasn't been able to adjust to the difference.   I money is on mental though , he is rushing due to facing better competition,bigger crowds and TV.   Just needs to see the ball go in and get confident.  Trouble is we are deep into the season. 

Edited January 10, 2020 by REDitus

[huskerbill85]

8 hours ago, Norm Peterson said:

Re: Thor and shooting. I don't think this is smoke and mirrors anymore. I was assuming there would be some regression to the mean. But he shot 50% from three against Iowa on 3-6 shooting, and did you see where his attempts came from? He shot some of those balls from downtown Waverly.

 

Thor is our Svi. Hes going to come in huge during our run next year. 

[hhcmatt]

I thought Thor would be a contributor but never thought he'd be able to shoot like this.

[Norm Peterson]

2 hours ago, REDitus said:

 

To your point Norm, this is something that I have heard about as a golf technique.   You practice your shot in your mind and take a couple of practice swings while visualing the results.   Then when you step up to do it you empty your mind and rely on muscle memory. 

 

Also, I think it shows he's been shooting a lot of treys in off-season/practice and seeing the ball go in which breeds confidence.  Also think he launching the ball earlier in his jump so it's closer to a set shot.   So really he's using more legs than arms.   He's got his elbow in line which is key too.    Definitely tip the hat to him for that.

 

I think Kavas and Green are struggling and it's all mental.  Especially Kavas!  I do have one theory but not sure if it's worth anything.   It could be Kavas was dialed in to the old 3-pt line and he hasn't been able to adjust to the difference.   I money is on mental though , he is rushing due to facing better competition,bigger crowds and TV.   Just needs to see the ball go in and get confident.  Trouble is we are deep into the season. 

 

I remember watching a deal where they had Ron Darling hooked up to some electrodes on his scalp to see where the brain waves were coming from when he'd pitch the ball.  There's a part of your brain that deals with conscious thought, the deliberative part that deals with higher functions. When he would throw the ball, that part would hardly be active at all. The part of the brain that deals with motor function, though, was lit up.

 

To add to your golf analogy, it's why it's so much more difficult to hit a 3 foot putt when there's a lot riding on it.

[Silverbacked1]

I think that we are now playing the kind of game Thorir grew up playing.

 

More a wide open style or Euro style(?). and it lets him be comfortable in his playing.

 

He did this last year when Tim kind of let the guys be more free in their play.