Next Year Huskers vs Jays

[49r]

Norm, you're gonna wear out your up/down'er if you aren't careful!  

[Norm Peterson]

Gotta tap this thing out.  Somehow.  Finger's getting tired. 

[uneblinstu]

We haven't played well in the Qwest/CLink since Nate Johnson hit the layup at the buzzer in the NIT, going on nearly a decade.  I have a hard time saying we'll do that suddenly next year.  NU was supposed to have the advantage after Korver, Sears, McKinney and Funk all left, too and that never turned out to be the case.  Until i actually see us jump Creighton, I can't call it.

[BannedAccount]

I understand the optimism but let's face it.  There are right now 6 guys on the team next year who have never played in a game together with a possibility of 8 total.  That's a lot to ask.  You hear BR and Lee's response and they state the same.  Too early to put expectations on this team that hasn't played a game together.  Sure 3 of them have practiced and understand what Miles wants but if you think they have spent much time with them in developing skills or making them better you are crazy.  The focus has been on the current team we had only and developing them to win games.  I'm not too worried about Creighton as of yet.  Give it a couple of years when the recruiting classes have filled out then decide.  Normally I would say who cares about a team from the Mo Valley that has a less budget and recruits totally different players, but now that they are in the big east it will make it more interesting. 

[Norm Peterson]

I'm not sure changing leagues will give Creighton much of a recruiting boost if at all.  Question for them is how well they'll compete in the new league.  The competition level just ratcheted up for them in a big way.  They had a rep as a mid-major that was often in the tourney and would win a game there every so often.  It'll be interesting to see what they do in their new league.  Are they for sure playing there beginning next season?  That's going to be a tall ladder to climb.  (Not as tall as the B1G, but tall nonetheless.  Certainly taller than the Mo Valley.) 

 

It's not going to be as easy for them to get the auto bid anymore and, without that, they probably don't dance as often.  If they don't dance as often, that will have as big of a negative impact on recruiting as the panache of the new league would have in a positive direction.  So, that might be a push at best.  The question is going to be whether they have the talent to compete year in and year out.  Good luck to them.

 

And, on a brighter note, they won't be mid-majors anymore.

[BannedAccount]

I'm not sure changing leagues will give Creighton much of a recruiting boost if at all.  Question for them is how well they'll compete in the new league.  The competition level just ratcheted up for them in a big way.  They had a rep as a mid-major that was often in the tourney and would win a game there every so often.  It'll be interesting to see what they do in their new league.  Are they for sure playing there beginning next season?  That's going to be a tall ladder to climb.  (Not as tall as the B1G, but tall nonetheless.  Certainly taller than the Mo Valley.) 

 

It's not going to be as easy for them to get the auto bid anymore and, without that, they probably don't dance as often.  If they don't dance as often, that will have as big of a negative impact on recruiting as the panache of the new league would have in a positive direction.  So, that might be a push at best.  The question is going to be whether they have the talent to compete year in and year out.  Good luck to them.

 

And, on a brighter note, they won't be mid-majors anymore.

It will change cause they will be forced to recruit a different type of player.  It also may help them where before they lost on recruits not wanting to play in a "mid-major" conference and now they will be in a major conference.  They can't succeed in the big east recruiting the type of players they have now. And they don't have to worry about winning their conference or tournament anymore.  They can probably finish in the top 5-6 and still have a chance to get an at large bid. 

[cipsucks]

And, on a brighter note, they won't be mid-majors anymore.

That, and their football team will be favored to win their division.....

[Badgett Fan]

I'm not sure changing leagues will give Creighton much of a recruiting boost if at all.  Question for them is how well they'll compete in the new league.  The competition level just ratcheted up for them in a big way.  They had a rep as a mid-major that was often in the tourney and would win a game there every so often.  It'll be interesting to see what they do in their new league.  Are they for sure playing there beginning next season?  That's going to be a tall ladder to climb.  (Not as tall as the B1G, but tall nonetheless.  Certainly taller than the Mo Valley.) 

 

It's not going to be as easy for them to get the auto bid anymore and, without that, they probably don't dance as often.  If they don't dance as often, that will have as big of a negative impact on recruiting as the panache of the new league would have in a positive direction.  So, that might be a push at best.  The question is going to be whether they have the talent to compete year in and year out.  Good luck to them.

 

And, on a brighter note, they won't be mid-majors anymore.

Yes, Creighton is for sure playing in the Big East next year.  And yes, the league will be a taller ladder to climb.  Recruiting will be boosted by the combination of the new conference and the new practice facility.  Recruits seem to care quite a bit about conference affiliation and television exposure, and Creighton has annually lost out on the recruiting front because of its league.  Even if the new Big East is a shadow of the original or current Big East, it will be viewed with much greater favor by high school kids than the Valley ever has been.  You have valid points about what could happen if Creighton struggles, but bad major conference teams still get more recruit looks than MVC Creighton, and Creighton has not achieved something like Gonzaga, Butler or Xavier brand recognition.  Also, remember that Creighton just went through a 4-year NCAA tournament bid drought, so the brand took a bit of a hit pre-McDermott, while other mid-majors were making names for themselves.

 

Personally, I do not see Nebraska beating Creighton next year in Omaha with or without McDermott, unless there is no McDermott and they have an NIT rematch after the new Huskers have had time to gel and experience college ball.  Regardless, I hate the series, as it mostly seems to just flame the passions of those on either side who dislike the other school.  I would rather cheer for both teams.  Much more passionately for Creighton, since I went there.  But, I'd like to see both do well, and hope that I can do so in 3 or so years.  There is such a relatively small group of Nebraskans who care about college hoops, so it is a shame that many of us seem to root against the other team.  One team does not have to surpass the other or dominate the state, and

the current institutional support behind both programs suggests to me that both are in good shape for the future.

 

Sorry, UNO, no one cheers against you yet.

[GoBigRed]

It's a weird situation. Doug has to know there is no better time for him to go pro than now. Creighton will not be as good next year. Doug might still put up numbers next year, but he's going to have to scratch and claw for them against better competition. Look at last night: 4-16 FG, 12-12 FT, 21 points, 9 rebounds. Next year against Georgetown, Marquette, Villanova, Xavier, Butler...going to be tougher without a veteran PG like Gibbs and a huge man down low like Echinique. Whether he was skilled or not, he was a big body who attracted attention away from Doug.

 

But at the same time, he has to know if he leaves the Jays will blow next year and his dad will have to take the brunt of that. I'm sure his dad selfishly wants him to stay, but I really don't think it's in the best interest of his career. He is a 2nd round projection right now in a weak draft class. Sticking around for next year might push him to the bottom of or out of the draft.

 

I think we lose a close one if McDermott stays. We might sneak out a win if he leaves. Creighton fans think their recruiting is going great, but I'm not so convinced. Their guards look very average AT BEST to me. They aren't athletic or talented enough to hang with the teams mentioned above. I think Creighton is really in for a rude awakening. They are used to finishing 1-2 in their conference every year and making the dance. Just because you are in a power conference doesn't mean you are dancing with a middle of the pack team (like Iowa). You still need to perform extremely well against good competition in the non-conference (Illinois, Minnesota). I can't foresee Creighton finishing ahead of Georgetown, Marquette, Xavier, Butler, Villanova. That's a 6th place finish at best in a 10-team conference. That's not going to cut it.

Yeah, I don't know about that.  They have two PFs committed who had very legit sets of offers coming out of HS including one we were trying to get.  They also have a 2-guard/wing who, while he didn't have great offers has some pretty good film and shows exceptional range, very quick wind-up and release and just a nice overall jumpshot plus some ability to penetrate and pass.  Solid looking prospect for them.  According to the White and Blue Review, the kid (the guard/wing) averaged 23 pts/8 bds/6 assists as a junior.  Damn good numbers.  Probably a better shooter than Nathan Hawkins.  And on par with Hawkins athletically.

 

So, I don't think you can say that Creighton's recruiting is going badly.  But, at the end of the day, none of these kids are any substitute for Doug McDermott.  That's a void they won't fill with just one guy.

 

(Edited to add:  Also, according to the W&B Review, the guard/wing kid had an offer from us.  Did not know that.  Rivals doesn't show it.  W&B also says he had an OU offer, which Rivals doesn't show.)

 

Norm, sorry for the confusion. I was referring to the guards currently on their team that I've seen play (Manigat, Chatman, Dingman)...don't know what's on their bench, but they couldn't beat out these guys for playing time. That's the recruiting I was referring to. McDermott hasn't brought in anyone scary really. Their two big-time seniors who are leaving were both transfers. I don't know what they've got signed for the future as I don't follow their recruiting very closely, but I know the guys they've got returning aren't anything we don't have on our roster or coming in next year.

 

Edited to say I've looked at their class, and at least on paper, at best it equals ours. Considering they're a conference championship team two years running and an NCAA Tournament team, and we're coming off one horrible and one bad season recordwise, I'd say that's got me feeling pretty good. If we're recruiting at Creighton's level already in year 2 of Miles while they are at a high point in their program, that says a lot.

[FredsSlacks]

Doug should only leave if he is guaranteed a 1st round pick. There is a big difference between a 1st and 2nd round contract. I think he is a good enough shooter where a team would gamble on him late in the 1st. Adam Morrison was drafted 3rd overall.

 

My gut tells me he will stay for his senior year though.

[Silverbacked1]

yeah, but doug doesn't have the killer bad porn stache

[Norm Peterson]

yeah, but doug doesn't have the killer bad porn stache

And thank goodness for that.

[Silverbacked1]

I understand the optimism but let's face it.  There are right now 6 guys on the team next year who have never played in a game together with a possibility of 8 total.  That's a lot to ask.  You hear BR and Lee's response and they state the same.  Too early to put expectations on this team that hasn't played a game together.  Sure 3 of them have practiced and understand what Miles wants but if you think they have spent much time with them in developing skills or making them better you are crazy.  The focus has been on the current team we had only and developing them to win games.  I'm not too worried about Creighton as of yet.  Give it a couple of years when the recruiting classes have filled out then decide.  Normally I would say who cares about a team from the Mo Valley that has a less budget and recruits totally different players, but now that they are in the big east it will make it more interesting. 

Hey it didn't stop 2buck on another thread

[nustudent]

Unless Creighton has some impact player redshirting or coming in...we will beat them if McDermott leaves.   Losing GE, Gibb and McDermott is a huge loss for that team.   Manigat, Wragge and Chatman are nice players when they are playing alongside a great one (Doug) and a couple of other solid ones (GE & Gibbs) but when you take them away and teams play them honestly...not sure how good they are.   I'll take Rey, Shields and Rivers over Manigat, Wragge and Chatman

[uneblinstu]

I'd like to think so, I just haven't seen NU play well in that building (outside of the Oregon win) in a decade.

[Blindcheck]

McDermott is going to be a solid pro...to me that means 9th or 10th guy on the roster.

He will play for ten years, cash a lot of checks, and still ave his knees when he retires.

That is a pretty good gig, if you can get it...but it will be there next year as well.

[hhcmatt]

BTW, Coach McDermott owns a fairly big edge in head to head matchups over the years vs. Miles.  

Not sure about the relative strengths of those squads.

 

It also doesn't help that we will play early.  At the beginning of this year we could barely beat UNO.  

[aphilso1]

BTW, Coach McDermott owns a fairly big edge in head to head matchups over the years vs. Miles.  

Not sure about the relative strengths of those squads.

 

It also doesn't help that we will play early.  At the beginning of this year we could barely beat UNO.  

Assuming McDermott leaves, I think playing early actually benefits Nebraska.  CU will still be trying to figure out how to replace their top 3 players.  NU will be integrating players into the lineup that have already been on campus a full year.  Both teams will have growing pains, but I would think the Jays adjustments will be more difficult.

[atskooc]

BTW, Coach McDermott owns a fairly big edge in head to head matchups over the years vs. Miles.  

Not sure about the relative strengths of those squads.

 

It also doesn't help that we will play early.  At the beginning of this year we could barely beat UNO.  

Assuming McDermott leaves, I think playing early actually benefits Nebraska.  CU will still be trying to figure out how to replace their top 3 players.  NU will be integrating players into the lineup that have already been on campus a full year.  Both teams will have growing pains, but I would think the Jays adjustments will be more difficult.

Wouldn't Creighton be doing the same thing?

[Norm Peterson]

Who does Creighton have sitting out right now?

 

According to the recruiting matrix at White and Blue Review, Creighton didn't have anyone redshirt or sit out as a transfer this year.  So, I'm not sure how they'll have players to blend in next year who will have been on campus a year unless they have an open tryout for walk-on spots or something.

 

We have guys who have been working and developing with their current/future teammates.  We have three guys who've sat out.  Those guys will each have 2-3 years of college coaching and development, one each with Coach Miles at Nebraska.

 

We're not talking about recruits coming in.  We're talking about the three transfers who sat out.

[Badgett Fan]

Who does Creighton have sitting out right now?

Only one guy, Isaiah Zierden:  http://espn.go.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/player/_/id/110567/isaiah-zierden

 

There are three players who spent nearly all season sitting on the bench: Johnson; Groselle; and Yates.  Johnson and Yates have shown potential at times.  Groselle is a project, like Vooch.  Although he was considered a good recruit, he's looked rough.  http://espn.go.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/player/_/id/123001/geoffrey-groselle

 

Who knows about any of those four guys, but they were a part of the program this year (and Groselle and Johnson have been part of it for two years).

[atskooc]

Who does Creighton have sitting out right now?

 

According to the recruiting matrix at White and Blue Review, Creighton didn't have anyone redshirt or sit out as a transfer this year.  So, I'm not sure how they'll have players to blend in next year who will have been on campus a year unless they have an open tryout for walk-on spots or something.

 

We have guys who have been working and developing with their current/future teammates.  We have three guys who've sat out.  Those guys will each have 2-3 years of college coaching and development, one each with Coach Miles at Nebraska.

 

We're not talking about recruits coming in.  We're talking about the three transfers who sat out.

I understand that.  But if Creighton loses their top three players they'll have to fill those spots with guys who saw considerably less time last year, but were still part of the program under McDermott.  Whether they are filling in with redshirts who have been in the program a year or with guys who spent a majority of their time on the bench, they're going to have to integrate new players into the lineup.  The only way that won't happen is if they were to return all of their starters. 

 

The difference I see is we will be integrating (up to three) players who probably could have started for us this year but were sitting out.  Creighton's integration will be with guys who obviously weren't good enough to start this year.

[Cousin Mose]

The guard/combo (Harris) was under the radar because of an injury but did make and play on the USA U-18 team.  What the conference change does for Creighton is takes away a potential reason recruits wind up somewhere else.  Pierre Jackson was down to the Jays and Baylor, had he picked Creighton if they were in the Big East, I don't know, but it would have certainly helped.  There have been many near misses over the years that you have to believe one or two would have hit had the conference been different.

[Creighton Fan]

I guess I'd say the whole thread is premature as both teams are still recruiting for next year.

 

Since both teams are pursuing some JUCOs, the expectation is that those JUCOs, if signed, will contribute from day one.

[Cookie Belcher]

I guess I'd say the whole thread is premature as both teams are still recruiting for next year.

Since both teams are pursuing some JUCOs, the expectation is that those JUCOs, if signed, will contribute from day one.

What are you guys hearing about Doug? Any lean one way or the other?