Nebraska is defrosted

[Norm Peterson]

It's official.

[HuskerFever]

If we're thawed out, does that mean it's time to do some cooking and get these programs back on track?

[Huskerpapa]

I have mixed emotions, but not typical mixed emotions:

*  I feel bad for Husker fans including me.  I thought this was a great hire.  I thought he made a critical error when he brought his UCF staff with him.  They simply weren't prepared for football at this level.  And then arrogance got in the way of adjusting or adapting.

* I feel bad (money not withstanding) for Frost.  His legacy went from favored son, to a woefully disappointing coach.  Is he the worse HC in our history?

* The program is in the toilet.   But we do have talent.  I think...

*  The speculation will run rampant; however, I am very concerned whether we can get a difference maker here as a coach.  This will make for a wild ride.  I will say this, there are a lot of high dollar donors out there with leveraged opinions.  Yes indeed.  

[cornfed24-7]

So if the basketball season trends like the football season does Trev make the move and fire Hoiberg posthaste or make us suffer til the end of the season? My guess...the latter.

[HuskerFever]

1 minute ago, cornfed24-7 said:

So if the basketball season trends like the football season does Trev make the move and fire Hoiberg posthaste or make us suffer til the end of the season? My guess...the latter.

 

Frost is a year ahead of Hoiberg. We're also in transition mode for a higher revenue sport. So Hoiberg likely has another year regardless of the results on the court.

[Chuck Taylor]

1 minute ago, HuskerFever said:

 

Frost is a year ahead of Hoiberg. We're also in transition mode for a higher revenue sport. So Hoiberg likely has another year regardless of the results on the court.

Trev to hoops fans: "You're used to suffering, so live with it another year."

[Dead Dog Alley]

4 minutes ago, Huskerpapa said:

 

* I feel bad (money not withstanding) for Frost.  His legacy went from favored son, to a woefully disappointing coach.  Is he the worse HC in our history?

 

 

There are many similarities to Bernie Masterson, from 75 years earlier.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernie_Masterson

 

 

 

 

[Cazzie22]

7 hours ago, Huskerpapa said:

I have mixed emotions, but not typical mixed emotions:

*  I feel bad for Husker fans including me.  I thought this was a great hire.  I thought he made a critical error when he brought his UCF staff with him.  They simply weren't prepared for football at this level.  And then arrogance got in the way of adjusting or adapting.

* I feel bad (money not withstanding) for Frost.  His legacy went from favored son, to a woefully disappointing coach.  Is he the worse HC in our history?

* The program is in the toilet.   But we do have talent.  I think...

*  The speculation will run rampant; however, I am very concerned whether we can get a difference maker here as a coach.  This will make for a wild ride.  I will say this, there are a lot of high dollar donors out there with leveraged opinions.  Yes indeed.  

It is a concern that our most effective players are transfers.

[NUdiehard]

 

After last year's abysmal 3-9 record, Trev was lauded for renegotiating Frost's contract and conditioning Frost's return upon an agreed upon 50% reduction in his buyout.  Seemingly everybody said this was the best, if not only, recourse under the circumstances.  For some reason, they made the "effective" date of October 1, 2022.  I am not sure if that specific "effective" date was published at the time or whether everyone just overlooked it as irrelevant.  And it should be irrelevant as it is just 6 games into the season.

 

I have no idea if a booster agreed to pay the additional $7.5M to fire frost early.  Whether that is or is not the case, it still begs the question of whether that $7.5M could be put to better use, by both the AD and the booster, especially in today's college athletics environment.  Does anyone really believe firing Frost now is going to dramatically change the course of this season?  If not, what is the advantage gained by firing now that is greater than the alternate use case for that $7.5M?

 

We are now in the age of NIL.  Whether people (or this AD) like it or not, it is the current reality and its only going to become more and more prominent as time goes on.  If this program wants to give itself the best chance to win, it must embrace the NIL aspect and figure out how to maximize its impact on both recruiting and maintaining its athletes.

 

If a booster donated that $7.5M just to get rid of Frost 3 weeks earlier, as AD, Trev should have implored him to wait out the 3 weeks, and then donate the $7.5M to a local NIL collective.  Simple math says that if NU FB has a 25 person recruiting class next season, that $7.5M could pay $300,000 to EACH and EVERY recruit next year.  Or it could be distributed in other ways, with as much as $1M going to the best QB or other recruit.  Or it could be spread out over the next 2-4 years for the next coach to distribute.  The very small and marginal value of firing frost 3 weeks early (if there is any at all) is far outweighed by the other NIL use cases of that money.  Rich people can do whatever they want with their money.  But I sure hope the AD is at least strongly encouraging boosters to use those funds in a more productive manner, that is a big part of the job.  And if the funds came solely out of the AD budget, then what is the rationale?  For every AD dollar spent on the buyout, that is one more dollar of booster money that must replace those funds.  It is not a zero sum game.  For instance, if a booster later donates $7M, those $7M may have to go towards the cost of the new practice facility, but if the AD had simply waited 3 weeks and saved that $7M, then the AD could have paid for the $7M for the athletic facility and then the booster money could be used for NIL or some other purpose. 

[Norm Peterson]

Reasons to wait 3 weeks: $7.5 million in additional buyout money that we someone will have to pony up.

 

Reasons not to wait 3 weeks: What if he beats OU? Improbable, but what if? What if he wins the next three? Do you still fire him at the beginning of October? Or do you have to wait at that point for the remainder of the season and field all the "what does Frost need to do at this point to keep his job" questions? And, while you've made up your mind and don't think there's any real chance he'll go on a winning streak, you'll still have to deal with those questions and you'll still have to give the ol' "We'll make an announcement at the end of the season" line.

 

What if he loses to OU but wins the two games after that? Do you still fire him come October 1?

 

What if he loses all three between now and then, and you proceed to fire him on October 1? If you do that, then everyone will wonder why you didn't just fire him after he lost at home to Georgia. Sorry, Georgia *Southern.*

 

Have you done institutional damage to the program by allowing a floundering coach to continue to swing in the breeze? He won't be an effective recruiter with the cloud of termination hanging over him. Is the damage done to our institutional reputation by letting him hang on a few more games a bigger cost than paying the bigger buyout and getting rid of him now?

 

One thing I was told in the midst of all the Hoiberg termination discussion at the end of last season: Money isn't an issue for Trev. He'll do what needs to be done. If we keep a guy, it'll be because he thinks it's the right call rather than because we can't scrape together enough cash to put that coach out of our collective misery. We have the money. Money is not an obstacle.

 

Sometimes fans get fixated on the amount of what they see as undeserved cash a losing coach is going to walk away with after getting fired for not winning enough. We'll just have to get over it.  It still baffles me that people were pissed that Doc Sadler was going to get a relatively tiny buyout when he was fired.

 

Coaches cost big money. When you decide to make a change, you're just going to have to pony up. It's just a part of doing business. It ain't affecting your pocket book so don't worry about it.

[HuskerFever]

Trev's line of (not verbatim) "We owe it to our players; to our seniors" to release the head coach and still have 75% of a season left to play was an odd logic to me.

 

Wouldn't "we owe it to our seniors" fall under "finish the season with the coach who recruited you"?

 

Not saying the firing was/wasn't necessary. Just strange use of words or logic that I picked up on in his press conference.

[busticket]

9 minutes ago, HuskerFever said:

Trev's line of (not verbatim) "We owe it to our players; to our seniors" to release the head coach and still have 75% of a season left to play was an odd logic to me.

 

Wouldn't "we owe it to our seniors" fall under "finish the season with the coach who recruited you"?

 

Not saying the firing was/wasn't necessary. Just strange use of words or logic that I picked up on in his press conference.

I think it makes total sense.  If the coach is failing the players, this gives them a chance to change the course of their season.  Especially for the seniors.  We have only played one conference game so far.  Maybe this change ignites the team and they manage to make a minor bowl game.  Something nobody on the roster has done.  
 

It also gives the fans something to get excited about.  It shows that the university cares about the fans and that the product the fans invest their hearts, time and wallets is not acceptable.  I hope Mickey can light a fire in the locker room…especially on the defensive side of the ball.

[Handy Johnson]

It’s worth remembering the 1997 National Title team was SO dominant not only did it lead the Nation in Total Offense & Scoring it did so while Frost threw a grand total of 5 Touchdown passes. 

[cipsucks]

23 minutes ago, Handy Johnson said:

It’s worth remembering the 1997 National Title team was SO dominant not only did it lead the Nation in Total Offense & Scoring it did so while Frost threw a grand total of 5 Touchdown passes. 

 

I remember one of them....

[Dead Dog Alley]

3 hours ago, cipsucks said:

 

I remember one of them....

I didn’t know who actually caught it until the radio replay at 2:30 am driving back from the game, from the opposite end zone all you could see was the Tiger mascot running through the sprinklers.

[Norm Peterson]

5 hours ago, cipsucks said:

 

I remember one of them....

 

Drawing a blank. Did it get much attention at the time?

[huskerbill85]

It was the right decision but still sad. Frost will always be one of us and a legend at Nebraska. It didn't work out unfortunately but anyone who wants to bring it up in the future can shove it.

[kleitus]

On 9/12/2022 at 11:04 PM, Norm Peterson said:

 

Drawing a blank. Did it get much attention at the time?

 

Eh... it may have been kicked around the water cooler a time or two.

[AuroranHusker]

Nice catch, Matt.

 

 

[brfrad]

On 9/12/2022 at 4:34 PM, busticket said:

I think it makes total sense.  If the coach is failing the players, this gives them a chance to change the course of their season.  Especially for the seniors.  We have only played one conference game so far.  Maybe this change ignites the team and they manage to make a minor bowl game.  Something nobody on the roster has done.  
 

It also gives the fans something to get excited about.  It shows that the university cares about the fans and that the product the fans invest their hearts, time and wallets is not acceptable.  I hope Mickey can light a fire in the locker room…especially on the defensive side of the ball.

While the defense isn't going to turn into the 2009 Nebraska team.  I feel they can improve enough to be serviceable this year.  I am not super knowledgeable in defense matters.  However, on at least 2 long runs.  I saw a LB run into the back of a DL, not very good alignment.  Fix that, and focus on tackling in practice, that will improve the defense. 

[throwback]

2 hours ago, brfrad said:

While the defense isn't going to turn into the 2009 Nebraska team.  I feel they can improve enough to be serviceable this year.  I am not super knowledgeable in defense matters.  However, on at least 2 long runs.  I saw a LB run into the back of a DL, not very good alignment.  Fix that, and focus on tackling in practice, that will improve the defense. 

I hope you're right, but I, unfortunately, don't think most of the problems with the front 6/7 are fixable. The defensive tackles simply aren't good. I think the LBs are panicking because they constantly have offensive linemen coming at them because the DTs are getting handled one on one. Plus the interior DL is getting pushed backwards 2-3 yards regularly, right into the LBs laps, which makes it nearly impossible for them to get clean looks at the running backs. 

 

Offensive linemen don't have to double anyone up front, and they rarely have to even chip before going to the 2nd level. So, to me, the LBs look like they're panicking by trying to get to the hole before an offensive lineman can block them. They're choosing the wrong hole a lot.

 

Maybe we can pinch our DEs in tighter when we're running 4-3, rather than having them line up so wide, and make them more part of stopping the interior run game. We're then in trouble on the edges, so you might have to cheat up a safety. Chins loves that 2-high look, though. Maybe play bigger with more 3-4, and get the nickel out of there, although we tried quite some of that vs N Dakota, and it wasn't all that effective vs the 4-3 at stopping the run. We just don't have enough DT bodies to run 3-4 the entire game, unless you're going to play Nelson as a very undersized one of the 3.

 

Maybe we need to slant our d line more or run more stunts - something to give them the ability to escape straight-on blocks, because they cannot disengage on their own. We tried a couple of slants vs Ga Southern, and it was just as ugly as the base run defense, but maybe they can clean it up by working on it more.

 

The sad part is we really haven't played a team that wants to run the ball over and over, other than maybe NW once it got the lead. Those teams are still coming. Could be a loooooooong November.

 

On the Ga Southern rewatch, we tried a lot of stuff Saturday with games up front to try to help the DL, but nothing worked. We got burned bad against N Dakota by trying to bring a safety up in run support, so I think Chins was leery of doing that vs Ga Southern, but they may have to go back to it. Maybe they have to let the LBs just focus on the run game and use the safeties more to cover slot receivers. Something, anything, to get some no-gains or TFLs vs the basic run game between the tackles on 1st and 2nd down. 

 

It just looks pretty hopeless up front to me right now, though.

 

[49r]

Years and years of completely ignoring recruiting OL and DL players has certainly paid its dividends.  Why our coaches think that skill positions are the only ones worth recruiting talent to has been just baffling to me.

Edited September 15, 2022 by 49r

[HuskerFever]

On 9/12/2022 at 5:34 PM, busticket said:

On 9/12/2022 at 5:18 PM, HuskerFever said:

Trev's line of (not verbatim) "We owe it to our players; to our seniors" to release the head coach and still have 75% of a season left to play was an odd logic to me.

 

Wouldn't "we owe it to our seniors" fall under "finish the season with the coach who recruited you"?

 

Not saying the firing was/wasn't necessary. Just strange use of words or logic that I picked up on in his press conference.

Expand  

I think it makes total sense.  If the coach is failing the players, this gives them a chance to change the course of their season.  Especially for the seniors.  We have only played one conference game so far.  Maybe this change ignites the team and they manage to make a minor bowl game.  Something nobody on the roster has done.  
 

It also gives the fans something to get excited about.  It shows that the university cares about the fans and that the product the fans invest their hearts, time and wallets is not acceptable.  I hope Mickey can light a fire in the locker room…especially on the defensive side of the ball.

 

Since this post I've seen some positions that can support both sides of the argument.

 

Here's one where a coach within the Big Ten has called Nebraska out for their decision to cut the coach loose and the perceived impact that has on the players:

 

https://247sports.com/college/iowa/Article/Nebraska-coaching-search-Wisconsin-DC-Jim-Leonhard-calls-early-season-firings-worst-situation-for-players-193380116/

[huskerbill85]

I can't find this interview from today people were talking about but supposedly Stai said no Meyer & was saying some really shitty things about Benhardt. If this is true & that guy is the assistant AD we have more than just a coaching problem. 

[basketballjones]

11 hours ago, huskerbill85 said:

I can't find this interview from today people were talking about but supposedly Stai said no Meyer & was saying some really shitty things about Benhardt. If this is true & that guy is the assistant AD we have more than just a coaching problem. 

Any program that has employees making negative public comments about individual players has some deep issues. I agree