Other boards?

[HuskerBB]

Thought I would check out other boards over the noon hour to see what people might be saying about the game or the arena.   The rivals basketball board did not have a single post in November - nothing about the game last night at all - before, during or after.  Knew that one was pretty much history but did not know it was that completely dead.

 

Against my better judgement I went over to the free rivals Husker board and there were a couple threads about the game/arena but nothing of substance.  Could not resist clicking on a couple of other threads on that board which was a mistake.  I have long since given up access to RSS and know I don't want to go back there but I am pretty sure it had no intelligent conversation about basketball or anything else. 

 

I still had a saved link to Huskerpedia - which is now Husker Max.  They had a thread during the game for updates for people not there but not a single post after that at all.

 

Not really looking around but are there any other boards anymore that comment substantively on Husker Basketball or does HHC now have a complete monopoly?   Would not be a bad thing - but makes it more important to keep this one from getting polluted and taken over like some of the football boards.

 

 

[hhcmatt]

cornnation.com and journalstar.com have in-game threads.

[Norm Peterson]

I occasionally talk about what I describe as the paradox of the insider.  Some insiders can be good but it depends on how they handle it.  If it's about having their own egos stroked, they can just kill a message board.  The Rivals hoops board is a great example.  The place is dead.  Like a ghost town.  I know some might disagree with me but I think it's because a certain insider needed too much to have his ego stroked and it just shut down conversation.  Brought it to a dead halt.  You can't discuss anything with the guy who lays the ultimate trump card in every conversation.  A similar phenomenon occurred on the free board over there.  They have enough people to keep it going but the quality of the discussions over there suffered greatly.

 

We had a guy over here make a couple of posts where he intimated that he was a close personal friend of Tim Miles' sister.  And when people didn't bend to kiss his ring quickly enough, he got his nose bent out of joint and left.  And I'm hoping he didn't let the door hit him in the ass on his way out.  That kind of insider will ruin a message board.  It becomes an "ask the expert" board before too long.  But that's never interesting enough to keep the thing going.

[Handy Johnson]

These aren't message boards 'per say, but some thoughts from others regarding the Huskers. ESPN B1G beat writer has us last of course, and said "Mile's Huskers have the same old problems", whatever that means, depth/talent I guess. Ameila Rayno of the Star Trib had us last as well, citing the return of Drew Crawford @ NW, & Tim Frazier @ PSU as the sole reasons they will be better than us. Lazy, lazy journalism. Nobody ever mentions ANY of our players either returning or newcomers. Can't wait 'til we shut ALOT of people up.  

[hskr4life]

These aren't message boards 'per say, but some thoughts from others regarding the Huskers. ESPN B1G beat writer has us last of course, and said "Mile's Huskers have the same old problems", whatever that means, depth/talent I guess. Ameila Rayno of the Star Trib had us last as well, citing the return of Drew Crawford @ NW, & Tim Frazier @ PSU as the sole reasons they will be better than us. Lazy, lazy journalism. Nobody ever mentions ANY of our players either returning or newcomers. Can't wait 'til we shut ALOT of people up.  

 

This^^^ years past we were picked last last last all the time.  We have not had this much potential in a long time and we are picked last again.  We continue to surprise people every year by winning more than we should... beating a team we shouldnt have.  This year if people look past us, I think we will honestly have a pretty decent shot of showing them that we are not scrub.

[Huskerpapa]

What is interesting (and this is far from the only thing) about this very fine location is that we have had more than our share of experts who actually just blended into the discussions.  I wish all of them would come back.  Oftentimes they could share enough information that would actually stimulate the discussion rather than shut it down. 

 

I also think that we are a "go to" location for many, who are seeking the experience from true, diehard Husker basketball fans.  A good example was/is the discussion about Fuller on another thread.  I think we all can agree that we believe he can be a very good player, but struggled with both his shot and quickness in the exhibition win.  It is not about bashing a kid - yet like in almost any board, that can/does take place on occasion. 

 

I also find it interesting that oftentimes a stimulating discussion on this board will oftentimes migrate into one or more of our local papers.  I actually think that is fantastic!

[a0t0w0]

HHC is where it's at. I haven't found any other site that compares discussion wise.

 

Years ago I searched high and low before stumbling across this site (actually I think I saw it referenced on huskerpedia).  A poster there thought this forum felt "weird".  Couldn't disagree more.

[royalfan]

Easily my favorite message board of any I have ever been involved with in any sport or topic.  Great posters like Norm, 49r and many others make it a great board. 

[hhcmatt]

If there aren't any other Husker BB boards of note out there I'm more than happy to tweet about our dominance.

[HuskerBB]

I occasionally talk about what I describe as the paradox of the insider.  Some insiders can be good but it depends on how they handle it.  If it's about having their own egos stroked, they can just kill a message board.  The Rivals hoops board is a great example.  The place is dead.  Like a ghost town.  I know some might disagree with me but I think it's because a certain insider needed too much to have his ego stroked and it just shut down conversation.  Brought it to a dead halt.  You can't discuss anything with the guy who lays the ultimate trump card in every conversation.  A similar phenomenon occurred on the free board over there.  They have enough people to keep it going but the quality of the discussions over there suffered greatly.

 

We had a guy over here make a couple of posts where he intimated that he was a close personal friend of Tim Miles' sister.  And when people didn't bend to kiss his ring quickly enough, he got his nose bent out of joint and left.  And I'm hoping he didn't let the door hit him in the ass on his way out.  That kind of insider will ruin a message board.  It becomes an "ask the expert" board before too long.  But that's never interesting enough to keep the thing going.

 

What I have found is that most people who put themselves out as an "insider" on a message board are usually the farthest thing from being an "insider".   People who a truly loyal to the program and have solid information are generally going to keep that information to themselves or be very careful about how it gets let out - and they will generally be the first to disclaim any actual knowledge and the last to use message board postings as a way to "stroke their ego".

 

As far as the rivals basketball board I am not sure who you are referring to but I used to frequent that board also.  nustudent was over there and on this board also for awhile and he brushed alot of people the wrong way - but in his case I always thought he was simply opinionated and a little arrogant - but not an imposter or someone who was not truly loyal to the program.   Maybe you are thinking about someone else - but I don't really remember too much as that board has been pretty dead since this one really got going.

[MandRHusker]

HHC and the Rivals Red Sea Scrolls are my two sources for info on Huskers men's and women's basketball. There were several interesting threads in RSS last night about the game and Robin had a nice write up on both the game and Tai Webster. By and large, though, HHC is the best source for general Husker talk and Rivals is best for Husker MBB recruiting.

[HuskerBB]

HHC and the Rivals Red Sea Scrolls are my two sources for info on Huskers men's and women's basketball. There were several interesting threads in RSS last night about the game and Robin had a nice write up on both the game and Tai Webster. By and large, though, HHC is the best source for general Husker talk and Rivals is best for Husker MBB recruiting.

 

I have been off RSS for some time now - but there used to be some people on there who professed to know things about what was going on with the BB program who were completely full of sh!t.  Not talking about Robin - some of their other so called experts of all things NU.  From what I have seen posted elsewhere the level of discussion on that board for football has done nothing but go down since I left - so I would expect it hasn't gotten much better with respect to basketball although most there don't really care about basketball anyway.

[MandRHusker]

The MBB discussion is much more sporadic on RSS but the recruiting news and articles are top rate. There are a few intelligent posters on RSS but generally HHC is better, much more robust.

[HuskerBB]

Yeah I know that Rivals has some good recrutiing resources.   I never spent too much time on that anyway. 

 

My theory (which I believe holds true) is that every coach knows way more about a kid's talent and ability to fit into their program than any recruiting service will ever know.   So I just hope that we are able to get the kids we say we are going after and I don't give 2 cents for how many stars some recruiting service gives that player.   I will acknowledge, however, that at least on some level knowing which other schools are recruiting a kid does give you some amount of general information about the kinds of players that we are "trying" to recruit and that is an important aspect that doesn't get directly factored into my "theory".   It seems pretty clear that Miles is setting his sights on a higher caliber of player than Doc was - and you need to take that into account if you are measuring recruiting success by whether or not we are getting the players we are after.   Some attribute that solely to Miles being more aggressive - but frankly I think it is just as much attributable to Miles doing a much better job of identifying higher level players that we have a chance to get and doing the initial work it takes to make them at least somewhat interested.

 

But - always remember that just because big name schools are going after a kid does not mean they would be a good fit for us - and more importantly - and more frequently - there might be a player that is not getting alot of recruiting attention for some reason who ends up being really good.   Rivals like all recruiting services misses alot in their evaluations.   If you want to be able to access film to make your own evaluation then I think it is probably a great resource for that - but I don't have the desire to spend time on that - nor do I claim to have the expertise of a college basketball coach in making the evaluation.  Plus highlight film is really only a small part of the overall picture in deciding whether a kid will be a good fit.  That is why I spend alot more time thinking about the players that we have than worrying about the players we may or may not be trying to get.

[Silverbacked1]

Even if there were other boards that were remotely close to hoping to be as good as this one, I wouldn't go to them.

It would be kind of like cheating on my wife. Because I really like this site and wouldn't to do anything that would cause me to be kicked to the curb. Like I would if I ever did anything like that in real life.

[NUdiehard]

Yeah I know that Rivals has some good recrutiing resources.   I never spent too much time on that anyway. 

 

My theory (which I believe holds true) is that every coach knows way more about a kid's talent and ability to fit into their program than any recruiting service will ever know.   So I just hope that we are able to get the kids we say we are going after and I don't give 2 cents for how many stars some recruiting service gives that player.   I will acknowledge, however, that at least on some level knowing which other schools are recruiting a kid does give you some amount of general information about the kinds of players that we are "trying" to recruit and that is an important aspect that doesn't get directly factored into my "theory".   It seems pretty clear that Miles is setting his sights on a higher caliber of player than Doc was - and you need to take that into account if you are measuring recruiting success by whether or not we are getting the players we are after.   Some attribute that solely to Miles being more aggressive - but frankly I think it is just as much attributable to Miles doing a much better job of identifying higher level players that we have a chance to get and doing the initial work it takes to make them at least somewhat interested.

 

But - always remember that just because big name schools are going after a kid does not mean they would be a good fit for us - and more importantly - and more frequently - there might be a player that is not getting alot of recruiting attention for some reason who ends up being really good.   Rivals like all recruiting services misses alot in their evaluations.   If you want to be able to access film to make your own evaluation then I think it is probably a great resource for that - but I don't have the desire to spend time on that - nor do I claim to have the expertise of a college basketball coach in making the evaluation.  Plus highlight film is really only a small part of the overall picture in deciding whether a kid will be a good fit.  That is why I spend alot more time thinking about the players that we have than worrying about the players we may or may not be trying to get.

I do not follow recruiting as closely as I used to (espically in football, but I will keep this post focused on basketball).  With that said, I will never undermine the importance of recruiting.  In essence, it is 90% of the battle.  Coach Miles can't win with "lesser" recruits any more than Doc could (maybe a little more, but is there a huge difference between 12th and 10th?).

 

Is he looking for guys who "fit" his system.  Absolutely.   But he also is looking for (and must get if he wants to be successful) really talented players.  Do you think Miles got Tai Webster because Miles himself identified him as someone who would best "fit" his program?   Heck no.  He got Tai because he hired Harriman who had an inside track on Tai.  Beyond being a good person and teammate, I doubt Miles spent a whole lot of time debating whether Tai was a proper "fit" for his system. 

 

You say that coaches know best who they should recruit for "their" system.  Well, Doc had a system and he recruited to that system and it didn't get him anywhere.  Same with Collier.  Have both of those coaches forgot more basketball than than you or I will ever know?  Absolutely.  But does that mean they are the only ones that know whether a recruiting class will take the team to the next level?  Not IMO.  I remember reading about Collier's recruiting class.  It had a guy that averaged 3 points in junior college.  Seriously!  Are you going to tell me that I am supposed to just have faith that he will turn out to be  good "fit" for Collier's system?  Same with Doc.  Alex Chapman?  Chris Nieman (who averaged 3.5 pts on the exact same team that Standhardinger averaged about 27 points/game.  And I can't read anything into that?)  This isn't rocket science. 

 

Let's look at it from another "current" perspective.  Who was the highest "ranked" recruit this year?  As we all know, it was Tai Webster.  And yes, I celebrated the day he verbally committed, the day he signed, and the day he qualified.  Why?  Because I know it will take players like Tai to get us to the next level.  And yes, I could make a very educated evaluation that Tai would be an impact player just based on what I read about him (and not just me, but all of us who follow recruiting). Oh, and by the way, who is clearly the most talented recruit this year?  Tai of course.  He is starting from day 1 and he will be an impact player while Fuller and Hawkins are scratching and clawing just to get playing time.  Miles needs more recruits like Tai.  Impact players.  Difference makers. If he doesn't get them, then he is going to continue to finish in the bottom half of the league.  It is that simple. 

 

Recruiting is not an exact science.  I don't give a whole lot of credence to Rivals rankings either b/c they only really evaluate the top 100 to 200 recruits.  But who else is recruiting a player does factor into my opinion of a recruit.  Is it a perfect evaluation.  Of course not.  There are always sleepers.  But that doesn't mean you throw out the baby with the bathwater.  It still holds value in evaluating a recruit.   Plus, if you truly believe that "coaches" are the only ones qualified to "rank" a recruit, then you should give that factor great weight.  Because these are "coaches" "experts" who ARE evaluating these players, and watching them play live, and evaluating all their film.  If only coaches are truly qualified, then whether or not other coaches offer a player should carry some weight in your opinion of that recruit. 

 

I also look at how many points they scored in high school, how many rebounds, what level of competition, what do his HS coaches say about him, what do other coaches say about him, what do I see on his film, how tall is he, how long is he, how athletic is he, did his own state university recruit him (obviously, the coach in his home state would have seen him plenty of times to make an evaluation). 

 

Evaluation of a player isn't always that complicated.  I always made it a habit to attend at least one preseason practice of Doc's almost every year and almost without fail I could size up his new "recruits" in about 10 minutes of watching.  Just like watching Amercan Idol, it doesn't take weeks of evaluation to figure out who has "it" and who doesn't. 

[Norm Peterson]

HuskerBB, I was not referring to nustudent.  There was a guy over at the Rivals hoops board who had a knack for ending the discussion.  He would boast that his answer was the final answer on any basketball-related topic because he "rubs elbows with the biggest names in the game on a daily basis."

 

It's hard to carry on a disagreement with the world's foremost expert.

 

There are posters on the Rivals free board who undoubtedly have access to inside information about the football team.  I think that's pretty clear.  But they also have an agenda against Bo Pelini and an agenda against Taylor Martinez.  I know for certain they possess inside information.  In various ways, they've managed to make friends with parents of players and players themselves.  I have no doubt they have knowledge.  It's what they do with it that I have a problem with.  Their inside information is used to aggrandize themselves and belittle other posters.  And, again, that kills discussion.

 

There was once a guy over there who went by the handle of Tim_may who obviously knew stuff but didn't use it in a way to put others down.  And he established his bona fides when he announced, about a week ahead of time that Harvey was going to fire Steve Pederson and hire Tom Osborne to replace him (which would lead to Bill Callahan being fired at the end of the season.)  Harvey said he hadn't decided to fire Pederson until, what, Sunday?  The day before his press conference?  BS.  It was posted by Tim_may on Rivals no later than the prior Wednesday or Thursday.

[tcp]

I generally don't like sports boards because of the demographic that populates them. I'm admittedly snobby that way. I don't mind people that aren't all that bright if they're pleasant; but I despise people that are both stupid AND mean, and for some reason, they all hang out on sports boards. I didn't like this site at first because there used to be a nasty little clique of college brats running around tormenting newcomers. I left quickly along with a few other quality posters. Those people disappeared, and I came back and have stayed ever since.

 

But SBNation boards are where I've been happiest overall. Corn Nation is trying to get some hoops off the ground, but like most boards, it's probably not going to fly. Just not enough hardcore fans of hoops affiliated with NU that also hangout on the internet.

 

HHC is still number one, and while that's great, it's more a statement on how badly we need to increase the fan base for Nebrasketball.

[HuskerBB]

Norm,  sorry if I made an incorrect assumption.   Don't really remember that board well enough to know who you might be talking about.   You might be right about some posters on RSS having inside knowlege - but there are also several that try to give that impression who do not.   No big deal - not worth discussing here.

 

diehard - I don't really have any issues with what you are saying.  Obviously you put alot more mental energy into following recruiting than I do - but I don't have any big issues with what you are saying.  I think your 90% figure is a bit high - because I think coaching is at least more than a 10% factor.  But part of that is player development and the other aspect I would point out is that some players are good fits and will respond to some coaching styles better than others.  While there are certainly guys who are going to be good for any coach - there are also some who need the right coaching to really maximize the talent they have - and it is not the same coaching for everybody although good coaches will be able to do that with a wider variety of players.  Ultimately this is way off topic to this thread - but in general I think you make valid points about recruiting and I certainly respect your desire to follow it closely.

 

I guess I would add that to some extent I evaluate a coach's ability to recruit "after the fact" when I have seen the players that they bring in.  I just think it is much harder to draw valid conclusions before then unless you spend alot of time in the effort and even then it is a pretty inexact science.  As far as our former coaches I would agree the Collier had some bad misses but he also brought in some pretty talented players and then did a poor job coaching them.  I always thought Barry was a poor coach in dealing with highly talented but a little bit undisciplined players - but a decent coach of less talented players.  Problem was the guys he knew how to coach to maximize talent did not have a high enough ceiling to compete at this level - and while he had some players who could have made us more successful at this level he did not coach them well (Nate Johnson would be Exhibit A).   Doc was much harder to figure out.  I don't think you can really say he recruited to his system because I could never really see any organization or consistency to his approach to either coaching or recruiting.  But clearly you are correct that he was not able to land players that had the ability to make us successful at this level and that was a key factor in his downfall. 

[Busch Light]

Completely agree, Norm.  Insiders who use their information in negative ways really annoy me.  I have also seen them make entire message boards obnoxious and virtually unreadable. 

 

I actually know a guy who gives me a pretty detailed inside look at our program on a weekly basis.  In all reality, we just like to talk football.  He trusts me with the information and I don't blab about it or make cryptic statements.  I couldn't even imagine posting some of the stuff that's going on with our football program out of respect for the coaching staff and the players. 

 

No doubt about it though, Norm.  A couple of those boys over on the Rivals board have inside information from pretty high up the chain, I know one of those guys personally.  When they post, it takes the fun out of guessing. 

 

At any rate, I know absolutely 0 from what goes on behind the scenes with our basketball program.  I'm just a big fan and love the tone of the board.  Best basketball board out there by far. 

[hhcmatt]

It took about 5 posts for me to realize that RSS here doesn't mean "Rich Site Summary"

 

I'm much more familiar with non-Husker boards than I am with Husker-centric boards.  While I like the football team as much as the next guy, I'm not really compelled to follow it at the message board level.

 

I've made mention of this before but if people are looking to contribute to the site in some way like on the front page or have an idea for something shoot me a PM and we can talk about it.  Honestly I'd love if someone who wasn't me did game previews or if someone wanted to take on a more formal role in media/social media stuff.  I'd be cool if someone wanted to run the facebook wing of the HHC or Instagram or whatever.

 

There is a very good possibility that Miles and company take off in a big way and there will be a lot of people jumping on the ole Nebrasketball band wagon.  I think it'd be cool if this site was part of that jump.

[uneblinstu]

It took about 5 posts for me to realize that RSS here doesn't mean "Rich Site Summary"

 

I'm much more familiar with non-Husker boards than I am with Husker-centric boards.  While I like the football team as much as the next guy, I'm not really compelled to follow it at the message board level.

There will never be another Husker board for me.  This is it.  I'm totally with you on the football side of things.  I was a part of one for a while, wasn't a good experience.

[Silverbacked1]

So you guys are saying that Gesell didn't have a Norte Dame themed basement and that Bob Davies didn't get cable hooked up here in Lincoln? Wow am I shocked.

[uneblinstu]

no.  Davies definitely had the cable hooked up.  There's no doubt about that.

[2Buck]

I occasionally talk about what I describe as the paradox of the insider.  Some insiders can be good but it depends on how they handle it.  If it's about having their own egos stroked, they can just kill a message board.  The Rivals hoops board is a great example.  The place is dead.  Like a ghost town.  I know some might disagree with me but I think it's because a certain insider needed too much to have his ego stroked and it just shut down conversation.  Brought it to a dead halt.  You can't discuss anything with the guy who lays the ultimate trump card in every conversation.  A similar phenomenon occurred on the free board over there.  They have enough people to keep it going but the quality of the discussions over there suffered greatly.

 

We had a guy over here make a couple of posts where he intimated that he was a close personal friend of Tim Miles' sister.  And when people didn't bend to kiss his ring quickly enough, he got his nose bent out of joint and left.  And I'm hoping he didn't let the door hit him in the ass on his way out.  That kind of insider will ruin a message board.  It becomes an "ask the expert" board before too long.  But that's never interesting enough to keep the thing going.

Or maybe I realized you guys aren't worth giving the information to. I made a mistake and assumed this was a place where people close to the program came and shared things and what was happing around the team and the AD. Mostly because when I first came her people like Bruce were posting here. It didn't take long to see it was a group of guys that liked to chase off folks who weren't in the inner circle of long time posters here. 99.9% of the things posted here are a collection from the media which doesn't know much and has its own agenda which thankfully for right now likes Tim. You claimed I wanted an ego stoked yet you strive for it everyday with your buddies here and you return the favor with your banter with them. I decided it was more worth the time to keep my mouth shut on the details like why we have guys suspended and use this place as a media collection on twitter comments made by recruits since I refuse to lower myself to follow a kid who hasn't played ball for us. That ease of finding information I'm grateful for and I appreciate the site for that. And occasionally I'll read this form to see if there is something floating out there I missed I can ask about for my personal information. I'll log out now again and go about my radio silence.