Game 4: Scouting UMASS

[tcp]

interesting read over at their board. the mid major inferiority complex is very strange, but I can see how we would take SoS for granted given our conference affiliations. of course, if they only knew how I felt about B1G football.....

 

Both fan bases should appreciate that we have the best first round game and are in a great bracket.

[S. Minuteman]

Hey guys - UMass fan here.

 

Looking forward to a good one tomorrow, always nice to play a team with some name recognition. Saw a little of your FGCU game and the defense looked solid. Congrats on the new arena.

 

I think both teams are looking for a crack at New Mexico so I expect a battle, despite the early start time/mid-week game, etc. Doubt the attendance will be particularly good so gonna depend on which team can create some momentum themselves. Think you guys will like watching Chaz Williams play, he's a little guy but flies around the court.

[hhcmatt]

[hskr4life]

Hey guys - UMass fan here.

 

Looking forward to a good one tomorrow, always nice to play a team with some name recognition. Saw a little of your FGCU game and the defense looked solid. Congrats on the new arena.

 

I think both teams are looking for a crack at New Mexico so I expect a battle, despite the early start time/mid-week game, etc. Doubt the attendance will be particularly good so gonna depend on which team can create some momentum themselves. Think you guys will like watching Chaz Williams play, he's a little guy but flies around the court.

 

We have one of them to... Benny Parker.  Also I wish the game was tomorrow but alas its Thursday!!!  Good look to you guys!

[S. Minuteman]

Wishful thinking on my part I suppose that it would be tomorrow - oops.

 

What's the general consensus on Tim Miles so far from Husker fans? Still too early to make a judgement?

[hhcmatt]

Wishful thinking on my part I suppose that it would be tomorrow - oops.

 

What's the general consensus on Tim Miles so far from Husker fans? Still too early to make a judgement?

 

As far as we know the only thing he's done wrong this year is go to the wrong restaurant for a radio show.

At this point he might be the second most popular person in Lincoln after Tom Osborne.

[jdostal]

Wishful thinking on my part I suppose that it would be tomorrow - oops.

 

What's the general consensus on Tim Miles so far from Husker fans? Still too early to make a judgement?

 

It's too early to say if he's is our savior or not, but so far there have only really been positives.  His players seem to play hard for him and he overachieved last year.  Jury's out on recruiting.

[xlgman]

Hey guys.  UMass fan here.  Hope this post works.  My last one seemed to just disappear.

 

How do you think we match up position by position?

 

PG: Chaz Williams - (5'-9" R Sr): Very quick, great ballhandler and penetrator, good rebounder for a guard, creative passer, fearless, can score from anywhere, good but not great defender.  Clutch but occasionally a little out of control.  NBA caliber if only 5 inches taller.

 

Backup PG:  Trey Davis - (6'-0" So):  Competent ballhandler, average defender, good shooter with an odd but effective release.

 

SG/SF: Derrick Gordon - (6'-3" R So): High energy, good ballhandler and penetrator, tough, loves contact, very aggressive rebounder, good defender, not a great shooting touch, not a deep threat.

 

SF: Raphiael Putney - (6'-9" R Sr):  Super skinny, long, super athletic, avg ballhandler, good penetrator, avg rebounder, below avg defender who struggles on the perimeter, occasional deep threat, inconsistent, frequently disappears or gets in foul trouble.

 

PF: Sampson Carter - (6'-8" R Sr):  Versatile face up 3/4, strong, crafty, avg athleticism, good ballhandler, good penetrator, occasional deep threat, gets to the line, wants the ball in crunch time, defends multiple positions from SF to C.

 

Backup forward:  Maxie Esho - (6'-8" R Jr):  Another guy that is long and super athletic but not as refined as the starters.  Blossoming midrange game, disruptive defender in the open court and coming from the weak side, good but not great rebounder that gets some putbacks.  Perfect 6th man with high energy

 

C:  Cady Lalanne - (6'-9" R Jr):  Strong, athletic back to the basket big man, scores on putbacks and a variety of post moves with both hands, good straight up post defender, capable midrange shooter, very good rebounder, finally healthy and in shape after 2.5 years battling foot injuries.

 

Backup C: Tyler Bergantino - (6'-9" So):  Strong, athletic back to the basket big man, scores mostly on putbacks and dishes from guard penetration, good rebounder, offensive and defensive games are works in progress.

 

We've basically had an 8 man rotation thus far.  Balanced, experienced, and pieces that fit together well.  Coach Kellogg finally seems to be coming into his own and has the guys playing hard with a purpose.

 

Let me know how you guys match up.

 

Thanks!

[FredsSlacks]

Hey guys.  UMass fan here.  Hope this post works.  My last one seemed to just disappear.

 

How do you think we match up position by position?

 

PG: Chaz Williams - (5'-9" R Sr): Very quick, great ballhandler and penetrator, good rebounder for a guard, creative passer, fearless, can score from anywhere, good but not great defender.  Clutch but occasionally a little out of control.  NBA caliber if only 5 inches taller.

 

Backup PG:  Trey Davis - (6'-0" So):  Competent ballhandler, average defender, good shooter with an odd but effective release.

 

SG/SF: Derrick Gordon - (6'-3" R So): High energy, good ballhandler and penetrator, tough, loves contact, very aggressive rebounder, good defender, not a great shooting touch, not a deep threat.

 

SF: Raphiael Putney - (6'-9" R Sr):  Super skinny, long, super athletic, avg ballhandler, good penetrator, avg rebounder, below avg defender who struggles on the perimeter, occasional deep threat, inconsistent, frequently disappears or gets in foul trouble.

 

PF: Sampson Carter - (6'-8" R Sr):  Versatile face up 3/4, strong, crafty, avg athleticism, good ballhandler, good penetrator, occasional deep threat, gets to the line, wants the ball in crunch time, defends multiple positions from SF to C.

 

Backup forward:  Maxie Esho - (6'-8" R Jr):  Another guy that is long and super athletic but not as refined as the starters.  Blossoming midrange game, disruptive defender in the open court and coming from the weak side, good but not great rebounder that gets some putbacks.  Perfect 6th man with high energy

 

C:  Cady Lalanne - (6'-9" R Jr):  Strong, athletic back to the basket big man, scores on putbacks and a variety of post moves with both hands, good straight up post defender, capable midrange shooter, very good rebounder, finally healthy and in shape after 2.5 years battling foot injuries.

 

Backup C: Tyler Bergantino - (6'-9" So):  Strong, athletic back to the basket big man, scores mostly on putbacks and dishes from guard penetration, good rebounder, offensive and defensive games are works in progress.

 

We've basically had an 8 man rotation thus far.  Balanced, experienced, and pieces that fit together well.  Coach Kellogg finally seems to be coming into his own and has the guys playing hard with a purpose.

 

Let me know how you guys match up.

 

Thanks!

If your coach is smart, he will give it to cady and sampson early and often. Our interior defense is not great and very thin. Our center, Pitchford is 6'10, but he plays like a Small forward on offense and defense. Leslee Smith is 6'8 250 and our only true post player, but he only plays 17 minutes a game off the bench. Lack of big men is our only real weakness besides that we're a really young team.

 

We have 2 talented wings in Shavon Shields and Terran Petteway. Both are about 6'7 and can shoot, drive, and rebound very well.

 

We have 2 point guards in Tai webster and Deverell biggs who are both talented in different ways. Webster is 6'4 200 pounds and is able to drive and shoot. Biggs is 6'0 and extremely athletic and can get to the rim but not known for shooting.

 

ray gallegos is our shooting guard. he is our only senior and our leading scorer from last year. he's 6'2 and is a three point specialist, but also very athletic. he is not a threat to attack the basket though.

 

two other role players are 5'9 pg benny parker and 6'7 sf david rivers. They play hard, but probably are not going to be a threat offensively.

[jimmykc]

Hello, UMass: Red Sox fans are always welcome to post here.

[49r]

I can tell you right now that you're gonna like that Shields kid!

[royalfan]

Big key will be how crisp our rotations are off the double teams.   This will be a big jump in post talent from what we have seen.  We will almost certainly bring a lot of doubles, especially since they don't excel from distance.  How well UMass passes out of the doubles and how are rotations are off the double will likely go a long way towards deciding the winner of this one. 

[hhcmatt]

Rivers plays a little center and a little piano

 

http://instagram.com/p/g8ml-1I-5G/

[PimpMario]

We got the tougher side of the bracket by far.

[AnotherUMassFan]

I think they have one user over there though that has a few misgivings about our program.

 

"One of the worst all time in NCAA history" or something to that effect.

 

I'll admit we've been underperforming for years and years, but all time worst?  Not by a mile, man...not by a mile.

Ya...sorry...that was me. Here's what I posted:

 

"LSU, Clemson and Georgia don't belong in the same sentence when talking about Nebraska and basketball. Nebraska is probably better this year than they have been in years but that really is not saying much. Nebraska has never actually won a game in the NCAA tournament. Nebraska is probably the all-time worst major conference basketball school. EVERY A10 school has a better history of basketball than does Nebraska."

 

I understand that it must come off as pretty nasty to Husker fans. I think it's important to consider that I use "major conference"  to mean B1G, ACC, Big12, Pac12, and SEC (the BE no longer deserving membership). It's also important to consider that I was talking about 100+ years of history. It's also true that Nebraska has probably been better than Northwestern so the statement is probably incorrect. 

 

In any case, there was some context. As some of you have noticed, UMass fans, as a group, have some amount of inferiority complex based on our conference affiliation and the resultant national press attention. While the A10 has always been a fairly strong basketball conference, all sports fans are well aware that the BCS conferences drive college athletics and garner the vast majority of media attention. New England is very different from the rest of the country with regards to college athletics - colleges sports will always be second fiddle to pro sports in terms of both attendance and media coverage. Massachusetts is worse, in this regard, than the rest of New England and even within Massachusetts the Boston press gives far less attention to UMass than they do to BC, BU, Harvard, etc.

 

I'm sure many of you are unhappy with the Cornhusker's move from the Big12 to the B1G (I would be) but in the world of college athletics you will remain in the driver seat because of this affiliation. For UMass, this upheaval in conference affiliation (which I believe will inevitably lead to a divorce from the NCAA by the member schools of the major conferences) is much scarier. UMass moved up to FBS football in a belated attempt to avoid being left out in the cold when the major conferences build their new organization. This move is bound to fail because UMass is unlikely to ever gain membership in one of the surviving conferences.

 

In any case, my post was not intended to besmirch Nebraska as it was to point out that Nebraska basketball represent a relatively normal challenge for UMass and not the same as would be faced if UMass was to play, for example, Michigan or Michigan State.

[Silverbacked1]

I think they have one user over there though that has a few misgivings about our program.

"One of the worst all time in NCAA history" or something to that effect.

I'll admit we've been underperforming for years and years, but all time worst? Not by a mile, man...not by a mile.

Ya...sorry...that was me. Here's what I posted:

"LSU, Clemson and Georgia don't belong in the same sentence when talking about Nebraska and basketball. Nebraska is probably better this year than they have been in years but that really is not saying much. Nebraska has never actually won a game in the NCAA tournament. Nebraska is probably the all-time worst major conference basketball school. EVERY A10 school has a better history of basketball than does Nebraska."

I understand that it must come off as pretty nasty to Husker fans. I think it's important to consider that I use "major conference" to mean B1G, ACC, Big12, Pac12, and SEC (the BE no longer deserving membership). It's also important to consider that I was talking about 100+ years of history. It's also true that Nebraska has probably been better than Northwestern so the statement is probably incorrect.

In any case, there was some context. As some of you have noticed, UMass fans, as a group, have some amount of inferiority complex based on our conference affiliation and the resultant national press attention. While the A10 has always been a fairly strong basketball conference, all sports fans are well aware that the BCS conferences drive college athletics and garner the vast majority of media attention. New England is very different from the rest of the country with regards to college athletics - colleges sports will always be second fiddle to pro sports in terms of both attendance and media coverage. Massachusetts is worse, in this regard, than the rest of New England and even within Massachusetts the Boston press gives far less attention to UMass than they do to BC, BU, Harvard, etc.

I'm sure many of you are unhappy with the Cornhusker's move from the Big12 to the B1G (I would be) but in the world of college athletics you will remain in the driver seat because of this affiliation. For UMass, this upheaval in conference affiliation (which I believe will inevitably lead to a divorce from the NCAA by the member schools of the major conferences) is much scarier. UMass moved up to FBS football in a belated attempt to avoid being left out in the cold when the major conferences build their new organization. This move is bound to fail because UMass is unlikely to ever gain membership in one of the surviving conferences.

In any case, my post was not intended to besmirch Nebraska as it was to point out that Nebraska basketball represent a relatively normal challenge for UMass and not the same as would be faced if UMass was to play, for example, Michigan or Michigan State.

Just tell 9r that you love that Shields kid and things will be fine.

[throwback]

Thanks for the info - speaking for myself, I'm very happy with the move to the BIG for a lot of the reasons you mentioned - while I may miss some of the individual football and basketball matchups (NU-Kansas, etc), the BIG is a much better fit financially and as far as long term stability for Nebraska. The emphasis on basketball up and down the league is much stronger in the BIG, which can only help our program long term. And there's no Texas. 

 

I was surprised to hear during the UMass-LSU game that UMass hasn't been to the NCAA tourney since 1998 - that's the same 14-year drought NU is currently experiencing. Hopefully both teams will be breaking that drought soon!

[AnotherUMassFan]

It's been a rough fourteen years. Bruiser Flint, an assistant under Calipari, was a very good guy but probably the wrong coach for UMass (he's done well at Drexel). He was followed by Steve Lappas who was an unbelievably bad hire. Then came Travis Ford who was a good coach but left as soon as he had some success. UMass fans were somewhat split on the hiring of Derek Kellogg. Many of us, myself included, loved the hire because DK is from the area and starred at UMass. After working as an assistant under Calipari he seemed ready to take UMass to the next step. His first couple of years were pretty disappointing as he tried to implement a dribble drive system that was not well-suited to the players he had. Now, in year six, DK appears to have assembled a team that should male it to the NCAA tournament.

 

This UMass team is not a particularly good shooting team - it thrives on tempo, dribble drive, and interior play. It has the players to out-rebound most opponents and if it does so it should win. None of DK's teams have played particularly well against zone defenses and that approach may well work for the Huskers should they try it. UMass should benefit from officiating according to the new rules but that officiating seems to be being inconsistently applied across college basketball today (it was not, generally, applied during the UMass-YSU game, for instance).

[KZRider]

 

 

 

 

BTW, say hello to the gents from UMassHoops.com

LOL. one of the poeple on that board was seriously concerned about Vooch's size and 3 point shot.

 

"They do have a center who is over 7 feet in sophomore Sergej Vucetic, but he only weighs about 240 pounds, and is known for shooting the 3. "

 

 

May have mistaken him with Pitchford... but I mean seeing a 7 foot center on another roster is probably cause for concern for another team who doesnt "know" our team.

 

i know. it's just funny to see anyone worried about vucetic

 

they should be worried about serge. if he gets in the game, it means we've won.

 

Well, then, START him for crying out loud!

[ladyhusker]

Can I just say how fun this board crossover is? It's nice to have civil conversations between fanbases that, at the core, want to beat the hell out of each other's teams, but can still have fun with it and share some good insights. Kudos, gentlemen.

 

With that, I'll be in the corner with my ukelele singing some Kumbaya. Join in if you like. There will be a campfire and marshmallow roast later.

[49r]

 

I think they have one user over there though that has a few misgivings about our program.

 

"One of the worst all time in NCAA history" or something to that effect.

 

I'll admit we've been underperforming for years and years, but all time worst?  Not by a mile, man...not by a mile.

Ya...sorry...that was me. Here's what I posted:

 

"LSU, Clemson and Georgia don't belong in the same sentence when talking about Nebraska and basketball. Nebraska is probably better this year than they have been in years but that really is not saying much. Nebraska has never actually won a game in the NCAA tournament. Nebraska is probably the all-time worst major conference basketball school. EVERY A10 school has a better history of basketball than does Nebraska."

 

I understand that it must come off as pretty nasty to Husker fans. I think it's important to consider that I use "major conference"  to mean B1G, ACC, Big12, Pac12, and SEC (the BE no longer deserving membership). It's also important to consider that I was talking about 100+ years of history. It's also true that Nebraska has probably been better than Northwestern so the statement is probably incorrect. 

 

In any case, there was some context. As some of you have noticed, UMass fans, as a group, have some amount of inferiority complex based on our conference affiliation and the resultant national press attention. While the A10 has always been a fairly strong basketball conference, all sports fans are well aware that the BCS conferences drive college athletics and garner the vast majority of media attention. New England is very different from the rest of the country with regards to college athletics - colleges sports will always be second fiddle to pro sports in terms of both attendance and media coverage. Massachusetts is worse, in this regard, than the rest of New England and even within Massachusetts the Boston press gives far less attention to UMass than they do to BC, BU, Harvard, etc.

 

I'm sure many of you are unhappy with the Cornhusker's move from the Big12 to the B1G (I would be) but in the world of college athletics you will remain in the driver seat because of this affiliation. For UMass, this upheaval in conference affiliation (which I believe will inevitably lead to a divorce from the NCAA by the member schools of the major conferences) is much scarier. UMass moved up to FBS football in a belated attempt to avoid being left out in the cold when the major conferences build their new organization. This move is bound to fail because UMass is unlikely to ever gain membership in one of the surviving conferences.

 

In any case, my post was not intended to besmirch Nebraska as it was to point out that Nebraska basketball represent a relatively normal challenge for UMass and not the same as would be faced if UMass was to play, for example, Michigan or Michigan State.

 

 

Yeah, I get the New England apathy towards college sports.  I lived in Boston for a while at the turn of the century....uh, the 21st century, that is.  So I understand it.  I think lots of folks in the Boston area couldn't tell you for sure where UMass is...Amherst, Lowell, or Boston...or Nashua, NH...  

 

I get that some of your own fans may not know who we are, or even care, because we haven't been on lots of primetime CBS games or in the Final Four.  The only thing they really know is we are B1G.  Some of our new conference mates are trying to figure out who we are.  For that matter, so are we.

 

I can say that for us, though, we don't really know much about UMass, either.  We may remember coach Cal and Marcus Camby.  Some may recall the "U Game" between you and UConn.  Some of us may even know that you guys play on a parquet floor.  Not much to go on.  But to be safe I think we're going to mentally prepare ourselves for your mid-90's teams.  Just to be safe...

 

At any event, it's going to be a measuring stick game for us.  But I'd warn you guys not to look past us.  We've been known to ruin more than a few teams' early season tournaments!  

[hskr4life]

UMASS is also a good game for us, because not only is it a game we absolutely CAN win, it strengthens our RPI and SOS at then end of the season!  It is basically like a win win for us.

[AnotherUMassFan]

I would hope that the players aren't looking past Nebraska. This UMass team is as old as any Nebraska is likely to play (the average age of the starters is, I think, 21) and only the transfer, Derrick Gordon, has ever played in the tournament. These players understand that losing will be very damaging to their chances of dancing. In the A10, UMass has an easy schedule (the best teams at home) but only VCU and SLU are going to be highly-respected wins on Selection Sunday and neither of those games will be easy for UMass to win. That means UMass can't afford to lose out of conference to any team out of the top 50. If UMass loses to Nebraska then UMass is going to be hoping and praying that Nebraska shocks the B1G and ends up top 50.

[a0t0w0]

Ya...sorry...that was me. Here's what I posted:

 

"LSU, Clemson and Georgia don't belong in the same sentence when talking about Nebraska and basketball. Nebraska is probably better this year than they have been in years but that really is not saying much. Nebraska has never actually won a game in the NCAA tournament. Nebraska is probably the all-time worst major conference basketball school. EVERY A10 school has a better history of basketball than does Nebraska."

 

 

I have no problem with that statement.  All-time worst might not be completely accurate, but there's little evidence to suggest otherwise.  I hope we can start to fight our way out of that title by ABSOLUTELY CRUSHING YOU TOMORROW.  BURN UMASS BURN! BURRRRRRRRRRRRNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN. 

 

We're going to push your historically significant mascot into the mud.  We're going to beat you so bad that you'll poop corn til March.  Your daughters will ask for HHC t-shirts for christmas. 

 

Forget the British, the Huskers are coming. 

[49r]

I would hope that the players aren't looking past Nebraska. This UMass team is as old as any Nebraska is likely to play (the average age of the starters is, I think, 21) and only the transfer, Derrick Gordon, has ever played in the tournament. These players understand that losing will be very damaging to their chances of dancing. In the A10, UMass has an easy schedule (the best teams at home) but only VCU and SLU are going to be highly-respected wins on Selection Sunday and neither of those games will be easy for UMass to win. That means UMass can't afford to lose out of conference to any team out of the top 50. If UMass loses to Nebraska then UMass is going to be hoping and praying that Nebraska shocks the B1G and ends up top 50.

 

If Nebraska is good enough to beat UMass, then I think you could safely bet that they'll end up a top 50 RPI team barring some bizarre collapse.  

 

We have the opposite problem that you do.  RPI boosting games out the wazoo.  Thing is, finding wins.  That's why this game is important for us.  Sort of a fringe-25 team that we can legitimately see getting a win against.