The +/- Thread

[GhostOfJoeMcCray]

Decided to make this its own thread and I'll add updates after every game. 

 

I like tracking +/- because, although not perfect, I think it's a great way to see who impacts winning. And Fred mentions it often so I know the staff values it to some degree. One thing to keep in mind is offense for defense substitutions can skew things. For example, Sam Hoiberg (defense) for Connor Essegian (offense) late in games would only mean Hoiberg has potential to decrease while Essegian only has potential to increase, which isn't totally fair to Hoiberg. 

 

But overall throughout the course of a season, I think it can be telling. We're already seeing how valuable Juwan Gary and Rollie Worster are, which was expected. Perhaps unexpected is Berke's impact through 3 games. 

 

+/- vs. FDU

Hoiberg +22

Griffiths +19

Ulis +14

Berke +12

Jacobsen +12

Gary +12

Williams +10

Worster +7

Essegian +5

Burt +5

Grace +5

Morgan +3

Season +/- (Team +51)

Berke +45

Gary +38

Worster +37

Griffiths +30

Essegian +23

Morgan +17

Hoiberg +16

Williams +16

Jacobsen +12

Ulis +9

Grace +5

Burt +5

Meah +2

[Vinny]

I agree to an extent that offense/defense substitutions can skew one way or the other. But when Sam is creating fast break points with his defense, it skews the other way really quickly. And last night he did that.

[GhostOfJoeMcCray]

Just now, Vinny said:

I agree to an extent that offense/defense substitutions can skew one way or the other. But when Sam is creating fast break points with his defense, it skews the other way really quickly. And last night he did that.

 

True. Sam being a team-high +22 while scoring 2 points and going 1-4 is really just incredible if you think about it. Really hope his 3 ball starts falling soon. At some point it has to...

 

[GhostOfJoeMcCray]

+/- vs. St. Mary's

Williams +7

Meah +1

Berke 0

Essegian 0

Griffiths 0

Hoiberg 0

Worster -1

Ulis -3

Morgan -7

Gary -12

Season +/- (Team +48)

Berke +45

Worster +36

Griffiths +30

Gary +26

Essegian +23

Williams +23

Hoiberg +16

Jacobsen +12

Morgan +10

Ulis +6

Grace +5

Burt +5

Meah +1

Edited November 17, 2024 by GhostOfJoeMcCray

[hskr4life]

At the end of the day-- I think our best option for a slimmed rotation is pretty obvious.

 

Starters: Williams, Berke, Worster, Gary, Morgan (or another guard)

 

Subs: Griffiths, Essegian, Hoiberg (went with Hoi over Ulis as I think Sam is more of a disruption defensively, does the little things right, and dirty work)

 

Spot Minutes: Meah (if bigs are in foul trouble, breathers at the end of the half, or teams with big posts), Ulis (if guards are in foul trouble, injuries, etc)

[TourneyBound]

On 11/17/2024 at 4:23 PM, GhostOfJoeMcCray said:

+/- vs. St. Mary's

Williams +7

Meah +1

Berke 0

Essegian 0

Griffiths 0

Hoiberg 0

Worster -1

Ulis -3

Morgan -7

Gary -12

Season +/- (Team +48)

Berke +45

Worster +36

Griffiths +30

Gary +26

Essegian +23

Williams +23

Hoiberg +16

Jacobsen +12

Morgan +10

Ulis +6

Grace +5

Burt +5

Meah +1

Interesting numbers for this game.  Gary really jumps out.  Also that stretch in 2nd half when Brice picked up his 4th foul was huge.  Prolly cost us the win.  I was at the game and had some pretty good seats to see what was happening out there..  Watching Gary when he runs it sure looks like he is still favoring that shoulder but maybe its just me.  Has anyone else noticed this or is it just me??  Also saw Morgan and Brice getting into it early in game as Morgan wasn't where he was supposed to be.  Would be nice to combine Morgans offensive abilities with Meah's fire and defensive abilities into one player.

[millerhusker]

23 minutes ago, TourneyBound said:

Also that stretch in 2nd half when Brice picked up his 4th foul was huge.  Prolly cost us the win.  

Was a pretty selfish frustration foul 90 feet from the basket. You have to be smarter than that. 

[jsthusker]

On 11/18/2024 at 8:42 AM, hskr4life said:

At the end of the day-- I think our best option for a slimmed rotation is pretty obvious.

 

Starters: Williams, Berke, Worster, Gary, Morgan (or another guard)

 

Subs: Griffiths, Essegian, Hoiberg (went with Hoi over Ulis as I think Sam is more of a disruption defensively, does the little things right, and dirty work)

 

Spot Minutes: Meah (if bigs are in foul trouble, breathers at the end of the half, or teams with big posts), Ulis (if guards are in foul trouble, injuries, etc)

Totally agree.  I don't understand why Meah starts.  He is big but has little to no skill.

 

[GhostOfJoeMcCray]

+/- at Creighton

Gary +11

Meah +9

Hoiberg +9

Berke +8

Essegian +8

Ulis +5

Worster +4

Griffiths +4

Williams +1

Morgan +1

Jacobsen -5

 

Notable from this game: Gary was the best player on the court and it shows at +11. Meah easily had his best game as a Husker. Williams at +1 in an 11-point win is interesting. The Jacobsen at the 5 emergency lineup for 1 minute didn't go well. 

Season +/- (Team +59)

Berke +53

Worster +40

Gary +37

Griffiths +34

Essegian +31

Hoiberg +25

Williams +24

Meah +12

Morgan +11

Ulis +11

Jacobsen +7

Grace +5

Burt +5

[AGHANSEN]

Good stuff. 

Thanks for doing this.

Berke has been really good so far.

I have been surprised by his rebounding ability. 

If he can starts hitting some threes, look out. 

[basketballjones]

53 minutes ago, GhostOfJoeMcCray said:

Meah easily had his best game as a Husker.

A bit misleading. 

 

He sat quite a bit because of fouls, and (I don't believe) none of his fouls were shooting fouls, so they didn't score on those possessions before he sat down. He only played 11 minutes, had 0 points, 0 blocks, 0 assists, 1 steal. 

[GhostOfJoeMcCray]

Just now, basketballjones said:

A bit misleading. 

 

He sat quite a bit because of fouls, and (I don't believe) none of his fouls were shooting fouls, so they didn't score on those possessions before he sat down. He only played 11 minutes, had 0 points, 0 blocks, 0 assists, 1 steal. 

 

And it was still easily his best game as a Husker. 

[basketballjones]

3 minutes ago, GhostOfJoeMcCray said:

 

And it was still easily his best game as a Husker. 

Lol. I suppose. 

 

I should say, "His +/- is misleading."

[GhostOfJoeMcCray]

Just now, basketballjones said:

Lol. I suppose. 

 

I should say, "His +/- is misleading."

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a fan of his at all, BUT that performance is about all we need from him: 

 

10-15 minutes

6 rebounds

0 missed shots (if he gets a dunk opportunity, great. Otherwise don't be handling the ball or trying to score)

0 turnovers

Solid, physical defense

Took away the other team's big man 

[basketballjones]

Just now, GhostOfJoeMcCray said:

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a fan of his at all, BUT that performance is about all we need from him: 

 

10-15 minutes

6 rebounds

0 missed shots (if he gets a dunk opportunity, great. Otherwise don't be handling the ball or trying to score)

0 turnovers

Solid, physical defense

Took away the other team's big man 

Hmmmm.... I expected more. I'd like to see 4-6ppg on lobs, put-backs, and a FT here and there. 

 

And, "took away the other team's big man," is a bit of stretch considering he played 11 minutes and everyone else did too. 

 

But sure, you win. 

[GhostOfJoeMcCray]

Just now, basketballjones said:

Hmmmm.... I expected more. I'd like to see 4-6ppg on lobs, put-backs, and a FT here and there. 

 

And, "took away the other team's big man," is a bit of stretch considering he played 11 minutes and everyone else did too. 

 

But sure, you win. 

 

I wouldn't say I won anything. Maybe I have low expectations based on his first three games. Also by 10-15 minutes I actually meant 8-10. I still prefer our team and style of play when he isn't on the court. 

[Norm Peterson]

1 hour ago, GhostOfJoeMcCray said:

+/- at Creighton

Gary +11

Meah +9

Hoiberg +9

Berke +8

Essegian +8

Ulis +5

Worster +4

Griffiths +4

Williams +1

Morgan +1

Jacobsen -5

 

Notable from this game: Gary was the best player on the court and it shows at +11. Meah easily had his best game as a Husker. Williams at +1 in an 11-point win is interesting. The Jacobsen at the 5 emergency lineup for 1 minute didn't go well. 

Season +/- (Team +59)

Berke +53

Worster +40

Gary +37

Griffiths +34

Essegian +31

Hoiberg +25

Williams +24

Meah +12

Morgan +11

Ulis +11

Jacobsen +7

Grace +5

Burt +5

 

Confirming what my eyes have been telling me.

 

Edited to add: Meaning the season +/-

Edited November 25, 2024 by Norm Peterson
clarification

[GhostOfJoeMcCray]

1 minute ago, Norm Peterson said:

 

Confirming what my eyes have been telling me.

 

That Berke is a stud?

[Norm Peterson]

1 minute ago, GhostOfJoeMcCray said:

 

That Berke is a stud?

 

Yeah. Dude cares. I see a lot of hustle out of him.

[Norm Peterson]

2 minutes ago, GhostOfJoeMcCray said:

 

That Berke is a stud?

 

I'll also add I like Morgan. I'd like to see a little more of him. I think him and Berke in the front court make a good combo.

[Nebrasketball1979]

10 minutes ago, GhostOfJoeMcCray said:

13 minutes ago, basketballjones said:

Hmmmm.... I expected more. I'd like to see 4-6ppg on lobs, put-backs, and a FT here and there. 

 

And, "took away the other team's big man," is a bit of stretch considering he played 11 minutes and everyone else did too. 

 

But sure, you win. 

 

I wouldn't say I won anything. Maybe I have low expectations based on his first three games. Also by 10-15 minutes I actually meant 8-10. I still prefer our team and style of play when he isn't on the court. 

 

This seems like an odd debate, of which the irony is not lost on me that I will now join .  I think most everyone understands what Meah is at this point.  He's a role player that currently starts.  His job is to be a presence in the paint, bang with the other team's bigs, protect the rim and grab rebounds.  He doesn't need to score and if he simply puts the thought in the other teams' head that it will be difficult to score inside the paint when he's in, then that's a big win and makes everyone else's defensive assignments far easier.

 

What he did against Creighton was fantastic.  If we get 10-15 minutes of that every game, then I think he will have fulfilled his role very well and will continue to be a key rotational piece.

[Vinny]

1 hour ago, basketballjones said:

Hmmmm.... I expected more. I'd like to see 4-6ppg on lobs, put-backs, and a FT here and there. 

 

And, "took away the other team's big man," is a bit of stretch considering he played 11 minutes and everyone else did too. 

 

But sure, you win. 

We shut Kalk down on offense, but let’s not forget he was in there defending Meah too for those 11 minutes.

[Huskerpapa]

1 hour ago, basketballjones said:

Hmmmm.... I expected more. I'd like to see 4-6ppg on lobs, put-backs, and a FT here and there. 

 

And, "took away the other team's big man," is a bit of stretch considering he played 11 minutes and everyone else did too. 

 

But sure, you win. 

I believe once we start heating up from the perimeter, the lobs and dunks will come.  Right now, the opposition sags to the paint in order to stop our drives rather than come out to pressure most of our shooters.

Edited November 25, 2024 by Huskerpapa

[Art Vandalay]

6 minutes ago, Huskerpapa said:

I believe once we start heating up from the perimeter, the lobs and dunks will come.  Right now, the opposition sags to the paint in order to stop our drives rather than come out to pressure most of our shooters.

We are not very good looking for the lob. I’ve noticed a few times guys could have just thrown it up there for him but didn’t.

[basketballjones]

1 hour ago, Nebrasketball1979 said:

 

This seems like an odd debate, of which the irony is not lost on me that I will now join .  I think most everyone understands what Meah is at this point.  He's a role player that currently starts.  His job is to be a presence in the paint, bang with the other team's bigs, protect the rim and grab rebounds.  He doesn't need to score and if he simply puts the thought in the other teams' head that it will be difficult to score inside the paint when he's in, then that's a big win and makes everyone else's defensive assignments far easier.

 

What he did against Creighton was fantastic.  If we get 10-15 minutes of that every game, then I think he will have fulfilled his role very well and will continue to be a key rotational piece.

This is implying that the gameplan was for him to only get 10-15 minutes. Which is incorrect. He clearly was projected to play a significant amount more. He played 11 minutes and nearly fouled out. They couldn't keep him on the court.