nustudent

All I’m saying is if you fire him before these guys get to campus, you’ll never see them. If you give him a shot next year, maybe he succeeds. Probably not. But at least the next guy has a better core to start with so the next guy isn’t walking into the same situation Hoiberg did.

Maybe. But one was a guarantee. The other there is at least a faint hope. You also save millions in the process. And give the next guy a slightly better foundation to start with.

Maybe so. Not saying a lot of that isn’t true. But id still rather have the recruits we appear to have than scramble

We’re going to add 2-3 thus April. Not 7 or 8 like we would’ve otherwise.

Maybe it won’t be. On paper it’s good for us historically. I’ll take that over the alternative of trying to reach to build a roster over 3 weeks in April again.

Not in this amount.

I’d rather have 3 top 150 players than not.

I gave Miles 4.5 years too.

Maybe so. But we were going to be awful next year regardless of coach. At least this gives us a fighting chance with a good recruiting class. And we save money in the meantime.

I'm not saying he's going to win. I'm just saying making a move next year is much better for the long term picture for Nebraska then making it now. Odds are we'll move on after next year (though I do think we'll be better than 7-25). But we just saved ourselves over $8M and added a Top 25-30ish recruiting class to the roster.

Good. It's the right choice. Worst case scenario...we fail again, which we'd do with a new coach anyways, and fire Hoiberg...saving $7.5M and bringing in some talent that looks good on paper that we could theoretically keep. Best case scenario....the talent pans out.

He did. But you're going to have a hard time convincing me that was 100% Frost's choice. I know the public coach speak comments from Frost and Alberts indicate as such...but I think that was as much Frost saving his own neck rather than some noble move and actually seeing the issue. And I think Hoiberg should be allowed to do the same.

Which is a concern for me. Money was supposedly an issue with football. But now we can easily afford $18.5M for basketball. Quite the double standard there. And I'm not saying that Fred deserves to keep his job...but I don't like the moving goalposts.

I'm assuming we'd pay it out in installments. If so...we're essentially paying two coaches for another year. On top of that...we may be doing that in football as well soon too. Saving a few million maybe needed. It also may be more than a few million if you can negotiate a lower buyout as well.

I think he's willing...which is step 1. Of course....when he has to defend the 4 in the Big Ten...it's not going to go well, no matter how willing he is.

I guess for me...the money. Because firing Hoiberg and having another massive gut job is another pretty big step towards a 20-loss season. We might hit again with Hoiberg anyway....but for me....I don't have a lot of hope that it turns with Hoiberg next year. But I know it won't turn next year with a complete changing of the guard. I can risk another year of failure to know for sure. Plus you save money in the process.

Understand the point on availability. I just find it hard to believe though that you can't periodically do it. Even for a few minutes at a time in select moments. I know you can't do it full time. And I wonder if playing alongside another capable big guy helps Andre out at all. When Andre's counterpart in the post is CJ Wilcher....he's kind of behind the 8 ball already. I like Wilcher as a SG. I don't like him having to guard Keegan Murray

That's one year of salary to the new guy at the very least. And again...considering we may have some huge payouts coming for football too....$3.5M can matter. That's also assuming there is no reduced buyout.

I can see Walker at the 5 again as well. Body wise he's probably more suited for the 4. Skill wise for the 5. I do think he can defend the 4 better if he actually gets set in that role with another viable big next to him. One thing I have been disappointed with Fred in, is the fact that we refuse to try different lineup combinations in the frontcourt. I get that it isn't ideal and depth wise we certainly can't do it all game....but you really can't try to put a Walker and Andre combination on the floor at the same time just for spot minutes against bigger teams? I'd be all for a PG too. Just don't know if the type of PG that we need will be willing to come here. I'm somewhat skeptical of a 6'6" PG but Lloyd has played it some through AAU and high school in addition to being you traditional wing.

They do need to be coached. And it's fair to doubt whether we have the staff to do it. That being said, I also struggle completely disregarding the Iowa State tenure. He certainly hasn't shown much here. But I view this as much as year 2 as year 3 because year 1 was going to be a disaster regardless of who was coaching here. And if ISU was a one and done situation, it'd be easy for me to disregard it as a lightning in the bottle situation. 5 out of 6 years isn't a fluke, in my opinion. There was something there. Whether that translates or he can duplicate it, we will see, but unlike most of our failed coaches in football and basketball, he is a guy who has had success at a P5 level. This probably outlines that sad state that we are in but I guess I look at it like this.....if we fire Fred...I have zero hope for being decent next year. Any hope would be solely focused on the future. And considering Fred's massive buyout and the fact we may have to be hiring and firing a football coach next year, I wonder how much we are going to be willing to spend to bring a capable guy in. And he's certainly not cemented himself as a good coach here, but if he is fired there's going to be massive turnover again and we will undoubtedly lose back to back good recruiting classes. If we keep Fred, I'm still apprehensive in believing we will be good, but I have more hope for next year with him than not. He'll have parts next year that he's never had here. I guess I'd rather see a team next year with back to back recruiting classes stacked on top of each other rather than another gut job. If he didn't have talent coming in, I'd be less likely to have any desire to see him come back. He may or may not be a good coach but I guess I'd like to see him with his most complete roster yet where we seemingly have viable options at each position (as opposed to 2 or 3) and can play teams more straight up so we know for sure. And part of me is putting a lot on Keita. We have been outsized and outmuscled in the post basically since we joined the Big 10. If Keita lives up to the billing, he's a body type that we haven't had since Maric, and maybe even before him. Should we keep a guy for one player? Probably not. But considering the timing and alternatives, I'm okay with giving Fred another shot. I certainly understand the doubting of his coaching and the effort issues are concerning. But I think his biggest failure to date was how this team was put together personnel wise more so than X's and O's. This isn't to excuse the weak-mindedness or lack of effort, but having the physical ability to stack up against your opponents and knowing it...can do a lot mentally. We haven't been able to/can't really stack up of physically. Some of that is Fred's fault. Some of that is what he inherited. Some of that is bad luck. Lastly, I guess I see the worst thing that happens with Fred is we give him another year. If he fails, we fire him and move on with a smaller buyout to pay. If we fire him now, we lose quite a bit of talent digging the hole deeper for the next guy who is going to be anything but a sure bet anyways.

As I said...I don't know for sure if we'll be better but having the necessary ingredients is the first step. It's very clear we haven't had them yet. On paper that group certainly seems better and more complete. It's entirely possible it isn't. But if we're speculating...I'd much rather speculate on something that looks good on paper as opposed to something that doesn't.

Don't think either is a superstar player here or scoring at the level they do. But both could play here. Both are better players than guys like Tominaga and Lat. I also think they probably make a few of our better players better as well.

Not that I think it's a given to change a bunch....but I'd just prefer to see Fred back for one more with a reduced buyout opportunity similar to Frost. Seems like we say this every year....but I do think next year would be a more complete team if Walker returns. Our effort obviously isn't the best, but when your only post player remains Walker, you are going to be hurting on post defense and rebounding. Between Keita, Wilhelm, Walker and a mixture of Andre and Oleg, I think you have a pretty significantly different front court. I also think chemistry may be a bit better. While you have some relatively talented recruits coming in, none are on the level of Bryce and with Verge leaving...that takes two shot hunters out of the rotation. A roster of: PG: McPherson, Lloyd SG: Wilcher, Lawrence SF: Dawson, Edwards PF: Walker, Wilhelm Post: Keita, Andre, Oleg Is something that feels much more complete to me than this year's. A guy like Verge is individually talented, but obviously does his own thing and was a late add. All those guys starting aren't 'quick fix' or 'one and done' transfers. I'm not convinced it'd be a great team, but I do think it'd look a lot different. I wouldn't mind seeing them go after some transfers, but as someone mentioned, I want it to be more of a culture guy than raw talent or upside. I'd love to go see them get a guy like Griesel or Scheierman who aren't superstars but are solid all around players to mix into the group and would theoretically have some pride since they are playing at home. Between the recruiting class and the money....I can live with him returning for another year. If $20M is too much for football, $18.5M seems too much for basketball as well. We've had enough turnover over the last x amount of years roster wise that getting some of those recruits here wouldn't be a terrible thing. Even if you fire Fred next year, it gives the next coach a fighting chance to keep some. Additionally on the money, not only do we have to pay Fred, but we have to pay the next guy too. Can we afford to spend what we need too on the next guy if we're paying Fred that much? Because of those things, I can live with Fred for another year.

I think you meant to tag Diehard rather than me. That being said, I agree Fred was left a mess from a returning talent perspective. But that doesn’t mean he’s not culpable in what’s going on right now. If we can’t afford $20M for football, we can’t afford $18.5M for basketball. So he’ll keep his job moreso for that than the direction we’re heading. im sure there will be some reworking of the contract in case he wins 7 again next year.

Think we will be in the 18-13 range, which with our non-con and the Big 10's strength should put us firmly on the bubble.