Honest question: True Freshmen vs. Redshirt Sophomores

[uneblinstu]

Pitchford also had an Indiana offer...

[PimpMario]

Norm, to me it is simple.

 

We lose 2 starters this year.  and we lose 3 of our top 7 players.

 

So that leaves us with 4 players.  When you add in 3 transfers and 3 freshmen you get to 10 scholarship players.  If the 3 starters from this year can find 2 other illegitimate starters (out of Parker and the 6 new players) than we our starting 5 should be pretyt good (maybe not as good as this year, especially not to start the season.  

 

But I think many people, myself included feel that we will be better next year because we  will have a bench.  I don't see us subbing 5 in and out at a time but having 3 or 4 legitimate bench contributors, even for 5-15 minutes a game will be huge.

 

I am okay with playing a little small in the type of system miles runs (and I think he is okay with it).  But I beat everyone would rather go small by choice and not out of necessity.   

 

By the way, I think we could be better next year but not have as better record.  Have you seen the conference we play in?  We probably won't get 2 games against PSU next year and we have to go to Northwestern.  So that would put us down to 2 wins this year. 

[49r]

By the way, I think we could be better next year but not have as better record.  Have you seen the conference we play in?  We probably won't get 2 games against PSU next year and we have to go to Northwestern.  So that would put us down to 2 wins this year. 

 

I would imagine that our single-plays will change next year.  IOW, we'll probably play Northwestern, Michigan, Purdue and Indiana home and home while 4 of our 7 home and home will switch to single play.  Which is to say, it's not an absolute given that we won't play PSU twice, only about 55-45 that we don't.

[BigTexHusker]

I'm not sure we'll be better by the bottom line (wins and losses) next season, but I definitely think the level of execution on the court will be elevated.  That, to me, is much easier to watch than what we have this year, even if the winning % is worse.  I think one of the most important factors will be the increased skill this group of 3 RS and 3 Frosh possesses.

 

Miles has talked about the need to reshape his normal offense this year because of the lack of shooters and of draw and kick guys.  To me this intimates that even the coaches were working at less than ideal conditions - conditions to some degree that are unfamiliar to them.  To me, it's akin to coming into an option team as an offensive coordinator, and trying to run the pro style offense you ran at your last job for 5 years.  The talent just takes some time to line up with the specific needs of the offense.

 

It's hard enough for a coach to formulate a game plan to combat an opponent's strengths when he's working with a system he's comfortable with, but it's extremely hard to do that when you are going at it with less than 100% of the tools you're used to working with.  Based on Miles' comments about the three guys already signed and the 3 RS guys, the tools he's accustomed to going into battle with, will be in his stable next season.

[Red Rum]

I'm not sure we'll be better by the bottom line (wins and losses) next season, but I definitely think the level of execution on the court will be elevated.  That, to me, is much easier to watch than what we have this year, even if the winning % is worse.  I think one of the most important factors will be the increased skill this group of 3 RS and 3 Frosh possesses.

 

Miles has talked about the need to reshape his normal offense this year because of the lack of shooters and of draw and kick guys.  To me this intimates that even the coaches were working at less than ideal conditions - conditions to some degree that are unfamiliar to them.  To me, it's akin to coming into an option team as an offensive coordinator, and trying to run the pro style offense you ran at your last job for 5 years.  The talent just takes some time to line up with the specific needs of the offense.

 

It's hard enough for a coach to formulate a game plan to combat an opponent's strengths when he's working with a system he's comfortable with, but it's extremely hard to do that when you are going at it with less than 100% of the tools you're used to working with.  Based on Miles' comments about the three guys already signed and the 3 RS guys, the tools he's accustomed to going into battle with, will be in his stable next season.

 

I hope it works out better for Coach Miles than the coach you eluded to in that second paragraph...

[cipsucks]

Reading through this thread, I got to thinking:  I wonder whatever happened to turkeycorn?

[Huskerpapa]

It may be a false rumor, but I heard today that the group of Vooch, Biggs, Pitchford, Petteway and Tyrance consistantly beat the current starters in scrimmages.  Now, the guy who told me this may have been blowing smoke up my arse, but I am just conveying what he said.

[uneblinstu]

Well, assistant coaches have said that on the radio more than once.  Didn't specifically say who the 2nd team was, just that the second team runs circles around the starters fairly regularly.  I believe it was Coach Harriman who gave the 2nd team credit for the Northwestern win because once they got a handle on the Princeton offense, they had better athletes than NW did so when they got to the game, what the Wildcats threw at them was simple in comparison.

[Neebraska]

Assume the talent level remains exactly the same.

We will be better next year solely on depth.

The one thing that we will lose is a couple of seniors that have really played their tails off down the stretch for us, we could take a step back just due to a lack urgency by young group of more athletic players. One would assume Miles will head that off.

[Norm Peterson]

It may be a false rumor, but I heard today that the group of Vooch, Biggs, Pitchford, Petteway and Tyrance consistantly beat the current starters in scrimmages.  Now, the guy who told me this may have been blowing smoke up my arse, but I am just conveying what he said.

Hmmmm.  Not. Sure. I. Believe.

 

Tyrance?  Vooch?  Beating the starters?  Consistently?

 

Tyrance doesn't even get minutes over Benny Parker.  And Vooch doesn't get minutes ahead of Tyrance.  I mean, we're basically playing 5 guys because Miles doesn't seem to think the rest of the eligible players are serviceable.  If they were, they'd be getting into games and playing more than 1 minute against Illinois.

 

So, call me skeptical on this one.

[atskooc]

It may be a false rumor, but I heard today that the group of Vooch, Biggs, Pitchford, Petteway and Tyrance consistantly beat the current starters in scrimmages.  Now, the guy who told me this may have been blowing smoke up my arse, but I am just conveying what he said.

Hmmmm.  Not. Sure. I. Believe.

 

Tyrance?  Vooch?  Beating the starters?  Consistently?

 

Tyrance doesn't even get minutes over Benny Parker.  And Vooch doesn't get minutes ahead of Tyrance.  I mean, we're basically playing 5 guys because Miles doesn't seem to think the rest of the eligible players are serviceable.  If they were, they'd be getting into games and playing more than 1 minute against Illinois.

 

So, call me skeptical on this one.

I'm with you on this one, Norm.

 

That rumor says our starting five gets beat by three guys.  I doubt that's the case.

 

That said, if it's true, that means the three we're bringing in next year are a hell of a lot better than the two who are leaving.  I'd take it, but I doubt I'll get it.

[kldm64]

It may be a false rumor, but I heard today that the group of Vooch, Biggs, Pitchford, Petteway and Tyrance consistantly beat the current starters in scrimmages.  Now, the guy who told me this may have been blowing smoke up my arse, but I am just conveying what he said.

Hmmmm.  Not. Sure. I. Believe.

 

Tyrance?  Vooch?  Beating the starters?  Consistently?

 

Tyrance doesn't even get minutes over Benny Parker.  And Vooch doesn't get minutes ahead of Tyrance.  I mean, we're basically playing 5 guys because Miles doesn't seem to think the rest of the eligible players are serviceable.  If they were, they'd be getting into games and playing more than 1 minute against Illinois.

 

So, call me skeptical on this one.

 

I attended one of the Husker FAC events they had at N-Zone and Coach Harriman spoke at it since Miles couldn't be there and he said that the transfer players consistantly beat up on the starters.  The reason he mentioned this was he was asked about recruiting and he spoke about getting more athletic players and how the players currently sitting out this year often times dominate the starters in practice.  I don't think he was talking about Vooch, Tyrance, or Parker but mainly the 3 transfer players.

 

When the coaches say it, it's not a rumor.

[colhusker]

Norm

 

If this is an honest question, does that mean when you asked your other questions you were not being honest with us?

[Norm Peterson]

Sometimes I ask rhetorical questions where I think I already know the answer.  I called this one an "honest" question because I honestly didn't have an answer.  Because it wasn't a question that I already had answered in my own mind, so I'm saying it's a genuine question and not a rhetorical one.

 

I know you're being facetious but that's why I described it the way I did.

[Hooper]

It may be a false rumor, but I heard today that the group of Vooch, Biggs, Pitchford, Petteway and Tyrance consistantly beat the current starters in scrimmages.  Now, the guy who told me this may have been blowing smoke up my arse, but I am just conveying what he said.

 

I have visions of Vooch just abusing the starters in practice, hitting sky hooks like Kareem, doing power dunks like Shaq, blocking shots like Hakeem, to the point where Miles has to yell for him to come out because the confidence of our starters is taking such a hit. 

[Norm Peterson]

It may be a false rumor, but I heard today that the group of Vooch, Biggs, Pitchford, Petteway and Tyrance consistantly beat the current starters in scrimmages.  Now, the guy who told me this may have been blowing smoke up my arse, but I am just conveying what he said.

 

I have visions of Vooch just abusing the starters in practice, hitting sky hooks like Kareem, doing power dunks like Shaq, blocking shots like Hakeem, to the point where Miles has to yell for him to come out because the confidence of our starters is taking such a hit. 

Yeah, Vooch is just slow-playin' the rest of the B1G.  He figures he'll be a shoe-in for most improved player next year when he busts out and shows 'em what he really can do.  He and Miles chuckle every day after practice.  Like the best inside joke ever.  "Yeah, Sergej, rest of the B1G thinks you suck.  Just wait till next year.  Man, can't wait to see the looks in their faces when they see how you really play.  That's gonna be so funny, I'm dying just thinking about it."   ​ 

[TheKamdyMan]

 

It may be a false rumor, but I heard today that the group of Vooch, Biggs, Pitchford, Petteway and Tyrance consistantly beat the current starters in scrimmages.  Now, the guy who told me this may have been blowing smoke up my arse, but I am just conveying what he said.

 

I have visions of Vooch just abusing the starters in practice, hitting sky hooks like Kareem, doing power dunks like Shaq, blocking shots like Hakeem, to the point where Miles has to yell for him to come out because the confidence of our starters is taking such a hit. 

Yeah, Vooch is just slow-playin' the rest of the B1G.  He figures he'll be a shoe-in for most improved player next year when he busts out and shows 'em what he really can do.  He and Miles chuckle every day after practice.  Like the best inside joke ever.  "Yeah, Sergej, rest of the B1G thinks you suck.  Just wait till next year.  Man, can't wait to see the looks in their faces when they see how you really play.  That's gonna be so funny, I'm dying just thinking about it."   ​ 

 

Miles is saving him to also become B1G COY with the greatest turnaround in league history with the new players coming in.

[Norm Peterson]

 

 

It may be a false rumor, but I heard today that the group of Vooch, Biggs, Pitchford, Petteway and Tyrance consistantly beat the current starters in scrimmages.  Now, the guy who told me this may have been blowing smoke up my arse, but I am just conveying what he said.

 

I have visions of Vooch just abusing the starters in practice, hitting sky hooks like Kareem, doing power dunks like Shaq, blocking shots like Hakeem, to the point where Miles has to yell for him to come out because the confidence of our starters is taking such a hit. 

Yeah, Vooch is just slow-playin' the rest of the B1G.  He figures he'll be a shoe-in for most improved player next year when he busts out and shows 'em what he really can do.  He and Miles chuckle every day after practice.  Like the best inside joke ever.  "Yeah, Sergej, rest of the B1G thinks you suck.  Just wait till next year.  Man, can't wait to see the looks in their faces when they see how you really play.  That's gonna be so funny, I'm dying just thinking about it."   ​ 

 

Miles is saving him to also become B1G COY with the greatest turnaround in league history with the new players coming in.

Where I come from, they call that a conspiracy. 

 

(No tinfoil hat smiley, doggonit.)

[colhusker]

Norm was just busting your chops a bit up there.

[Cookie Belcher]

I think the only thing that changes the analysis for how well we'll do next year is landing a center. A big guy. A big strong guy. If we have to play small next year, it'll be like playing with a short bench this year and I think we'll pretty much struggle to finish any higher than we will this year.

That being said, I get that the transfers are older, more physically mature and have a year of practicing with Coach Miles. Probably 80% of the advantage of experience that the transfers have over the freshmen, though, will disappear by the time of tipoff for the first game. And then we'll be comparing talent and athleticism and who has it. So, forget experience for the moment. I mean, Gallegos' experience will count for more than Petteway's but we're not talking about Gallegos. Or Shields, or Rivers. We're comparing three guys who haven't played a minute in a Husker uni against three other guys who haven't played a minute in a Husker uni.

And when the games go live next fall, I think it'll all come down to who's more talented and athletic. And I'm not going to bet against the freshmen.

Biggs has played a minute in a Husker uniform

[nustudent]

It may be a false rumor, but I heard today that the group of Vooch, Biggs, Pitchford, Petteway and Tyrance consistantly beat the current starters in scrimmages.  Now, the guy who told me this may have been blowing smoke up my arse, but I am just conveying what he said.

Don't think it's a false rumor.   If it is...it's very well done.

[nustudent]

I think we will be better.

 

If for nothing else...we will be longer, more athletic and have depth.  

 

We won't miss Almeida at all.   Ubel plays hard and is a decent, solid player but not spectacular.   Talley is a good player.   But I don't think any of those are irreplaceable.

 

Shields will only be better.  Rivers will only be better.  Gallegos will only be better.   We add to them a supposed top 50 recruit in Webster.   Fuller is highly touted.  Hawkins has potential.  Petteway, Biggs and Pitchford are well regarded.  Looks like we will get Atewe.  I'm not ready to write off Vooch yet either.  I can easily see Atewe/Pitchford/Vooch > or = Ubel/Almeida this year.   Add in more experience and depth at the 3 in guys like long bodies like Fuller, Petteway and Rivers and you can easily be better in the front court.

 

I think Webster/Biggs/Gallegos/Petteway/Rivers/Hawkins/Shields is > or = Gallegos/Talley/Peltz/Shields/Rivers/Parker.

 

Also doesn't consider the growth you take in year 2 as a program under the new coach

[49r]

Okay, who are you, and does nustudent know you've stolen his password?  

[Norm Peterson]

It may be a false rumor, but I heard today that the group of Vooch, Biggs, Pitchford, Petteway and Tyrance consistantly beat the current starters in scrimmages.  Now, the guy who told me this may have been blowing smoke up my arse, but I am just conveying what he said.

Don't think it's a false rumor.   If it is...it's very well done.

Please explain.  I take it you've heard this from others also?

[leonidas]

 

It may be a false rumor, but I heard today that the group of Vooch, Biggs, Pitchford, Petteway and Tyrance consistantly beat the current starters in scrimmages.  Now, the guy who told me this may have been blowing smoke up my arse, but I am just conveying what he said.

Don't think it's a false rumor.   If it is...it's very well done.

Please explain.  I take it you've heard this from others also?

 

There's an LJS article in which Miles says that there are days that the scout team “[has] their way with us in practice."  Now I don't know who's on the scout team other than Biggs, Pitchford and Pettaway but I don't think it matters (does it matter if it's Vucetic or any other scrub playing the 5?).  What matters is that the Biggs/Pitchford/Pettaway combo are good enough to beat the starters in an offense those three learned a couple of days before presumably. 

 

I don't know if we can argue that it's a rumor anymore.  At this point, it sounds like enough have heard it to be true and multiple coaches have pretty much said the same thing.