uneblinstu's post game chatter: vol 6, ed 2 - FGCU, PBA Opener!

[hoop_head]

Great night. Only complaint is that goddamn bonjovi video. WHY????? And Benny will be seeing a decent amount of minutes this year. He took a big step in the offseason imo

Yes. Bon Jovi needs to stay in the 80's where they belong. Use something the kids think is cool. 

 

But what a fun game to watch and everything else about the event was epic.

[GATA]

A few observations...

 

* Wow, does Shields look far more athletic and explosive. That easily was the most impressive thing I saw last night. He looked all-Big Ten worthy last night. I can't wait to see him against the big boys later this year.

 

* Tai Webster absolutely passed the eye-ball test. He'll eventually get those lay-ups to fall. Hopefully he can develop that jumper and become a good free-throw shooter because he's going to get to the line a lot, especially if teams have to honor his outside shot.

 

* Pitchford is a strange player. He's built like a prototypical athlete at PF, but he thinks he's a shooting guard. Hopefully he can develop into a truer power forward because we need that this year. Don't get me wrong, it's great to have a "stretch four," but I'm hoping for more out of him. That said, at the very least, he's athletic, can rebound and knock down 3s. In the Big Ten, though, we need someone to get us buckets in the paint. We won't face average defensive teams like FGCU all year.

 

* I'm happy to see Parker have a strong game, and he's certainly made strides, but I'll continue to question him until he can be more than "just a guy" in a half-court set. But he showed some upside as a pesky defensive player and a guy who can finish layups in transition. Maybe he doesn't get many minutes with Biggs and Gallegos back, but he's a guy you can trust out there to not make mistakes and to give maximum effort.

 

* Leslee Smith moved around well out there. I think once he gets more comfortable in the system he'll become a much better player. He didn't do a lot statistically, but his movement skills appeared good, and that was good to see considering the concerns over his leg injuries.

 

* Petteway has a non-stop motor. It was nice to see him sink a couple of 3-pointers (and the Pinnacle Bank was open!). He'll be a fun guy to watch this year since he's constantly in attack mode. I need to see his steal/layup again. Looked like a travel to me, but maybe it was just so awkward that it looked like one. I hope he continues to knock down just enough jumpers to keep teams honest.

 

* Rivers will continue to be a rock-solid player for us this year. What a great role player to have.

 

* I'll be disappointed if Fuller ends up redshirting. A lot of people here had high hopes for him as an instant rotation guy. I worry about his speed/athleticism, but he seems to have an understanding of the "right way to play."

[AuroranHusker]

A few observations...

 

...

 

* Petteway has a non-stop motor.,,  I need to see his steal/layup again. Looked like a travel to me, but maybe it was just so awkward that it looked like one.,,

 

* Rivers will continue to be a rock-solid player for us this year. What a great role player to have.

 

I thought the defender tipped the ball & Petteway continued with a new set of steps toward the bucket.

 

Rivers is a beast out there in his complementary role for the team. And, the hand-checking will cease for D.R. or he'll foul out a lot.

[boomer1]

• As most have said Shavon is going to be a stud for us this year, and the next two.  The future is bright.  

I won't be upset with Fuller redshirting.  The extra year to get used to the speed, get stronger and quicker will serve him well.  We already know he can shoot. 

Bon Jovi -  needs to go away.  Boring.  That song will not fire up anyone, let alone 18-22 year old kids.  

Tai - Smooth, appeared to be very cool and calm.  

Pre-game and in game music - loud.  My 13 year old son approved.  UNL needs to keep it up.  

Tommy Lee - interesting.  I would have rather seen him playing on the drum line during player intros

Concessions - such a small detail, but I really miss the Nebraska souvenir cups! 

[Dean Smith]

Haven't see it anywhere else, so I will be the first to say it, this is an NCAA

I hope you're right but I see this as an example of fans getting too high after a win an the sky is falling after a loss.

[Swan88]

Loved the Bon Jovi video.  To each his own.

[tbowman]

Haven't see it anywhere else, so I will be the first to say it, this is an NCAA

I hope you're right but I see this as an example of fans getting too high after a win an the sky is falling after a loss.

 

You are as knowledgeable as they come Dean Smith so it's tough to argue your viewpoint.

I am pretty high on this team. No question about it. I base my opinion on a couple of things.

1. Shavon Shieds and Tai Webster are both all Big 10 quality at their positions. I think we have barey scratched the surface of how good Tai will be. He can get into the paint any time he wants and is a capable scorer and passer.

2. The role players are really good. Athletic, long, shooters, slashers, scorers, defenders, etc. Great balance and depth.

Been watching NU basketball for over 25 years and this group sees comparable to some of Nee's best teams. And it is far better than any team Doc or Collier rolled out.

No question they will be up and down due to being young and inexperienced, but the talent and conidence is there.

[Dean Smith]

Haven't see it anywhere else, so I will be the first to say it, this is an NCAA

I hope you're right but I see this as an example of fans getting too high after a win an the sky is falling after a loss.

You are as knowledgeable as they come Dean Smith so it's tough to argue your viewpoint.

I am pretty high on this team. No question about it. I base my opinion on a couple of things.

1. Shavon Shieds and Tai Webster are both all Big 10 quality at their positions. I think we have barey scratched the surface of how good Tai will be. He can get into the paint any time he wants and is a capable scorer and passer.

2. The role players are really good. Athletic, long, shooters, slashers, scorers, defenders, etc. Great balance and depth.

Been watching NU basketball for over 25 years and this group sees comparable to some of Nee's best teams. And it is far better than any team Doc or Collier rolled out.

No question they will be up and down due to being young and inexperienced, but the talent and conidence is there.

I'm not disagreeing with you. Just echoing what some others have said about tempering our reaction to the first game. You have to look to find fault with the performance last night - FT's could have been better & I would have liked to see some more post ups but what they did certainly worked. Great first night in the PBA but there might be a couple of long cold winter nights coming. I hope for the best and prepare for the worst. Just saying I think the average fan gets too low & the highs create unmeetable expectations. Personally, I'm just going to sit back and enjoy the season highs/lows/and all that in between.

[hhcmatt]

 

Great night. Only complaint is that goddamn bonjovi video. WHY????? And Benny will be seeing a decent amount of minutes this year. He took a big step in the offseason imo

Yes. Bon Jovi needs to stay in the 80's where they belong. Use something the kids think is cool. 

 

Think of it as clearing the palette....or like a punt

[Norm Peterson]

I agree that Webster is for real.  He may have a future in the pros.  HOWEVER, one nice-ish thing is that he's NOT a one-and-done type of player.  He'll need to develop NBA 3-pt range before he's a threat to leave early.  I figure we should have him at least as long as we had Tyron Lue.

 

Now Pitchford is an interesting player.  He's like a big man version of Ray Gallegos in that you know he brings some really valuable skills to the table but there's an inexplicably big hole in his game.  For as athletic as he is and with the tools that he has, you'd think he'd be able to fill that gap in his offensive game.  But just like Ray hasn't developed the ability (so far as we've seen) to take defenders off the dribble and take it to the rack, you'd think Walt would be able to score in close. 

 

If Ray could drive and if Walt could score inside, we'd be a tough out for any team.

[Bugeaters1]

 

• As most have said Shavon is going to be a stud for us this year, and the next two.  The future is bright.  
• I won't be upset with Fuller redshirting.  The extra year to get used to the speed, get stronger and quicker will serve him well.  We already know he can shoot. 
• Bon Jovi -  needs to go away.  Boring.  That song will not fire up anyone, let alone 18-22 year old kids.  
• Tai - Smooth, appeared to be very cool and calm.  
• Pre-game and in game music - loud.  My 13 year old son approved.  UNL needs to keep it up.  
• Tommy Lee - interesting.  I would have rather seen him playing on the drum line during player intros
• Concessions - such a small detail, but I really miss the Nebraska souvenir cups! 

 

and the price of 4 bucks instead of 5.50

[NUdiehard]

I absolutely loved what I saw from Tai.  He was able to get to the basket almost at will.  Early in the game he was driving to his right hand every time, I commented that I was concerned he doesn't have a left hand.  Sure enough, FGCU came out of a timeout and the defender was playing Tai strongly to his right to take away his right hand penetration.  Without hesitation, Tai darted straight to the basket with his left handle and got right to the rack again.  His height and athleticism allow him to do things that many smaller PGs simply can't do.  He can penetrate, get in with the trees, but still be tall enough and strong enough to see over them for the pass or get all the way to the basket.  His midrange and 3-pt game still need to develop, but he has all the tools.

 

Regarding Webster, I am surprised nobody has mentioned this yet.  In Miles' postgame radio comments, he said that Webster "took over the game" for a period in the first half.  Miles then said that he believes Webster will be an All-Big 10 player before he is done here.  I thought that was a pretty bold, and telling, proclamation from Miles.  I have never even heard him say that about Shavon (although that certainly doesn't mean he may not feel that way about him as well). 

 

Shavon is such is crafty player.  He has really developed a strong baseline game.  I saw at least 2 times where he caught the ball in the corner, started driving the basket along the baseline, and then when the help defense game, he did some sort of Euro 2 footed jump stop to the side (away from the baseline and away from the defender) and then leaned in for the finger roll lay up.  The first time he did it I was blown away but thought he just got lucky.  When he did it again, it was apparent that this is something he has worked on.  He seems a lot stronger, more athletic and more confident this year.  tbowman may be on to something when he says that Shavon could be an All-Big 10 type player.  That may be a bit much to ask from him as just a sophmore, but he appears to be on the right track.

 

I like Petteway a lot, but I am worried that he has a bit of a quick trigger.  Sometimes it seems like he makes up his mind ahead of time that he is going to shoot no matter what rather than allowing the offense to work.  But would probably rather have that than the windshield wiper offense we had under Doc for so many years.  Great to have multiple players on the court who aren't afraid to make things happen and often have the skill to back it up.

 

Pitchfor, I agree with most of what has been said.  Seems to have so much potential, but not sure yet if he has the mentality.  He just does not seem to be comfortable in the low post.  I remember one time he caught the ball in the low block (maybe the only time) and had one-on-one coverage.  He basically just turned and jumped straight up with 2 hands on the ball.  The ref bailed him out and called a foul on the defender, but the whole shot process looked very awkward.

 

Parker was a lot of fun to watch.  He can finish on the break.  With that said, I still question how much he will play once Gallegos and Biggs can play.

 

As for the officiating, like most, I don't like seeing a lot of fouls.  But I am strongly in favor of the new rules.  For all those who keep saying "How is this better seeing a lot of fouls?"  Seriously?  Do you really think that is the "intent" of the new rules and that it will "always" be this way.  No.  The coaches and players will adapt.  The players in the NBA have already adapted and now the NBA is a far more pleasing game to watch than it used to be.  Similarly, once the players and coaches in the college game adapt, the game will be much more pleasing to watch and much more in alignment with the original intent of the game.   Skill should be rewarded in basketball, not unskilled athletes who can simply mug the opponent into submission.  The new rules (which really is simply enforcing the rules that have always been in place), if they stick to calling it, will open up the game and allow playmakers to make plays.  I personally hope the refs don't recoil and go back to the old ways simply because they meet up with a little backlash. When I say this, I am speaking mostly of the handchecking, grabbing, clutching type calls.  I am still not sure about the block/charge rules.  I thought Shavon got away with simply ramming right into his defender multiple times.  The defender looked set on a couple of them to me, I am not sure allowing an offensive player to do this rewards skill.

[Dean Smith]

[quote name="NUdiehard" post="41090" timestamp

As for the officiating, like most, I don't like seeing a lot of fouls. But I am strongly in favor of the new rules. For all those who keep saying "How is this better seeing a lot of fouls?" Seriously? Do you really think that is the "intent" of the new rules and that it will "always" be this way. No. The coaches and players will adapt. The players in the NBA have already adapted and now the NBA is a far more pleasing game to watch than it used to be. Similarly, once the players and coaches in the college game adapt, the game will be much more pleasing to watch.

I don't want to always be the contrary one but I don't think it is a more pleasing game to watch. The NBA was way more physical in the '80's and the scoring was much higher. Lots of teams averaged over 100 & the Nuggetts were at like 126ish a game.

The college game was the same. Loyola Maryamount scored what, in the 130's & Oklahoma averaged over 100 & made the finals before Danny & the Miracles upset them.

I don't think it's the officiating or the physical play, it's simply no one has the will. Everybody is a copy cat and a coward in coaching. Defense has been the emphasis and no one wants to do something risky that might lead to their firing. Paul Westhead had the courage or insanity to play that style. It is hard to recruit to that system because no one wants to work as hard as you need to to make that work.

Every year the tolerance level for losing goes down. One bad year & you're out the door. No one wants to take the risk that trying to play a show time game style would be today.

[royalfan]

I think it is more that over time people become smarter.  Especially with so much film easily dialed up.  Whatever is being done is the way to win at this time IMO.  I believe in efficient markets.  And the coaches as a whole operate efficiently. 

[NUdiehard]

Dean, I know that a lot of us had a long discussion about this topic after the end of last season. I can't remember if you commented on it at the time, but I guess I don't know if I want to go into the detail I did at that time all over again now.  In short, I think the grabbing, clutching, holding, pushing, etc. in the college game has gotten out of hand.  Louisville rode this strategy all the way to a national championship.  Allowing elite athletes (who may or may not be elite basketball players skill wise) to completely shut down their opponents by constantly grabbing, clutching, holding, etc simply is not basketball as it was intended to be played.  There are many coaches who have openly admitted that they teach their players to constantly foul the entire game b/c they know that the refs simply will not call a foul every time down the court.  The coach is basically saying "Even though we clearly are fouling the crap out of the opponent every time down the court, I dare you to blow that whistle every time!"  That is crap IMO.  The refs need to blow that whistle every time down the court until that coach and his players cut the crap out. 

 

As for the NBA, maybe that isn't the best example b/c I believe the NBA has gone through different phases and different "styles" of physicality.  For instance, there certainly was a time when teams were "physical" in the sense that they would initiate "hard fouls".  If a player like Jordan came in the lane, the opponent (ie, Bill Lambier) would knock the crap out of him to intimidate him from coming back in the lane.  But here is the important point.  That was still called a foul!  Jordan would go to the line and get his 2 points.  Heck, Jordan scored about half his points at the free throw line, so any who says they didn't call fouls back then if full of crap.  The type of fouls I think need to be eliminated are the fouls that aren't called in the college game.  The grabbing, clutching, holding, pushing, impeding, etc.  The NBA has elimiated hand checking on the perimeter, but it is still very physical underneath.  Defense also is still more intense than the era you are refering to. I was watching a game from the 80s on NBA channel (A Lakers vs. Boston game, ie Magic, Kareem, McKale, Bird, etc) and I was almost laughing at how soft the defense was for most of the game.  The guards didn't even guard out to the 3 point line.  Dennis Johnson for Boston could dribble around INSIDE THE 3 POINT LINE without anyone within 5 feet of him.  There simply was no pressure until he got to about 17 feet from the basket.  That is totally different from the pressure defense of today, even without the hand check rule. 

 

We also have to be very specific in defining a time period.  The early 80s were much different than the late 80s, and so forth.

 

Anyway, we will just have to agree to disagree.  I hope the refs continue to call the fouls and force these coaches who teach their players to mug the opponent every time down the court to adjust.