49r Posted February 26, 2023 Author Report Posted February 26, 2023 Minnesota is so bad our SOS dropped to 12th. We were 4th or 5th or something just a week or so ago. Quote
Bugeaters1 Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 1 hour ago, 49r said: Minnesota is so bad our SOS dropped to 12th. We were 4th or 5th or something just a week or so ago. But the NET went up 4, to 88 Quote
Nebrasketball1979 Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 20 minutes ago, Bugeaters1 said: But the NET went up 4, to 88 The NET updates once a day in the morning so the Minnesota and rest of today's games has not been factored in. We likely drop to 91 tomorrow morning Bugeaters1 1 Quote
OmahaHusker Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 NET down to 93 after today Quote
hskr4life Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 5 hours ago, OmahaHusker said: NET down to 93 after today We absolutely do not want to play Minny in the B1G tournament. They are a NET killer. Quote
The Polish Rifle Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 7 hours ago, OmahaHusker said: NET down to 93 after today Such a flawed/stupid metric. NUtball 1 Quote
hhcmatt Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 The thing about all these projections is that they assume we'll lose our last two games, win our first game in the tournament, and lose our second, finishing at 16-17. Does anyone think that 16-17 gets us in the NIT? Winning enough games to make a post season will take care of the NET enough. Quote
brfrad Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 Looking at the NIT field from last year, we have plenty of work to do. NET's from 80 - 95 last year with above .500 record 80. Rutgers (18-13) First Four NCAA tournament SOS 37 Q1 and Q2 wins 9 81. Clemson (17-16) No tournament SOS 76 Q1 and Q2 wins 4 82. Furman (21-12) No tournament SOS 173 Q1 and Q2 wins 2 85. Drake (22-10) CBI SOS 140 Q1 and Q2 wins 4 87. Wichita State (15-13) No tournament SOS 80 Q1 and Q2 wins 3 92. Grand Canyon (21-8) No tournament SOS 202 Q1 and Q2 wins 2 93. South Carolina (17-13) No tournament SOS 59 Q1 and Q2 wins 7 95. Middle Tennessee (21-10) CBI SOS 134 Q1 and Q2 wins 2 Us this year 93. Nebraska (15-14) SOS 35 Q1 and Q2 wins 7 Must win Tuesday and probably 2 in Big 10 tournament Have to win Big 10 tournament for NCAA tournament Need to avoid Wednesday game for a chance Cheering for Michigan and Rutgers today. Quote
HuskerFever Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 36 minutes ago, The Polish Rifle said: Such a flawed/stupid metric. Our loss margins are: 20, 13, 12, 16, 3, 15, 18, 16, 18, 11, 15, 19, 16, and 21. That's what has hurt us the most. Then it's 3-10 Q1, 4-4 Q2, 1-0 Q3, 7-0 Q4 as well. Straightforward logic: lose fewer games, beat good opponents, and don't get blown out. Quote
royalfan Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 3 hours ago, hskr4life said: We absolutely do not want to play Minny in the B1G tournament. They are a NET killer. Was other things largely responsible for the drop. Quote
The Polish Rifle Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 (edited) 9 minutes ago, HuskerFever said: Our loss margins are: 20, 13, 12, 16, 3, 15, 18, 16, 18, 11, 15, 19, 16, and 21. That's what has hurt us the most. Then it's 3-10 Q1, 4-4 Q2, 1-0 Q3, 7-0 Q4 as well. Straightforward logic: lose fewer games, beat good opponents, and don't get blown out. The way I understand it, scoring margin is not a factor. It’s offense and defense efficiency that’s killing us (so I guess in a way those blowout losses are hurting us). Computers see a good team in Ohio St, and a much more flawed team in Nebraska….to me that indicates their formula is broken. Edited February 26, 2023 by The Polish Rifle Quote
royalfan Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 https://www.mwcconnection.com/platform/amp/2023/1/12/23552090/stats-corner-net-vs-kenpom-rankings Quote
royalfan Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 It is very hard for a mediocre big ten team to move at this point in the season versus a team like Toledo. We have played 29 games now. The net is going to largely mimic the pomeroy. To move one raw EM point we are going to have to win by about 29 points more in a game than was the expectation of the metric. 1.84 Em points moves us from 92 to 82. The coaching in our league is just too good to simply beat someone by 20 more than you should. A decent Toledo, on the other hand, can much more easily do that to disinterested poorly coached teams late on the year. They did yesterday and blew by us like we were in quicksand, Quote
hhcmatt Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 Ohio St isn't going to a post season regardless of their NET ranking which illustrates it's not an end all ranking system. We have a home win over the Buckeyes...put them back in the top 30, please and thank you HuscurAdam 1 Quote
The Polish Rifle Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 The difference between results metrics and predictive metrics can be pretty crazy in some cases. The biggest outliers are: predictive loves Ohio St, Yales - result based hates them. Result based loves Nebraska and Vandy - predictive hates them. Coach Stackhouse ranted about it yesterday. Said it seems stupid that he can’t put kids that worked their butts off in practice all week in games late because it could hurt his teams NET ranking. Vandy is 5th in the SEC but their are 9 SEC teams ahead of them in the NET. Quote
49r Posted February 26, 2023 Author Report Posted February 26, 2023 Ken sees us splitting the last two: Date Rk Opponent Result Location Record Conf Mon Nov 7 108 279 Maine W, 79-66 70 Home 1-0 Thu Nov 10 114 322 Nebraska Omaha W, 75-61 69 Home 2-0 Thu Nov 17 111 90 St. John's L, 70-50 71 Away 2-1 Sun Nov 20 115 320 Arkansas Pine Bluff W, 82-58 64 Home 3-1 Thu Nov 24 110 51 Oklahoma L, 69-56 60 Neutral 3-2 Fri Nov 25 118 37 Memphis L, 73-61 66 Neutral 3-3 Sun Nov 27 120 204 Florida St. W, 75-58 71 Neutral 4-3 Wed Nov 30 111 169 Boston College W, 88-67 63 Home 5-3 Sun Dec 4 95 14 Creighton W, 63-53 71 Away 6-3 Wed Dec 7 83 20 Indiana L, 81-65 72 Away 6-4 0-1 Sat Dec 10 81 6 Purdue L, 65-62 66 OT Home 6-5 0-2 Sat Dec 17 80 18 Kansas St. L, 71-56 71 Semi-Away 6-6 Tue Dec 20 84 215 Queens W, 75-65 73 Home 7-6 Thu Dec 29 89 45 Iowa W, 66-50 66 Home 8-6 1-2 Tue Jan 3 82 28 Michigan St. L, 74-56 64 Away 8-7 1-3 Sat Jan 7 84 221 Minnesota W, 81-79 69 OT Away 9-7 2-3 Tue Jan 10 84 26 Illinois L, 76-50 67 Home 9-8 2-4 Fri Jan 13 92 6 Purdue L, 73-55 61 Away 9-9 2-5 Wed Jan 18 94 71 Ohio St. W, 63-60 72 Home 10-9 3-5 Sat Jan 21 93 49 Penn St. L, 76-65 67 Away 10-10 3-6 Wed Jan 25 94 41 Northwestern L, 78-63 68 Home 10-11 3-7 Sat Jan 28 98 19 Maryland L, 82-63 65 Away 10-12 3-8 Tue Jan 31 100 26 Illinois L, 72-56 73 Away 10-13 3-9 Sun Feb 5 103 49 Penn St. W, 72-63 62 Home 11-13 4-9 Wed Feb 8 98 42 Michigan L, 93-72 71 Away 11-14 4-10 Sat Feb 11 104 64 Wisconsin W, 73-63 72 OT Home 12-14 5-10 Tue Feb 14 102 35 Rutgers W, 82-72 68 Away 13-14 6-10 Sun Feb 19 96 19 Maryland W, 70-66 72 OT Home 14-14 7-10 Sat Feb 25 90 221 Minnesota W, 78-67 75 Home 15-14 8-10 Tue Feb 28 28 Michigan St. L, 68-65 65 41% Home × Sun Mar 5 45 Iowa L, 80-72 69 23% Away × Projected record: 16-15 9-11 Quote
HuskerFever Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 (edited) 54 minutes ago, The Polish Rifle said: The way I understand it, scoring margin is not a factor. It’s offense and defense efficiency that’s killing us (so I guess in a way those blowout losses are hurting us). Computers see a good team in Ohio St, and a much more flawed team in Nebraska….to me that indicates their formula is broken. Scoring margin is a component of it. But looking back, it does seem it's capped at 10 pts (1 pt for OT). Edited February 26, 2023 by HuskerFever Quote
royalfan Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 (edited) That is no longer the way NET works @HuskerFever. That article I posted above clears it all up the best I have seen. https://www.mwcconnection.com/platform/amp/2023/1/12/23552090/stats-corner-net-vs-kenpom-rankings Edited February 26, 2023 by royalfan HuskerFever and hhcmatt 1 1 Quote
HuskerFever Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 52 minutes ago, royalfan said: That is no longer the way NET works @HuskerFever. That article I posted above clears it all up the best I have seen. https://www.mwcconnection.com/platform/amp/2023/1/12/23552090/stats-corner-net-vs-kenpom-rankings For those who don't want to click the link or dig: Beginning in 2020, winning percentage, adjusted winning percentage and scoring margin were all dropped from the NET ranking. Therefore, only team value and team value index are used to ranked teams. So, the only factors which go into the rankings are efficiency (offensive points per possession minus opponents points per possession), strength of opponents played, location of game, wins and losses, and who won the game. royalfan 1 Quote
HuskerFever Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 1 hour ago, The Polish Rifle said: The biggest outliers are: predictive loves Ohio S... 55 minutes ago, royalfan said: That is no longer the way NET works @HuskerFever. That article I posted above clears it all up the best I have seen. https://www.mwcconnection.com/platform/amp/2023/1/12/23552090/stats-corner-net-vs-kenpom-rankings This does help explain some of the oddities with Ohio State then. Although Ohio State only has one road win all season. Quote
Silverbacked1 Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 All I can say is Math r hard NUtball and royalfan 2 Quote
The Polish Rifle Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 Last year the NIT heavily used NET for selection. I was reading a Washington St article about last year's NIT selection and it appears that NET was the single most important metric for NIT selections. "Hopefully you quickly noticed the same thing I did: That the NIT committee basically looked at the NET rankings and selected teams rated highly by that metric. Then they went one step further and also used it to seed the teams (with a couple of obvious regional adjustments), which is how the Cougs ended up with a 4 seed: They were among the top half of the field in NET." I can see us being this year's South Carolina. South Carolina had a better record, and finished higher than MSU and Vandy - even went 2-0 against Vandy, yet Vandy and MSU went to the NIT strictly due to having a better NET. Quote
FredsSlacks Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 i guarantee the NCAA is just looking for a reason to put us into the play-in game at minimum. the ratings we'd get with tominaga + being the only power 5 team to never win. i think 18 wins is the magic number. HuscurAdam 1 Quote
HuskerFever Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 2 minutes ago, FredsSlacks said: i guarantee the NCAA is just looking for a reason to put us into the play-in game at minimum. the ratings we'd get with tominaga + being the only power 5 team to never win. i think 18 wins is the magic number. It's not a science, we all know that, so take it with as much grain of salt as you want. Current Last Four Out: Penn State: #57 NET, 17-1, Q1 3-7, Q2 4-4, Q3 5-0, Q4 5-0 Utah State: #32 NET, 21-7, Q1 1-4, Q2 5-1, Q3 12-1, Q4 3-1 North Carolina: #47 NET, 18-11, Q1 1-8, Q2 6-3, Q3 5-0, Q4 6-0 Arizona State: #59 NET, 20-9, Q1 4-4, Q2 5-5, Q3 4-0, Q4 7-1 Nebraska: #93 NET, 15-14, Q1 3-10, Q2 4-4, Q3 1-0, Q4 7-0 The teams ahead of us in NET with 14+ losses are: #64 Florida (15), #65 Oklahoma (15), #71 Ohio State (17), #74 Colorado (14), #75 Washington State (15), #78 Villanova (14), #89 BYU (14) Quote
FredsSlacks Posted February 26, 2023 Report Posted February 26, 2023 1 minute ago, HuskerFever said: It's not a science, we all know that, so take it with as much grain of salt as you want. Current Last Four Out: Penn State: #57 NET, 17-1, Q1 3-7, Q2 4-4, Q3 5-0, Q4 5-0 Utah State: #32 NET, 21-7, Q1 1-4, Q2 5-1, Q3 12-1, Q4 3-1 North Carolina: #47 NET, 18-11, Q1 1-8, Q2 6-3, Q3 5-0, Q4 6-0 Arizona State: #59 NET, 20-9, Q1 4-4, Q2 5-5, Q3 4-0, Q4 7-1 Nebraska: #93 NET, 15-14, Q1 3-10, Q2 4-4, Q3 1-0, Q4 7-0 The teams ahead of us in NET with 14+ losses are: #64 Florida (15), #65 Oklahoma (15), #71 Ohio State (17), #74 Colorado (14), #75 Washington State (15), #78 Villanova (14), #89 BYU (14) if we get to 18 wins it will mean we have beaten 3 more tourney teams. i would imagine we'd move up a lot. Quote
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