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Handy Johnson

Golden St vs Cleveland

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Can you name the 3 Cornhuskers who played for Golden St.? If you guessed Dave Hoppen, Tony Farmer, and Mikki Moore you'd be right. I am rooting for the Warriors (always had a soft spot, Keith Wilkes ya know) plus I've NEVER been a LeBron fan and that was only cemented by the "Decision". High profile free agents have been switching teams for years and never had a TV show and bragged about 8 Titles when they haven't won one. I know it's a reflection of the times, but that doesn't mean I have to like it.

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Can you name the 3 Cornhuskers who played for Golden St.? If you guessed Dave Hoppen, Tony Farmer, and Mikki Moore you'd be right. I am rooting for the Warriors (always had a soft spot, Keith Wilkes ya know) plus I've NEVER been a LeBron fan and that was only cemented by the "Decision". High profile free agents have been switching teams for years and never had a TV show and bragged about 8 Titles when they haven't won one. I know it's a reflection of the times, but that doesn't mean I have to like it.

 

The man has never gotten into legal trouble or had a scandal, despite being in the national spotlight since he was in high school.  By all accounts he's highly intelligent, an active father, and an overall solid role model.  Compare that with the average professional athlete today who does far worse while under a much smaller microscope.  And you want to complain about a one-hour TV broadcast, which he agreed to do in exchange for raising $6 million for charity?  It always amazes me how many sports fans are able to separate on- and off-field performance for everyone other than LeBron.  They can literally cheer for criminals, and yet hold a grudge against a guy for a couple arrogant statements made five years ago.

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im interested in this finals, simply because of how Cleveland has changed its identity throughout the season, with the initial focus being a on a Princeton esque offense that Blatt wanted to run, that openly didn't work, than they traded for Mozgov, and adapted a little more, than Kevin Love got hurt, to with Thompson, Mozgov and James they can outright bully other teams, to move Mozgov to the bench, and have a 3point small ball lineup that is a frenzy on defense, should be a very interesting series. Depending on Kyrie's health Cavs in 7

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Can you name the 3 Cornhuskers who played for Golden St.? If you guessed Dave Hoppen, Tony Farmer, and Mikki Moore you'd be right. I am rooting for the Warriors (always had a soft spot, Keith Wilkes ya know) plus I've NEVER been a LeBron fan and that was only cemented by the "Decision". High profile free agents have been switching teams for years and never had a TV show and bragged about 8 Titles when they haven't won one. I know it's a reflection of the times, but that doesn't mean I have to like it.

 

The man has never gotten into legal trouble or had a scandal, despite being in the national spotlight since he was in high school.  By all accounts he's highly intelligent, an active father, and an overall solid role model.  Compare that with the average professional athlete today who does far worse while under a much smaller microscope.  And you want to complain about a one-hour TV broadcast, which he agreed to do in exchange for raising $6 million for charity?  It always amazes me how many sports fans are able to separate on- and off-field performance for everyone other than LeBron.  They can literally cheer for criminals, and yet hold a grudge against a guy for a couple arrogant statements made five years ago.

 

Being a good Father, staying out of jail, and not beating your wife is what you're SUPPOSED to do, and shouldn't be overly celebrated. He's freakishly athletic, big, but I've always considered him an average shooter and highly overrated. I hope the Warriors take 'em in 4. 

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Can you name the 3 Cornhuskers who played for Golden St.? If you guessed Dave Hoppen, Tony Farmer, and Mikki Moore you'd be right. I am rooting for the Warriors (always had a soft spot, Keith Wilkes ya know) plus I've NEVER been a LeBron fan and that was only cemented by the "Decision". High profile free agents have been switching teams for years and never had a TV show and bragged about 8 Titles when they haven't won one. I know it's a reflection of the times, but that doesn't mean I have to like it.

 

The man has never gotten into legal trouble or had a scandal, despite being in the national spotlight since he was in high school.  By all accounts he's highly intelligent, an active father, and an overall solid role model.  Compare that with the average professional athlete today who does far worse while under a much smaller microscope.  And you want to complain about a one-hour TV broadcast, which he agreed to do in exchange for raising $6 million for charity?  It always amazes me how many sports fans are able to separate on- and off-field performance for everyone other than LeBron.  They can literally cheer for criminals, and yet hold a grudge against a guy for a couple arrogant statements made five years ago.

 

Being a good Father, staying out of jail, and not beating your wife is what you're SUPPOSED to do, and shouldn't be overly celebrated. He's freakishly athletic, big, but I've always considered him an average shooter and highly overrated. I hope the Warriors take 'em in 4. 

 

He's an above average shooter, but to call him highly overrated is definitely pushing it.  I'm someone that disagreed with the way he handled the transition to Miami, but since then I feel like off the court he's become much more respectable.  But with that being said, if you don't respect him as the best player in the world, you're out of your mind.

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Can you name the 3 Cornhuskers who played for Golden St.? If you guessed Dave Hoppen, Tony Farmer, and Mikki Moore you'd be right. I am rooting for the Warriors (always had a soft spot, Keith Wilkes ya know) plus I've NEVER been a LeBron fan and that was only cemented by the "Decision". High profile free agents have been switching teams for years and never had a TV show and bragged about 8 Titles when they haven't won one. I know it's a reflection of the times, but that doesn't mean I have to like it.

 

The man has never gotten into legal trouble or had a scandal, despite being in the national spotlight since he was in high school.  By all accounts he's highly intelligent, an active father, and an overall solid role model.  Compare that with the average professional athlete today who does far worse while under a much smaller microscope.  And you want to complain about a one-hour TV broadcast, which he agreed to do in exchange for raising $6 million for charity?  It always amazes me how many sports fans are able to separate on- and off-field performance for everyone other than LeBron.  They can literally cheer for criminals, and yet hold a grudge against a guy for a couple arrogant statements made five years ago.

 

Being a good Father, staying out of jail, and not beating your wife is what you're SUPPOSED to do, and shouldn't be overly celebrated. He's freakishly athletic, big, but I've always considered him an average shooter and highly overrated. I hope the Warriors take 'em in 4. 

 

 

LeBron might be an average shooter (particularly from beyond 19'), but there aren't many competent point forwards that can do the things he does, i.e. passing & running plays, that would typically be done by a point guard & head coach, respectively. ;)

 

So, the "highly overrated" that you may think of in regards to LeBron seems to be more based on the 'coverage by the media' than the "substance of the man." He's clearly one of the best, if not the best, players in the game, which means that the 'overrated' comment isn't based on his overall skill or his acumen (hoops IQ) or, quite frankly, the way he plays the game, IMHO. LeBron is the ultimate baller, and one of the very best to do it at this level.

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Can you name the 3 Cornhuskers who played for Golden St.? If you guessed Dave Hoppen, Tony Farmer, and Mikki Moore you'd be right. I am rooting for the Warriors (always had a soft spot, Keith Wilkes ya know) plus I've NEVER been a LeBron fan and that was only cemented by the "Decision". High profile free agents have been switching teams for years and never had a TV show and bragged about 8 Titles when they haven't won one. I know it's a reflection of the times, but that doesn't mean I have to like it.

 

The man has never gotten into legal trouble or had a scandal, despite being in the national spotlight since he was in high school.  By all accounts he's highly intelligent, an active father, and an overall solid role model.  Compare that with the average professional athlete today who does far worse while under a much smaller microscope.  And you want to complain about a one-hour TV broadcast, which he agreed to do in exchange for raising $6 million for charity?  It always amazes me how many sports fans are able to separate on- and off-field performance for everyone other than LeBron.  They can literally cheer for criminals, and yet hold a grudge against a guy for a couple arrogant statements made five years ago.

 

Being a good Father, staying out of jail, and not beating your wife is what you're SUPPOSED to do, and shouldn't be overly celebrated. He's freakishly athletic, big, but I've always considered him an average shooter and highly overrated. I hope the Warriors take 'em in 4. 

 

 

So why don't you like him? I'm confused. He has greatly improved his shooting since entering the league. You are blind if you can't recognize he has been the preeminent talent in the sport for the past 8 years, and probably the most naturally gifted player to play since Shaq or Jordan. Even if your first statement is true, Lebron is the moderate exception, not the standard to which star athletes are held. He's a good guy on the court, good guy off, I don't understand why anyone other than Celtics, Bulls, or Heat fans have beef with him

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This wasn't meant to be a Lebron rant, but histrionics demand a response. Is he one of the best to ever play the game? Absolutely. I grow weary though of the endless "Best Ever" talk, especially since it will always be SO subjective. That being said, I can think of 5 players off the top of my head who were better, Magic-Kareem-Shaq-Kobe-Jordan. Don't fall into the trap of believing that whatever is happening NOW is bigger and better than anything preceding it. That's pure fallacy. 

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I am going into the finals with no real interest as to who wins, I just want to see fantastic basketball with it going all seven games.  I wish both teams were 100% healthy, but regardless, it should be a battle. 
 

For the most part, I give the NBA credit as they found a way to open up their game.  It is still moderately physical, but nowhere close to what it was in the recent past.  As a result, you actaually see the game of basketball played and talented players can make high level plays.

 

There are reasons to like both of these teams.  I guess the fact that it seems Cleveland is more past due than Golden State and Lue is due for another ring provides a slight pull towards the Cavs...but again, I just want to see talent rise to the top.

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I grew up watching Jordan.  Lebron is the 2nd best player I've ever seen, and will close in on MJ if he gets more rings in Cleveland.  I say this because he can play positions 1-5 effectively on both ends of the court, which is insane.  

 

As for The Decision, it was a hugely dumb move from a PR standpoint, but he's also the first person to turn a free agency decision into $6 million for charity, this in addition to already being among the leagues most charitable players.  

 

I really like Golden State as well.  I think they're the favorites.  Should be a great matchup.  

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I grew up watching Jordan.  Lebron is the 2nd best player I've ever seen, and will close in on MJ if he gets more rings in Cleveland.  I say this because he can play positions 1-5 effectively on both ends of the court, which is insane.  

 

As for The Decision, it was a hugely dumb move from a PR standpoint, but he's also the first person to turn a free agency decision into $6 million for charity, this in addition to already being among the leagues most charitable players.  

 

I really like Golden State as well.  I think they're the favorites.  Should be a great matchup.  

Sorry can't help myself. He can handle the ball and be a "point-forward" such as Paul Pressey did but he does not have the mindset to play point guard for extended periods. He might be able to play an average 5 today but if so that speaks more about the lack of quality centers than it does about Lebron's ability. The centers of the 70's-00's would have killed him. Lebron is a fabulous player and take him for what he is. I don't think either is the GOAT but great players. Regardless picture Lebron trying to guard Jabbar, Moses, Gilmore, Ewing, Hakeem, Ewing, Robinson, Duncan and Shaq,  or even the Cartwrights, Mornings, Smits, or Daugherty. A possession or two caught on a switch maybe. Take an entire game and they all wear him out. 

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I grew up watching Jordan.  Lebron is the 2nd best player I've ever seen, and will close in on MJ if he gets more rings in Cleveland.  I say this because he can play positions 1-5 effectively on both ends of the court, which is insane.  

 

As for The Decision, it was a hugely dumb move from a PR standpoint, but he's also the first person to turn a free agency decision into $6 million for charity, this in addition to already being among the leagues most charitable players.  

 

I really like Golden State as well.  I think they're the favorites.  Should be a great matchup.  

Sorry can't help myself. He can handle the ball and be a "point-forward" such as Paul Pressey did but he does not have the mindset to play point guard for extended periods. He might be able to play an average 5 today but if so that speaks more about the lack of quality centers than it does about Lebron's ability. The centers of the 70's-00's would have killed him. Lebron is a fabulous player and take him for what he is. I don't think either is the GOAT but great players. Regardless picture Lebron trying to guard Jabbar, Moses, Gilmore, Ewing, Hakeem, Ewing, Robinson, Duncan and Shaq,  or even the Cartwrights, Mornings, Smits, or Daugherty. A possession or two caught on a switch maybe. Take an entire game and they all wear him out. 

 

 

I don't entirely disagree that he'd have trouble handling the centers with these crazy skillsets, but also consider his ability to outrun all of those centers and stretch the floor against any of those guys.  Also:

 

Jabbar = 225 lbs

Malone = 215 lbs

Gilmore = 240 lbs

Ewing = 240 lbs

Hakeem = 250 lbs

Robinson = 236 lbs

Duncan = 256 lbs

Shaq = 325 lbs

 

Lebron = 265 at "4" weight...  I think we forget the only person on that list that would body him up is Shaq.

 

Here's a video of Lebron killing Gasol who, by the way, weighs 254--40 lbs more than Malone, 10lbs less than Lebron (who is also at 5% body fat).  He couldn't make Lebron move an inch.  I think Lebron's weight is often forgotten in these arguments.  

 

 

Defense matters in the GOAT discussion, IMO.  I know you love Magic, but he had some serious defensive liabilities against quicker guards and slow help defense when he was guarding shooters (John Paxon).  Lebron is easily a Rodman-level defender with similar height and way more strength.  

 

Like I said, I wouldn't call him GOAT yet, but he's the only guy in my generation that I'd say is talented enough to pull it off.  

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I grew up watching Jordan.  Lebron is the 2nd best player I've ever seen, and will close in on MJ if he gets more rings in Cleveland.  I say this because he can play positions 1-5 effectively on both ends of the court, which is insane.  

 

As for The Decision, it was a hugely dumb move from a PR standpoint, but he's also the first person to turn a free agency decision into $6 million for charity, this in addition to already being among the leagues most charitable players.  

 

I really like Golden State as well.  I think they're the favorites.  Should be a great matchup.  

Sorry can't help myself. He can handle the ball and be a "point-forward" such as Paul Pressey did but he does not have the mindset to play point guard for extended periods. He might be able to play an average 5 today but if so that speaks more about the lack of quality centers than it does about Lebron's ability. The centers of the 70's-00's would have killed him. Lebron is a fabulous player and take him for what he is. I don't think either is the GOAT but great players. Regardless picture Lebron trying to guard Jabbar, Moses, Gilmore, Ewing, Hakeem, Ewing, Robinson, Duncan and Shaq,  or even the Cartwrights, Mornings, Smits, or Daugherty. A possession or two caught on a switch maybe. Take an entire game and they all wear him out. 

 

 

I don't entirely disagree that he'd have trouble handling the centers with these crazy skillsets, but also consider his ability to outrun all of those centers and stretch the floor against any of those guys.  Also:

 

Jabbar = 225 lbs

Malone = 215 lbs

Gilmore = 240 lbs

Ewing = 240 lbs

Hakeem = 250 lbs

Robinson = 236 lbs

Duncan = 256 lbs

Shaq = 325 lbs

 

Lebron = 265 at "4" weight...  I think we forget the only person on that list that would body him up is Shaq.

 

Here's a video of Lebron killing Gasol who, by the way, weighs 254--40 lbs more than Malone, 10lbs less than Lebron (who is also at 5% body fat).  He couldn't make Lebron move an inch.  I think Lebron's weight is often forgotten in these arguments.  

 

 

Defense matters in the GOAT discussion, IMO.  I know you love Magic, but he had some serious defensive liabilities against quicker guards and slow help defense when he was guarding shooters (John Paxon).  Lebron is easily a Rodman-level defender with similar height and way more strength.  

 

Like I said, I wouldn't call him GOAT yet, but he's the only guy in my generation that I'd say is talented enough to pull it off.  

 

Don't get me wrong, I think Lebron is great player. That's not my point. You said many of those listed would have trouble running the floor with Lebron. He's a matchup problem in any era he plays but very few on my list would be guarding him (He's not outrunning Karl Malone and I hated Malone - rightfully dubbed one of the dirtiest players of all time). My point is another difference between today and the 80's & 90's is the depth of teams due to expansion. James did a great job of fronting Gasol on that one night but I don't see Pau Gasol as an all star in the 80's and 90's. Lebron is playing great tonight but it has just been shown he isn't big enough to guard Draymond Green on the block. let alone anyone on my list.

 

Now since this is all subjective someone tell me Gasol is allstar material in the 80-90's. Know that you only get 4ish power forwards on the all star team every year and then tell me which one of these guys he bumps.

 

Ralph Sampson - another guy who could run. Bad knees or he's one of the greatest of all time. And he was a 4 playing next to Hakeem 

Charles Barkley

Kevin McHale

Tim Duncan 

Kevin Willis

Danny Manning

Shawn Kemp

Karl Malone (hated him)

Dennis Rodman (hated him more)

 

Guys like Cliff Robinson and Derrick Coleman rarely made the all star team. Gasol is a good but not great forward in those two decades. One of those players that were named later in the big trade. I seem to have distracted myself here about Gasol but I don't see anyone on that list that James (as good as he is) would have consistent success trying to guard on the low block.

 

Edit: except of course Rodman who for most of his career had no interest in scoring.

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I'm all in for Tyronn Lue snagging an NBA title on the coaching side of the game.

 

That said (outside of Columbus Crew getting a title in 2002), I do get slight enjoyment out the fact that the state of Nebraska has just as many professional championship teams as the state of Ohio over the last 25 years.

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A 4th Husker?

 

Remember Ricky Marsh who played for the Huskers his freshman year in the late 70's?  He transferred to college in NY, had a very good career, and was drafted and played for Golden State in 1977-78.  Would have been nice to have him finish his career in Lincoln.  Played alongside Jerry Fort I believe.

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A 4th Husker?

 

Remember Ricky Marsh who played for the Huskers his freshman year in the late 70's?  He transferred to college in NY, had a very good career, and was drafted and played for Golden State in 1977-78.  Would have been nice to have him finish his career in Lincoln.  Played alongside Jerry Fort I believe.

 

Nice first post with a great memory from the way back machine. That is so long ago, I was on campus...but I never would have remembered this.

Welcome to the board.

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More food for thought, while LeBron has played for 5 straight titles, name the best team from the East he defeated to get there. Was it the Bulls with a banged up Rose? An aging Celtics squad? or Paul George and the Pacers? None of those teams are historically good and in fact are probably only above average. It's important to keep things in perspective when the superlatives start to fly...

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A 4th Husker?

 

Remember Ricky Marsh who played for the Huskers his freshman year in the late 70's?  He transferred to college in NY, had a very good career, and was drafted and played for Golden State in 1977-78.  Would have been nice to have him finish his career in Lincoln.  Played alongside Jerry Fort I believe.

That's some impressive recall my man. That's back when Freddie Banks picked UNLV over the Big Red, and yes, welcome to the board!

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A 4th Husker?

 

Remember Ricky Marsh who played for the Huskers his freshman year in the late 70's?  He transferred to college in NY, had a very good career, and was drafted and played for Golden State in 1977-78.  Would have been nice to have him finish his career in Lincoln.  Played alongside Jerry Fort I believe.

That's some impressive recall my man. That's back when Freddie Banks picked UNLV over the Big Red, and yes, welcome to the board!

 

 

 

I remember the Freddie Banks story, but wasn't that just a few years ago?   Wait... now that you got me thinking...  it was over 35 years ago...  OMG!!!  I'm old :-(

 

P.S.  I have been a lurker since almost the beginning of this board.  I can't believe this is the first time I've posted.

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More food for thought, while LeBron has played for 5 straight titles, name the best team from the East he defeated to get there. Was it the Bulls with a banged up Rose? An aging Celtics squad? or Paul George and the Pacers? None of those teams are historically good and in fact are probably only above average. It's important to keep things in perspective when the superlatives start to fly...

 

Not to defend him or anything, but those are factors you can't control. Then again, we should probably start putting asterisks on all of the Champion/Runner-Up banners Lebron's teams put up just for good measure ;)

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I will chime in and say while I am not a fan of LeBron I do respect him on the court.  Off the court he regrets "the decision" and owns it.  Since then he has matured and he has been a pretty dang good role model for young men.  I would argue better than MJ and Kobe, especially since neither one of those guys came up in the twitter, social media 24 hour world.

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I will chime in and say while I am not a fan of LeBron I do respect him on the court. Off the court he regrets "the decision" and owns it. Since then he has matured and he has been a pretty dang good role model for young men. I would argue better than MJ and Kobe, especially since neither one of those guys came up in the twitter, social media 24 hour world.

I would second that. Lebron has been willing to make statements about things he thinks are important outside of basketball, such as being willing to join the "I can't breathe" T-shirt group knowing some people would disagree with that. Michael Jordan refused to do anything that could possibly upset anyone and cut into his ability to make a buck. Charles may have said they are not role models but they are and Jordan had a pretty good sized platform to try to make a difference about anything he really believed in but the only thing we ever found out he believed was that he liked making money. Now you can tell me that there is nothing wrong with making money but that does mean the williness to take a stand does make Lebron a better role model.

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