NUdiehard

I will concede that the lack of effort in these recent games has been very disappointing. No one wants to watch that, ever. But is it a result of systemic coaching issues? Maybe. But because of Fred's prior coaching success, it seems better to give him some benefit of the doubt. If he is such a pathetic coach who doesn't teach any fundamentals, how did he take an Iowa St. team that had 5 losing seasons prior to him arriving and after one year take them to 4 straight NCAA tourneys with a sweet 16 and (multiple 2nd to 3rd rounds) and in his final year have his best Big 12 conference record of all? How does that happen if he is a bumbling fool of a coach? At the end of last year, the team had to be shut down for over 3 weeks, and then I think most would agree they gave a valiant effort those last few weeks where they crammed in game after game after game and still had a top 40 defense and I don't recall seeing any quit in them at that time. Do you? That was just last year. Did Fred forget how to motivate players since one year ago? Are Fred's problems with this year's team "systemic" if he did not have those same problems just last year? Did his team have problems last year? Absolutely. But the biggest problem was they couldn't score enough. Problem. But a different problem which was largely a result of a different roster (Banton was an excellent defender and rebounder but couldn't shoot to save his life; now we have Verge and Keisei and Bryce, who are decent/good at scoring, but can't defend). Fred has proven he can win in a power 5 conference with the right roster. His incoming recruits look like his best ever. If you fire Fred, next year is almost guaranteed to be disaster no matter what new coach they bring in because the new recruits will probably bail and the whole roster will have to be turned over on short time frame (like Fred's first year). So are you really losing much by giving Fred one more year to see what he can do with these new recruits? If it is a bust, fire him and at least you have the new recruits in house and can try to keep them longer.

Doc was the head coach here for 6 years. Anyone who can’t see that this year’s defense is virtually the same as Doc’s defense doesn’t know basketball. I attended multiple of Doc’s practices when he coached the defense when he was HC. This year’s defensive scheme is the same. Husker.com says Doc is the coordinator of the defense. It is the same defense NU ran last year and the year before when Doc was an assistant coach in charge of defense. Whether he is physically on the floor teaching it everyday is largely irrelevant. He is the one scheming it and developing it, whatever coach is out on the floor is just his mouthpiece.

Whether the problems are systemic is up for debate. Last year's team had a top 40 defense (adjusted for tempo). This year's defense is terrible. The difference was last year they had Delano Banton, a long, athletic player who could defend and rebound at a high level, and this year replaced that with Verge and Keisei. Same coach, different players, different result. Problem was Delano couldn't shoot, which hurt on the offensive end. Again, player problem, not coaching problem. Having players that can shoot, defend and rebound is going to miraculously make the coach and his system look much better. Does anyone dispute this? It may or may not be be "probable" that Fred will be fired and we will have to start over with a new coach in the next year or 2. But it is not 100% certain. There is a chance that if Fred got another year or two, he could turn it around sufficiently that he gets retained for much longer because he is showing improvement and success. I personally think that probably is higher with Fred (who has proven he can win at a power 5 school) than some no-name mid-major who will come here and think he is different than Collier, Sadler and Miles before him. Besides, even if Fred fails to meet expectations in years 4 and/or 5, at least he will have already brought in his new highly ranked recruits. Those recruits are much more likely to stay with the new coach if they are already here and been in the program a year or 2. If you fire Fred now, most of them likely leave and never set foot on campus. Keeping Fred another year or 2 could be the difference between leaving the cupboard bare (if fired this year) vs. leaving fairly well stocked (after next year or the year after). Next year is almost guaranteed to be terrible if we fire Fred now, so I see little downside to keeping him at least one more year.

Why does no one talk about what happens if Fred is fired? If you think bringing back Fred will be bad, how much worse if Fred it fired? If Fred is fired, most current players and probably a lot of the recruits will leave, forcing the new coach to turn over the roster just like Hoiberg had to do in his year 1. There is almost zero chance a new coach will be able to assemble a roster with more talent than Fred will if Fred returns. Why is this such an appealing option? If you fear fans are leaving, hiring a new coach and turning over the entire roster again is not a great way to bring them back. In contrast, If Fred's new recruits come in and show some effort, talent and progress, the fans will return.

Trey has been an absolute disaster on the offensive end ever since coming back.

Lol. So sensitive. There are a lot of Eric’s from Cozad out there.

FWIW, when I mentioned haters I was thinking more about people like Eric from Cozad. Hard to say guy who takes time to personally call Fred to “fire” him isn’t a hater.

Going back to the OP. I still think Fred is the man for the job and I am encouraged by the progress in recruiting I see going forward, especially next year's class. There may not be many of us, but for those of us who still believe Fred is the best chance to get this done at NU, I encourage you all to email Trev and let him know. No doubt, all the cynics and haters are going to be blasting their disdain of Fred to Trev non-stop. One poster already shared his experience of emailing Trev all his grievances. We need to make sure the haters aren't the only voices heard. Trev needs to hear from long-time fans like us that we see things differently. That there are other considerations that show a more positive outlook. That we support Fred and we will continue to go to the games because we believe he has as good or better of chance of turning this around than any new coach. Here is his email. [email protected] Here is his twitter: trevalberts

I know this will sound like excuses, but one other factor I think Trev should take into account is how much the Covid "extra year" affected the strength of teams in the B1G this year. Most believe the B1G is a bit down this year. I disagree. The top may not fill up the national top 10, but top to bottom this league is a beast Northwestern is a really good team. I know, I watched them with my own eyes. Michigan is really good (noticed they beat Purdue by 24 points the other day). Every team I have watched this year (sans maybe Minnesota) looked really solid to me. I especially realized this when I watched NU play Minnesota, who is a good but not great team, and how much different it was than all the other teams we have played so far in the B1G. Other teams were able to retain some very, very good 5th year seniors because of the extra year. Think of Wisconsin and Brad Davison. He torched us. Had it not been for Covid, he wouldn't have been eligible. Many teams have this advantage and having 5th or 6th year players is a huge, huge advatage. In contrast, the only "covid" eligible players on NU are Webster and Lakes (who has been injured and never really played). Now, we could blame Fred for this, but not really. Fred inherited a mess and had to turn over the entire roster in year 1. That is why many argue year 1 should not count. But that turnover did not allow for these 5th and 6th year players to be on the roster this year unlike all of our B1G foes. This is where it gets tricky comparing Fred's record this year to other NU coaches in the past. I just don't think we've ever seen a time when every team in the conference is so good/solid. Plus, the B1G now has 20 conference games, so less chance to beat up on cupcakes (Doc's speciality). And one more thing. And I know y'all are going to scream "excuses excuses", but I can't remember a year like this when the other teams seemed to be so healthy. NU has had two pretty significant injuries in Trey and Wilhelm. It seems like most of the teams we have played this year are at full or close to full strength. I previous years, it seemed other teams always had injuries of major players and that allowed for an upset or two to happen. Heck, a few years ago Miles NU team played Creighton when Creighton had 4 starters injured--and still lost! Not this year. Most every team we have played had most or all of their best players while NU did not have Trey and Wilhelm for most of the year. Does anyone think we don't beat NC State if we have Trey? Maybe others. In short, my position is that year 1 is a throw out year. Year 2 was a mess because of Covid (no fans, players sitting out, the entire team could not play for 3 full weeks and then had to cram a bunch of games in, etc). And now, in year 3, we are still under unique circumstances due to Covid that frankly, IMO, benefit most of the other teams much more than NU just do to the timing of when Fred was hired. Again, call it an excuse. But that is just what I see and that will go away next year because all those "extra year" players will be gone and it will go back to even for everyone.

That's fine, I could maybe go for that. But Keon is not a PF. He is about 170 lbs soaking wet. He would get abused on the defensive end by most teams. and I'm not sure playing him completely out of position (at PF) is "developing" him, but maybe it is worth a try.

Trey was an absolute beast on the defensive end and his intensity and refusal to lose carried over to the entire team. I don't think people give enough credence to how much losing him (and Wilhelm) set back this team this year. With that said, Trey's offense is still way off since he came back. It just has been difficult for him to get his timing and touch after missing so much of the season. He was 2-8 on FG and 2-9 on FTs. That is rough. Verge was atrocious in the first have and electric in the 2nd half. Wild swings. Of course everything looks better when his often ill-advised shots actually go in. Lat was 2-10 missed about 4 point-blank, wide open layups. If NU made half its layups and 70% of its free throws it wins this game by 30. Kobe is super small and is not explosive and is not a PG. That is why he is not a legit B1G player, but unfortunately NU doesn't have any other options. I almost wonder if Fred will try some minutes with Trey at the PG just to see how it goes.

I agree about Lat. But what are the other options? Wilhelm has been out all year. The only other option at PF is Wilcher, who is about 6'4". Combine Wilcher at 6'4 (and no vertical) with Walker at 6',7" (and no vertical), and ya all wonder why we struggle to rebound and defend.

I take it all back. Lol

Nebraska has a massive massive point guard problem.

So we have an under-the-radar recruit who is quickly climbing the rankings after he signed with NU. Hmmm, I thought Fred/Matt A only looked at rankings when evaluating recruits.

I agree. No doubt Fred needs to get a point guard and hopefully another power forward. But honest question, does Wilhelm meet these criteria for you?

Of course there are no guarantees until they suit up and actually perform in college, but the class looks solid and I am way more excited about this 2022 class than I was about the current 2021 class. In fact, I noted my concerns about the 2021 class in February of last year. So why not allow Fred to get all these guys on campus and see what he can do with the them? Will a class of freshmen immediately take us the NCAA? Probably not. But if they are talented and show real promise under Fred's system, it will result in more wins and it will be apparent Fred is now going in the right direction. If they look talented but not thriving under Fred's system, you can fire Fred and hopefully retain some/all of them for the future coach. At least the cupboard won't be bare. And let's be real, if Trev fires Fred after this year, most of these recruits will probably jump ship and then does anyone believe next year will a good year under that new coach. So if next year is almost certainly going to be a rebuilding year (whether Fred or new coach), why not bring in these highly rated recruits and roll the dice with the talented recruits rather than watching the new coach try to turn over the entire roster like Fred had to do in his first year.

So what answer were you looking for in response? What answer would pacify you and "justify" getting tickets next year?

Did Adolf ever go to 4 straight NCAA tourneys and a sweet 16 while coaching a power 5 school?

I agree with a lot of this. The last few years (including this year) has felt like a group of mercenaries. But can we agree that Fred/Matt A appear to have started to change their recruiting philosophy. Next year's (2022) class is 3 HS freshman and 1 sophomore juco player. Now, Fred will probably take one or two transfers as well (as will virtually every team in the country), but the current core of his recruiting class is HS recruits. This is a distinct change in philosophy and practice. And these HS recruits appear to be a pretty solid group. So if Fred has recognized his errors in past recruiting, why not give him a chance to rectify those errors since he has shown he is willing to change his methods/strategy?

The ultimate goal of this program should be to win a game in the NCAA tourney for the first time in its history and then try to put the program in a position to do it again (or even better). The last 100 years or utter futility of this program is a sunk cost. Nothing is going to change what has happened, including the last 3 years which have been the worst in history. The only question is who/how to reach this goal. Some of you seem content to roll in another Doc Sadler level coach and have him squeeze every ounce out of his 2.5 star mighty mites and go 6-14 in conference every year and say "well, at least its better than Fred's first 3 years." Well, if this is your goal, have at it, you will probably get your wish. I've seen that movie every year for 40 years and am not interested in watching it again. Fred and Matt A have completely blown it on the recruiting trail the first 2 years, but this year's class shows some promise (Wilhelm and Wilcher are freshman), and next year's class looks like it should be by far the best yet, and they are all HS recruits, not transfers. Fred also has almost a virtual lock on a top 100 2023 recruit in Parker Friedrichsen and has many other top level prospects still on the line such as Avery Brown, etc. So who has a better chance to get us to our first tourney win within the next 2-3 years? A new coach who will be starting completely over and most likely lose much/all of the 2022 and 2023 recruits commits? Or Fred who has proven he can win if he has the right players and appears to have made significant strides on the recruiting front starting with next year's class? I roll with Fred. And for me it's simple. If these 2022 and 2023 recruits don't pan out, then okay, the decision is easy, fire him after his 5th year. At least we will then know we gave him every opportunity to get his guys and he failed. But if we fire him now, we will never know. But if we fire him now, I think we can all pretty much know for sure that NU will not be winning a tourney game in the next 2-3 years because the new coach will be starting over from scratch and so the process starts over again.

Miles is currently winless (0-10) in the Mountain West Conference. And has a 36 point home loss to CSU (how ironic), a 25 point loss to UNLV, a 30 point home loss to Fresno St., a 20 point road loss to Fresno St., multiple other 16+ point losses.

I agree that we need talented pieces that fit together (gel) to be successful, and we clearly don't have that. But where is all this "top level" talent you speak of? Just because guys like Walker and Edwards were highly ranked out of HS doesn't mean they are top level talent. Those recruiting rankings were misses. Bryce is talented but he is a freshman. There are very, very few freshman who come in and carry a power 5 team, and Bryce is not one of them. He could be that by his Jr. or Sr year (maybe even as a sophomore), but he won't be here that long. Verge is a spaz and a headcase and the most undisciplined defensive player I've ever seen in my life. I know that Robin said Verge had some guarantee of a 2-way NBA contract but that is rubbish. No way any pro team guaranteed him anything, that is probably something Verge (or his "camp") told Robin and Robin just took their word. Walker is nothing close to a 4 start talent, even though his HS rankings said he was. I could go on. Once the players have played in college the recruiting rankings are meaningless, we can all just use our eyes and brains to determine if they truly are top level talent.

So Smith is 1-10 in the Pac12 this year. I guess he forgot how to coach too!

I also stated that another strategy is to only allow Matt A to scout/evaluate appox. 3 of the 7 recruits. The other assistants and Fred would scout/evaluate the remaining 4 recruits. Its not that complicated. As for Parker Friedrichsen (the guard from Oklahoma), he is one of the reasons I am in favor of giving Fred 5 years. Say what you want about how the relationship started, but it clearly has developed and matured to a point that Parker seems almost a lock to come to NU if Fred is retained. I would not feel nearly so confident if Fred is fired. He is a top 100 recruit and a very skilled player, yet probably not good enough to go to the NBA anytime soon. He is the exact type of player we need in the program. I feel similarly about many of the 2022 recruits. So my position in a nutshell. Fred/Matt A have failed miserably in their recruiting the first 2 years. The third year (this year's class), was a bit better but still not good enough. I do think Wilhelm can develop into a very solid B1G level player by his Jr./Sr years. And let's remember, he will be a freshman next year b/c of his injury. Add in Wilcher and Tominaga as role player 3-point specialist. They are not great, and probably not starter quality, but can be rotation players on a good team by their Jr./Sr. years. The 2022 class is where I believe Matt A really stepped up his game. Ramel Lloyd has a massive offer list, including Kansas, Oregon, etc. He is very athletic and looks to have some of that "dog" in him. Washut recently said that Jamarques Lawrence is playing so well he will be in the top 150 soon. Keita hopefully is a legit big man. And although Dawson is a wildcard, but he has good length and is athletic, and Fred has already said he plays with passion and energy (dives on the floor, etc). We also are still in play for some very solid recruits like Avery Brown, who would the perfect PG IMO. Matt A may not be able to reel him in, but he at least has a decent shot. So in short, I see considerable improvement. I could be wrong. All these future recruits could be busts just like the past couple years. But I am just going off what I read/watch/hear and that is why i am willing to give them more time.