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9 hours ago, Swan88 said:

So . . . we now know what happens day-to-day in practice, based on one player’s brief attempt to explain how this year’s team is better, at this early stage, than last year’s team?!

Such a thing is Exhibit A for how false rumors start and then expand to something unhinged from reality.

I mean you're right. Things looked very cohesive last year. That looked liked a well oiled machine. Practices must have run perfectly. No possible way there were culture problems. The coaching turnover was probably related to better opportunities at other Universities. The restructured contract was out of the goodness of Hoibergs heart to do right by the University. Yup. All is well on the Husker basketball front 😀

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On 7/28/2022 at 4:31 PM, Coaches kid said:

This is disturbing. The coaches who are successful (Izzo, Self, Jay Wright, etc.) are able to impose their will on their players. They demand that things be done the right way. Some of them may allow for a player to blow off some steam in the heat of the moment, but in the end, the player does what he's instructed to do or there are consequences. On teams where there is a healthy culture, leaders on the team enforce the instructions given by the coaching staff. Hoping the current crew of players can change the culture. My brother was talking with a Michigan basketball booster. The booster said that when John Beilein was coaching, he would often stop practice for even small errors, like making a pass to the wrong shoulder, or failing to set a pick correctly. That's the type of attention to detail which makes a team successful.  

 

Regarding Beilein, the UM booster's reasoning for his collegiate success are what most quote as the reason he failed so swiftly in the NBA.  Immediately started nitpicking fundamentals and demanding longer practice/film time to correct it.  In that case, Beilein was the (NBA) culture killer:

 

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/john-beilein-out-as-cavaliers-head-coach-a-timeline-of-what-went-wrong-in-cleveland-for-former-michigan-coach/

 

Coach Hoiberg definitely seems like he will always be more of a "player's coach" than a taskmaster.  And I don't think we'll ever get any Self/Izzo/McCaffery-level outbursts from him...honestly don't want any out of him given his heart health.  Hopefully more continuity and stronger leadership from upperclassmen will allow the team to hold itself accountable to some degree.

 

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8 minutes ago, MitchMcGaryMunchies said:

 

Regarding Beilein, the UM booster's reasoning for his collegiate success are what most quote as the reason he failed so swiftly in the NBA.  Immediately started nitpicking fundamentals and demanding longer practice/film time to correct it.  In that case, Beilein was the (NBA) culture killer:

 

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/john-beilein-out-as-cavaliers-head-coach-a-timeline-of-what-went-wrong-in-cleveland-for-former-michigan-coach/

 

Coach Hoiberg definitely seems like he will always be more of a "player's coach" than a taskmaster.  And I don't think we'll ever get any Self/Izzo/McCaffery-level outbursts from him...honestly don't want any out of him given his heart health.  Hopefully more continuity and stronger leadership from upperclassmen will allow the team to hold itself accountable to some degree.

 

And the subtraction of Matt A. should help in the accountability department  as well.  

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23 hours ago, Swan88 said:

So . . . we now know what happens day-to-day in practice, based on one player’s brief attempt to explain how this year’s team is better, at this early stage, than last year’s team?!

Such a thing is Exhibit A for how false rumors start and then expand to something unhinged from reality.

 

Combine CJ's recent quote with Webster's mid-season radio interview, and I think you've got a pretty clear picture.  No unhinging of reality needed.

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5 hours ago, 49r said:

It's surprising to me that these culture issues are only now becoming apparent to folks.


Anyone who did not see it rearing its ugly head circa Cam Mack wasn’t paying attention, or perhaps did not want to see it. I was hoping it was something that would get corrected quickly but here we are.

 

I really feel (perhaps I am just drinking the kool aid) that this group of kids will get it turned around.  I believe SG will be very important in this regard.

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1 hour ago, busticket said:


Anyone who did not see it rearing its ugly head circa Cam Mack wasn’t paying attention, or perhaps did not want to see it. I was hoping it was something that would get corrected quickly but here we are.

 

I really feel (perhaps I am just drinking the kool aid) that this group of kids will get it turned around.  I believe SG will be very important in this regard.

 

Man, I hope you're right...but culture is a really tough thing to change for better OR for worse.  I'm not going to put that kind of expectation on Sam's shoulders, it would be totally unfair to him.

 

I just hope he has a memorable senior season and can manage to get himself to the next level.  To me that would be a success.

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Not to put words in anyone's mouth, but I think the point being made was about making judgments based on some player's comments. I don't think he was saying that we didn't have culture issues.

 

I think everybody has seen the selfish play, lack of rebounding, lazy defense etc. since Fred's first team took the court.  

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14 hours ago, 49r said:

 

Man, I hope you're right...but culture is a really tough thing to change for better OR for worse.  I'm not going to put that kind of expectation on Sam's shoulders, it would be totally unfair to him.

 

I just hope he has a memorable senior season and can manage to get himself to the next level.  To me that would be a success.

 

I don't think it all has to come from Griesel though as our likely starting PG he's going to be pivotal to the success of our offense.

Feels like Griesel and Bandoumel bring some much needed leadership qualities, Gary brings some GATA, and Breidenbach and Keita bring some grind.  This seems like it could be the first of Fred's team to play better than the sum of their parts though I'm not sure that we have a ton of guys that could start for other B1G teams.

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34 minutes ago, hhcmatt said:

 

I don't think it all has to come from Griesel though as our likely starting PG he's going to be pivotal to the success of our offense.

Feels like Griesel and Bandoumel bring some much needed leadership qualities, Gary brings some GATA, and Breidenbach and Keita bring some grind.  This seems like it could be the first of Fred's team to play better than the sum of their parts though I'm not sure that we have a ton of guys that could start for other B1G teams.

 

It is going to be interesting to see how fans (including many on this board) react if this team plays hard, with grit, effort and cohesion, and yet still loses a lot of games because they simply do not have enough (scoring?) talent.  I am curious to see if all those who repeatedly say all they want is a team to play hard and together regardless of the record really mean it.

 

One other thought.  If a team lacks talent, sometimes things may appear like "selfish" play even if it is not.  For instance, if the team lacks scoring talent, at some point someone has to be the one to take the shot.  It may not be a great shot or open shot because nobody has the talent to break down the defense and either get an open shot or force a double and kick to the open man, and so-forth, which results in a player having to simply "take the shot" that no one else can/will take.  It may look like a bad shot and therefore a "selfish" shot, but what is the alternative, no one take a shot? 

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20 hours ago, busticket said:


Anyone who did not see it rearing its ugly head circa Cam Mack wasn’t paying attention, or perhaps did not want to see it. I was hoping it was something that would get corrected quickly but here we are.

 

I really feel (perhaps I am just drinking the kool aid) that this group of kids will get it turned around.  I believe SG will be very important in this regard.

 

Cam Mack was a singularly poisonous figure in Husker basketball history. He was bad in all kinds of ways -- terrible influence on his teammates, etc. -- but what made it absolutely untenable was that he was untouchable. He had a protector on the staff who insulated him from ever facing accountability. And it caused a rift on the staff that was irreparable. And now, NONE of the assistant coaches at the time are still assistant coaches today.

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3 hours ago, NUdiehard said:

 

It is going to be interesting to see how fans (including many on this board) react if this team plays hard, with grit, effort and cohesion, and yet still loses a lot of games because they simply do not have enough (scoring?) talent.  I am curious to see if all those who repeatedly say all they want is a team to play hard and together regardless of the record really mean it.

 

One other thought.  If a team lacks talent, sometimes things may appear like "selfish" play even if it is not.  For instance, if the team lacks scoring talent, at some point someone has to be the one to take the shot.  It may not be a great shot or open shot because nobody has the talent to break down the defense and either get an open shot or force a double and kick to the open man, and so-forth, which results in a player having to simply "take the shot" that no one else can/will take.  It may look like a bad shot and therefore a "selfish" shot, but what is the alternative, no one take a shot? 

Fair point.  Unfortunately I (we) have endured our share of losing and mediocrity.   Let me begin by stating IT IS TIME TO WIN AND SUSTAIN A WINNING PROGRAM.  NOT JUST A WINNING TEAM, A WINNING PROGRAM.

What pissed me off the last two years was the total lack of discipline and effort.  I get, and generally accept a loss when effort was extended; but what was witnessed the last two years is totally unacceptable.  

So, to sort of answer your question, I will not like losing, but as long as we are making positive progress, which includes discipline and effort, I will be happier.

Two other points...(1) I don't agree with the belief that our offense will be inept.  Good defense will result in some offense.   Also, we should be more efficient, which will help.  And to add to the point, we are a major college team, we will not be totally bereft of shooting talent.  I am hoping to be surprised that we can score.  (2) Call me out, but I believe we will tell if we have improved our discipline and effort by simply watching pregame warm ups.  Those of you who have watched our pregame routines the last two years may pick up on what I am putting down.

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6 hours ago, NUdiehard said:

 

It is going to be interesting to see how fans (including many on this board) react if this team plays hard, with grit, effort and cohesion, and yet still loses a lot of games because they simply do not have enough (scoring?) talent.  I am curious to see if all those who repeatedly say all they want is a team to play hard and together regardless of the record really mean it.

 

One other thought.  If a team lacks talent, sometimes things may appear like "selfish" play even if it is not.  For instance, if the team lacks scoring talent, at some point someone has to be the one to take the shot.  It may not be a great shot or open shot because nobody has the talent to break down the defense and either get an open shot or force a double and kick to the open man, and so-forth, which results in a player having to simply "take the shot" that no one else can/will take.  It may look like a bad shot and therefore a "selfish" shot, but what is the alternative, no one take a shot? 


I guess I don’t see this as a real possibility.  It’s more of a hypothetical argument that will never happen.  For a real life Husker hoops example of this, look back 10 years or so to Tim Miles’ first team.  That team was bottom 12 in the country in scoring.  It was excruciating to watch that team play offense.  The shooting percentages were abysmal as well.  Look up the stats on that team…they were atrocious.

 

One thing about Miles’ teams was GATA.  As horrible as their offense was, and the talent wasn’t all that great either, he was able to milk 15 wins out of that bunch.  Over doubled Fred’s win total in his first two years!  Effort and good coaching count for a lot.

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1 hour ago, busticket said:


I guess I don’t see this as a real possibility.  It’s more of a hypothetical argument that will never happen.  For a real life Husker hoops example of this, look back 10 years or so to Tim Miles’ first team.  That team was bottom 12 in the country in scoring.  It was excruciating to watch that team play offense.  The shooting percentages were abysmal as well.  Look up the stats on that team…they were atrocious.

 

One thing about Miles’ teams was GATA.  As horrible as their offense was, and the talent wasn’t all that great either, he was able to milk 15 wins out of that bunch.  Over doubled Fred’s win total in his first two years!  Effort and good coaching count for a lot.

 

You might be right.  But context does matter.  Comparing records from past years is precarious at best.  For instance, the B1G how has 20 conference games.  During Miles years it was 18, which meant 2 extra cupcakes on the schedule each year.  During Doc's tenure, it was only 16 conference games, and Doc certainly knew how to load up on cupcakes. 

 

In Mile's first year, 9 of his 15 wins were non-conference (and he also lost by 16 to UTEP).  His conference record was 5-13, and 3 of those 5 wins were against hapless Penn St and NW. 

 

The upcoming 2022-23 schedule is brutal.  20 conference games.  Of the 11 non-conference games, 7 are against power 5 teams and only 1 of the 7 are home games.  I would challenge anyone to find a more difficult non-conference schedule in the history of Husker Hoops, and then tack on the 20 conference games in the deepest conference in the nation.   I'm not sure why Hoiberg basically dug his own grave with this non-conference schedule, but no doubt at the end of the season everybody will be comparing his end of year record to those of Doc and Collier when they aren't even remotely similar in difficulty.  

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41 minutes ago, NUdiehard said:

 

You might be right.  But context does matter.  Comparing records from past years is precarious at best.  For instance, the B1G how has 20 conference games.  During Miles years it was 18, which meant 2 extra cupcakes on the schedule each year.  During Doc's tenure, it was only 16 conference games, and Doc certainly knew how to load up on cupcakes. 

 

In Mile's first year, 9 of his 15 wins were non-conference (and he also lost by 16 to UTEP).  His conference record was 5-13, and 3 of those 5 wins were against hapless Penn St and NW. 

 

The upcoming 2022-23 schedule is brutal.  20 conference games.  Of the 11 non-conference games, 7 are against power 5 teams and only 1 of the 7 are home games.  I would challenge anyone to find a more difficult non-conference schedule in the history of Husker Hoops, and then tack on the 20 conference games in the deepest conference in the nation.   I'm not sure why Hoiberg basically dug his own grave with this non-conference schedule, but no doubt at the end of the season everybody will be comparing his end of year record to those of Doc and Collier when they aren't even remotely similar in difficulty.  


All fair points my friend.  And I agree with you…of all years this is the year I would have loaded up on cupcakes out of conference.  The extra conference games hurt your margin for error, especially in a tough B1G.

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3 hours ago, NUdiehard said:

 

You might be right.  But context does matter.  Comparing records from past years is precarious at best.  For instance, the B1G how has 20 conference games.  During Miles years it was 18, which meant 2 extra cupcakes on the schedule each year.  During Doc's tenure, it was only 16 conference games, and Doc certainly knew how to load up on cupcakes. 

 

In Mile's first year, 9 of his 15 wins were non-conference (and he also lost by 16 to UTEP).  His conference record was 5-13, and 3 of those 5 wins were against hapless Penn St and NW. 

 

The upcoming 2022-23 schedule is brutal.  20 conference games.  Of the 11 non-conference games, 7 are against power 5 teams and only 1 of the 7 are home games.  I would challenge anyone to find a more difficult non-conference schedule in the history of Husker Hoops, and then tack on the 20 conference games in the deepest conference in the nation.   I'm not sure why Hoiberg basically dug his own grave with this non-conference schedule, but no doubt at the end of the season everybody will be comparing his end of year record to those of Doc and Collier when they aren't even remotely similar in difficulty.  

He didn’t dig his own grave with non-conference scheduling.  He dug it with poor performance in every aspect of  coaching for 3 years —recruiting, coaching,  staff hiring, and culture.  And completely whiffing on the best in-state talent in decades.   

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