Recruiting: Rome was not built in a day. (Warning: very long.)

[Norm Peterson]

Just reading through some of the recent threads covering recruiting topics, it seems there's some angst in Husker nation.  I think one might reasonably ask "If the gleaming new facilities and excitement surrounding the program didn't land us a 4-star recruit this year, why should we think they'll do any more for us next year?"  You might look at some of the recent happenings and say we missed a window of opportunity or that fancy new facilities didn't get us the recruiting bump we were hoping for and now we're looking at more of the same in the years to come.  If we can't fill a small class this year, how can we hope to fill a larger class next year?

 

Fear not!  Norm is here with plenty of Kool-Aid.  I have enough to go around.

 

First of all, I think having nice digs is important but it's only part of an overall package and the overall package is something we still don't quite yet have.  I think Tim Miles has a dynamic personality that will appeal to recruits and he's lined up a staff that seems to be connected and engaged.  He can recruit to a place with brand-new facilities that rival those of any program anywhere.  But, at the end of the day, we're still Nebraska, a team that hasn't won an NCAA tournament game.  And that still poses a psychological barrier for potential recruits.

 

Looking back at the last two coaching regimes, I think some lessons stand out.  One of those lessons is that it simply takes time.  You can't expect to become awesome overnight.  Not sustained, institutional awesomeness.  You have to build it.  And this means a new coach has to hit the ground running and be fortunate to make good decisions along the way.  Because part of the recruiting success you have two years from now is going to be based on how well you do on the floor this season.  And you have to maintain the momentum.  You have to.

 

Look at the way Connie Yori's program has been built up over time.  She is now getting her foot in the door with -- and LANDING -- players she'd have only dreamed of when she first started here.  Her class of 2014 commits is outstanding.  But it is where it is not because of practice facilities or new arena but because of the amazing run they had a couple of years ago when Kelsey Griffin took the team to the Sweet 16.  Facilities helped.  But you also had to be able to convince recruits that you could deliver team success.  And Connie's success on the floor is yielding dividends.

 

Over the years, I've given some thought to maybe what went wrong with Miles' predecessors.  Like it or not, things went wrong.  We didn't reach the NCAA tourney under the last two coaches, let alone win a game there.  Whatever bump we might have hoped for with a coaching change stalled before we were able to realize the success we hoped for.  And I think it had a lot to do with recruiting for both of those two prior staffs.

 

When Collier arrived, I think he made some crucial mistakes.  I used to blame him for not trying hard enough to keep Louis Truscott.  The reality is I don't know whether Louis would have transferred no matter what Collier did but the fact is that Louis left when we needed size and athleticism, something he had plenty of.  And, as I recall, he left as we were heading into the school year as opposed to right away when Danny Nee was fired.  That had always suggested to me that Collier moved him out the door but I don't know that.

 

So let's assume Truscott would have left regardless.  Let's assume Collier didn't push him out the door.  He still blew it with some early recruiting misses.  About the first thing he did when he got hired was to sign a class of juco players who frankly had no business getting major D1 level offers.  I'm sure they were good people but they weren't good enough players.  Kedrick Ford and Justin Boeker logged limited minutes in their time here but at least they saw the floor.  The third juco recruit, Danai Young, redshirted one season before being dismissed from the team.  And a high school kid signed in the spring, Marques McCarty, likewise never produced.  An entire first recruiting class of whiff.

 

Collier was trying to plug holes in the roster but he made reaches on players that really set him back badly.  And I don't think he ever recovered.  Because, after signing that first class of really mediocre players, he ran smack dab into the old 8-5 rule which provided that a school couldn't sign more than 5 players in any single season and no more than 8 in any consecutive two seasons.  I don't think Barry came in here with a plan for recruiting.  I think he underestimated the kind of player it would take to compete and succeed in the Big 12.  And, by the time he figured out that he needed help with recruiting, BADLY, it was too late to really make a difference.  He had no forward momentum.  His program had stalled and it was time for a coaching change -- which he assisted us with greatly by taking a job as an AD at his former school.

 

Enter Doc Sadler.  He took over a moribund Husker program in a spot made tougher by the timing of Barry Collier's departure.  And what Doc did with his first recruiting class was nothing short of amazing.  In a limited period of time -- limited in terms of being able to establish relationships and so forth -- Doc signed probably the best recruiting class of his tenure here.  That class gave Husker fans a great deal of hope that Doc was the guy who could get us to the proverbial "next level."  But Doc also made some bad decisions.  Not faced with the 8-5 rule that hamstrong Collier before him, Doc quickly lost confidence in young players and moved them on to greener pastures without giving them an opportunity to develop.  

 

But Doc also made some reaches on some players whose inability to contribute cost him time.  And he failed to close on big men who could contribute so that, when Aleks Maric graduated, we fielded the smallest roster in the entire NCAA D1 men's basketball universe.  And, because of those prior recruiting failures -- players like Alex Chapman and Shang Ping, who, goodness only knows why, were signed to letters of intent -- and due to circumstances not entirely within Doc's control -- the NCAA Clearinghouse arbitrarily deciding not to clear Roburt Sallie and the suspension and then injury of Chris Niemann -- we had a talent void in year 4, the momentum of the program had stalled, and Doc was unable to resuscitate the program in spite of a promising first three years in which we had progressively improved.

 

In looking back on the past two coaches, I think there are some lessons to be learned, but the foremost lesson is that you have to maintain your forward momentum.  You might not have overnight success but it's important to show progress -- tangible, visible progress -- as the seasons progress.  And neither Barry Collier nor Doc Sadler were able to do that.  But that failure to maintain forward progress can be traced at least in part to missteps they each made very early on in their respective tenures.  Particularly with recruiting.

 

Part of it is luck, to be sure.  Bad luck in Doc's case.  No telling if things would have been any different had Roburt Sallie been cleared but one has to wonder.  And what if Brian Diaz had checked the box that said English was his primary language?  And I know Doc was convinced that if we'd held on against Texas A&M at home his third season, had Josh Carter missed that last-second trey from the top of the key, we'd have danced.  And that might have swung momentum strongly in his favor.  But, in a lot of ways, you make your own breaks, and Doc and Barry didn't make enough to keep their jobs.

 

Now, enter Tim Miles.  And let's get luck out of the way right off the bat and have our most prized recruit sail through the clearinghouse after fears he might not get the scores to qualify and have his grades transfer from New Zealand.  Maybe luck is just a little bit on our side this time around.  But let's also say that Tim Miles has done some things right off the bat to make his own breaks.  There's no question that his coaching staff seems to be more dynamic than either of the two prior staffs.  And, when it comes to recruiting, rather than settle for "reaches," he's shot for the stars.  I mean, c'mon, we didn't land Elbert but when was the last time we got an official visit from a top 50 kid with offers from places like Ohio State and Georgetown?

 

The lesson from the Robinson recruitment is not that we should "go ugly early rather than go home alone" as a college buddy used to describe his approach to picking up girls at the bars.  The lesson, in my opinion, is that we're closer than we've ever been to landing a player of that caliber and the next step we're going to have to take is going to have to occur on the floor this coming season.  And the fantastic thing is that Tim Miles has positioned himself and his program -- by decisions he and his staff made in bringing in quality transfers and landing capable recruits -- to take advantage of the opportunity that this coming season represents and field a more competitive team than the year before and prove on the floor that this team is moving in the right direction.  That this program is moving in the right direction.

 

So that NEXT year, the Elbert Robinsons of the world will have a little more "top of mind awareness" of the University of Nebraska basketball program.  Right now, our brand is Shopko and we want to be Von Maur.  In the minds of the Elbert Robinsons, we haven't proven ourselves to be legit.  Not quite yet.  We've remodeled the store but are we still carrying the same lower grade merchandise?  That rebranding will happen over the next several months.  Part of it comes with a new coach.  Part of it comes with fancy new facilities.  But some of it has to come with performance.  And I'm as confident now as I can remember being in quite a long time that Tim Miles has equipped his roster with enough firepower to think that we really can make a move.

 

Look out Big Ten.  Look out world.

[REDZONEDAN]

Norm, I thought you said your post was long.

[hskr4life]

Rome was not built in a day yes.... but it WAS built, and it still stands today.... so there is hope!!

[jimmykc]

Rome got finished before I reached the end of the post.

[hhcmatt]

Just reading through some of the recent threads covering recruiting topics, it seems there's some angst in Husker nation. 

 

It's better to have loved and lost than to never have been on the short list for a four star 7' dude.

[Norm Peterson]

 

Just reading through some of the recent threads covering recruiting topics, it seems there's some angst in Husker nation. 

 

It's better to have love and lost than to never have been on the short list for a four star 7' dude.

 

Amen.

[Handy Johnson]

We don't want to be that guy at bar close lookin' to bag a biggun'. We want to have a reservation with our date dressed to the 9s. Winning, yes winning cures all ills. 

[TheKamdyMan]

I agree on some but you cant compare womens sports to men imo.  If you get the right coach and a willing athletic dept you can turn things around quickly in womens sports.  Factor in that there is local talent that helped catapult Connie whereas Miles is hamstrung by a lack of talent in NE and surrounding states.

[husker32480]

Long time lurker who does not post much but need to disagree with Kamdy a little. There may not be much High D1 talent in Nebraska but some of the states around us are good.  Sunrise academy has as much talent as most D1 schools.  We need to hit it hard,(pinder would be a great start if he can make it). Also some of the aau programs within driving distance are really good.  St Louis, KC Chicago, all are close and have some quality players every year.  Do agree with the talent in Nebraska girls sports being good. 

[TheKamdyMan]

Long time lurker who does not post much but need to disagree with Kamdy a little. There may not be much High D1 talent in Nebraska but some of the states around us are good.  Sunrise academy has as much talent as most D1 schools.  We need to hit it hard,(pinder would be a great start if he can make it). Also some of the aau programs within driving distance are really good.  St Louis, KC Chicago, all are close and have some quality players every year.  Do agree with the talent in Nebraska girls sports being good. 

 

I wouldnt say 4 4 stars and 12 3 stars in Iowa, Nebraska, Kansas, Colorado, South Dakota, and Wyoming is exactly a talent wealth, especially when 7 of those kids are at Academies like Sunrise and Christian Brothers that bring out of state/country kids in that may head closer to home for college.  Yes theres some quality but theres no quantity.  With those same states you have 22 D-1 schools fighting for those kids. 

[Norm Peterson]

I agree on some but you cant compare womens sports to men imo.  If you get the right coach and a willing athletic dept you can turn things around quickly in womens sports.  Factor in that there is local talent that helped catapult Connie whereas Miles is hamstrung by a lack of talent in NE and surrounding states.

I'm not making an apples to apples comparison with the women's program.  Just using it to illustrate a point that what happens on the court matters in terms of attracting recruits.  What Connie's team did over the last 4 years (two Sweet 16s) is paying dividends on the recruiting trail today.

 

The facilities and the people matter too.  But I think recruits want to see some success from the program and not rely on promises or trust in potential.  No one wants to go play for a team that is destined to be a bottom feeder.  But, in that vein, I think Miles has us positioned very well to show progress and promise to prospective players. 

 

Our most talented and athletic players are freshmen and sophomores this year.  Barring some major catastrophe, we should see sustained improvement over the next few seasons sufficient to maybe get us some notice from kids who might not otherwise have wanted to play here.  By doing well this coming season, we should open some doors.

 

Facilities.  Relationships.  Success.  My sense is recruits are attracted by those three things (location also, but we can't change that) and, right now, we have two out of three.  And that ain't bad.  Now, onto success.

[jdostal]

Don't forget what got Hammond to commit- a clean downtown Lincoln.  Super clutch.

[Creighton Fan]

 

Long time lurker who does not post much but need to disagree with Kamdy a little. There may not be much High D1 talent in Nebraska but some of the states around us are good.  Sunrise academy has as much talent as most D1 schools.  We need to hit it hard,(pinder would be a great start if he can make it). Also some of the aau programs within driving distance are really good.  St Louis, KC Chicago, all are close and have some quality players every year.  Do agree with the talent in Nebraska girls sports being good. 

 

I wouldnt say 4 4 stars and 12 3 stars in Iowa, Nebraska, Kansas, Colorado, South Dakota, and Wyoming is exactly a talent wealth, especially when 7 of those kids are at Academies like Sunrise and Christian Brothers that bring out of state/country kids in that may head closer to home for college.  Yes theres some quality but theres no quantity.  With those same states you have 22 D-1 schools fighting for those kids. 

 

 

As a Creighton fan that has to deal with the same issues, I'm with Kamdy here. 

 

Nebraska doesn't appear to have any 2014 high level kids.  Surprisingly, even Iowa, which usually has several top tier D1 kids every year, doesn't have much this year.  Ditto with Kansas City.

 

When talking about local talent, I think most think instate talent.  Talent that is relatively close, but across state borders, isn't the same because you don't have the same sort of home-court advantage with those kids (their natural loyalties will be with their own instate programs).

 

One other thing with the academy schools - a lot of the top tier talent in those programs was placed there by certain schools, so those kids aren't generally in play.

[bball23]

This is what I kind of find ironic about all of this.....So many people seem to think the sky is falling because we couldn't quite close the deal on Robinson.  But, the way I see it, we bring every single player back next year outside of Gallegos.  It would be one thing to be in panic mode if we were having 3-4 players leave and didn't have a backup plan in place. 

 

The thing at the scrimmage that really stuck out to me is the fact that we really didn't have that "one" guy stick out like we normally do.  And I mean this in a good way.  The fact that Shavon Shields (and I LOVE Shields) didn't absolutely jump out at me says a lot for the talent/athleticism we have coming in this year. 

 

The other thing that I think is going to help us long run (assuming we can start to win games) is the fact that Miles plays a MUCH more fun style of basketball than Collier/Sadler did.  He allows his guys some freedom on offense.  Its also why I am by no means too worried if we don't have that "legit big man"  I have said this before on the board and I will say this again.  It is SO much easier to defend a dominant post player than it is to defend a dominant guard/wing.  Even when we were tiny under Sadler we found ways to stop NBA talent (Griffin/Beasley come to mind) as we doubled the post and then scrambled out of it.  Well, if that stud is a guard/wing type player and they spread the floor on you it makes it a HELL of a lot harder to get the ball out of their hands.

 

Its why I absolutely love the type of player Miles is getting.  He's getting a bunch of 6'5-6'8 guard/wing type players that for the most part can all shoot/dribble.  With the dribble drive offense he is putting in place, this can make for an absolutely nightmare for opposing defenses when all 5 guys can put the ball on the floor.  The thing at the scrimmage that really stuck out was that no matter who got the rebound in the game, they pretty much took off.  No need for an outlet pass if every single guy that gets the board can take it and go.

 

I just remember when guys like Kyle Marks, Holley, etc...stuck out so much because they had some athleticism.  Not great players by any means, but exciting type players.  Well, we now have guys that can get up and down the floor, throw it down, handle the ball, make passes, etc....then on defense we are going to be extremely long.  So say a dominant post player gets the ball inside..instead of us doubling down with Cookie Miller or Benny Parker, we are playing down a 6'7 Petteway, 6'6 Shields, 6'5 Hawkins, 6'7 Fuller, etc.....makes it a heck of a lot tougher to pass out of the double team when you have two 6'6-6'8 guys smothering you.  Then we have the athleticism to rotate on defense and cover a lot of ground. 

[Norm Peterson]

We lose two guards in the next two seasons, including the guy that seems to be our primary shooting option from outside.  I would think it would be prudent, now that we have at least one big committed, to maybe look for a shooter to finish this '14 class.  Elbert would have been nice but that's because he'd have been a dominant big and would likely have started in the post right off the bat.  He'd have been the "best player available, regardless of position" kind of guy, Elbert would.  But, failing Elbert, I'd like to see us find a dynamic scorer somewhere.  Even the juco ranks.

[Husker4Life]

Long time lurker who does not post much but need to disagree with Kamdy a little. There may not be much High D1 talent in Nebraska but some of the states around us are good.  Sunrise academy has as much talent as most D1 schools.  We need to hit it hard,(pinder would be a great start if he can make it). Also some of the aau programs within driving distance are really good.  St Louis, KC Chicago, all are close and have some quality players every year.  Do agree with the talent in Nebraska girls sports being good. 

I agree 100%.  Sunrise Christian Academy is loaded with talent.

[cipsucks]

We don't want to be that guy at bar close lookin' to bag a biggun'.

 

You can drink ugly into pretty, but you can't drink fat into skinny..........

[TheKamdyMan]

 

We don't want to be that guy at bar close lookin' to bag a biggun'.

 

You can drink ugly into pretty, but you can't drink fat into skinny..........

 

 

[Photo of a large naked man hugged by a woman]

 

pretty sure the fat guy got into this skinny girl when drinking (zing)

Edited October 10, 2013 by hhcdimes
BARF

[trickey]

Kamdy...For the love of all things sacred...

NEVER do that again!

[tcp]

my eyes! what have you done to my eyes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!??????????

 

I can't unsee that, Kamdy.

[Huskerpapa]

Not the photo I want to see first thing in the morning...How the heck did you get that photo of Norm???

[bball23]

Not to bring CU onto the board....but they have an article in the OWH stating pretty much kind of my thought process posted above.  By going smaller, it can make for a tough match up for teams when they are on offense.

 

http://www.omaha.com/article/20131008/BLUEJAYS/131008727/1001#bluejays-see-big-potential-in-smaller-lineup

[TheKamdyMan]

Not to bring CU onto the board....but they have an article in the OWH stating pretty much kind of my thought process posted above.  By going smaller, it can make for a tough match up for teams when they are on offense.

 

http://www.omaha.com/article/20131008/BLUEJAYS/131008727/1001#bluejays-see-big-potential-in-smaller-lineup

 

Of course on defense the exact opposite could be said.  Remember Nebraska had the smallest team in America under Doc and that team lost several close games because they got beat inside.

[Handy Johnson]

 

We don't want to be that guy at bar close lookin' to bag a biggun'.

 

You can drink ugly into pretty, but you can't drink fat into skinny..........

 

Never forget, whiskey doesn't lead to the hard stuff, it IS the hard stuff...  

[uneblinstu]

Not to bring CU onto the board....but they have an article in the OWH stating pretty much kind of my thought process posted above.  By going smaller, it can make for a tough match up for teams when they are on offense.

 

http://www.omaha.com/article/20131008/BLUEJAYS/131008727/1001#bluejays-see-big-potential-in-smaller-lineup

Until you run into teams with skilled big men, which the Jays will.  You can be undersized, but you can't be grossly undersized.  not sure where Creighton would fit into that mix.