Shut Up Sipple! - Why Fred Should have at least 5 years

[hhcmatt]

8 hours ago, jimmychitwood said:

First, to address the original topic, I’m tired of Sipple going in the radio and saying “wins matter” with regards to Fred when he spent football season on his knees for a coach that won 3 games (1 power 5 team in there).

 

 I’m fine with Fred getting next year. He’s going to finally have a legitimate amount of bigs to complete instead of managing time between Walker and Andre. He should also have ball handlers on the team. If things don’t improve next year, it’s time for him to go but with the incoming core, another year is needed.

 

We were in every game we played in football.  As someone who disagree how he portrayed the start of both seasons I find myself agreeing with a lot of what he might have to say as the season progresses. 

 

Is Fred willing to make big changes? Is Fred willing to change his contract to bet on himself?

 

 

[49r]

1 hour ago, aphilso1 said:

 

Not really.  We have two guys that aren't able to immediately use remaining eligibility at another D1 school, and neither seem like D1 transfer candidates.  

 

The guys that used the new one-time transfer exception are CJ and Keon.  CJ is one of the few guys that seems like a lock to return regardless, as he actually is settling into his role and playing much better as the year progresses.  Keon has been buried on two bad P6 rosters, so he has to be wondering if he can hack it at this level of competition.  I wouldn't be surprised to see him transfer out of D1 altogether.

 

 

Okay let's go down the roster from most usage to least (according to KenPom)

 

Verge - this is his last year won't be back no matter what

Bryce - this is his last year won't be back no matter what

Derrick - already used his transfer, can come back, Robin says it's possible

Kobe - senior, won't be back, used his transfer already anyway

Keisei - could technically transfer, I don't see it personally

Eduardo - could transfer, one of the big ones we would really like to see stick around

Trey - already used his transfer, can come back, Robin says it's possible

Wilhelm - could transfer, one of the big ones we would really like to see stick around

CJ - already used his transfer

Lat - could technically transfer, I don't see it personally unless he is asked to not come back

Keon - already used his transfer

Trevor - this is his last year won't be back no matter what

 

So, of the players with remaining eligibility after this year that we would like to see come back, the ones with a free transfer left are Eduardo and Wilhelm.  I honestly don't see the same kind of roster turnover this year that we've seen after year 1 or 2.

[hhcmatt]

It's wild to see roster continuity brought up as a reason to keep Fred as we've been recruiting the entire year like we're going to flip it. 

[49r]

2 minutes ago, hhcmatt said:

It's wild to see roster continuity brought up as a reason to keep Fred as we've been recruiting the entire year like we're going to flip it. 

 

Mind you I am not arguing for or against keeping Fred.  I am like Switzerland in this portion of the discussion and intend to remain that way.  I am only trying to bring facts to the discussion.

[HuskerFever]

23 minutes ago, hhcmatt said:

Is Fred willing to make big changes? Is Fred willing to change his contract to bet on himself?

 

Big changes? Is he even willing to make in-game changes? That's been the most upsetting point in all of this for me so far.

[aphilso1]

33 minutes ago, 49r said:

 

Okay let's go down the roster from most usage to least (according to KenPom)

 

Verge - this is his last year won't be back no matter what

Bryce - this is his last year won't be back no matter what

Derrick - already used his transfer, can come back, Robin says it's possible

Kobe - senior, won't be back, used his transfer already anyway

Keisei - could technically transfer, I don't see it personally

Eduardo - could transfer, one of the big ones we would really like to see stick around

Trey - already used his transfer, can come back, Robin says it's possible

Wilhelm - could transfer, one of the big ones we would really like to see stick around

CJ - already used his transfer

Lat - could technically transfer, I don't see it personally unless he is asked to not come back

Keon - already used his transfer

Trevor - this is his last year won't be back no matter what

 

So, of the players with remaining eligibility after this year that we would like to see come back, the ones with a free transfer left are Eduardo and Wilhelm.  I honestly don't see the same kind of roster turnover this year that we've seen after year 1 or 2.

 

The immediate eligibilty, one-time transfer rule was implemented in the 2021 offseason.  Guys that transferred here prior to that (like Trey and Walker) have not used their ability to transfer elsewhere and become immediately eligible. 

Edited February 18, 2022 by aphilso1

[aphilso1]

4 minutes ago, aphilso1 said:

 

The immediate eligibilty, one-time transfer rule was implemented in the 2021 offseason.  Guys that transferred here prior to that (like Trey and Walker) have not used their ability to transfer elsewhere and become immediately eligible. 

 

Scratch that.  I will admit when I'm wrong, and now is one of those times.  I just checked the NCAA's page on the one time transfer rule, and it ONLY applies to a first-time transfer.  So guys like Walker, who already transferred once and had to sit out a year redshirting, actually would never get the benefit of immediate eligibility.  I thought it was a "use it once" benefit," but in reality it's a "use it on your first transfer" benefit.  I stand corrected.

[hhcmatt]

2 minutes ago, aphilso1 said:

 

Scratch that.  I will admit when I'm wrong, and now is one of those times.  I just checked the NCAA's page on the one time transfer rule, and it ONLY applies to a first-time transfer.  So guys like Walker, who already transferred once and had to sit out a year redshirting, actually would never get the benefit of immediate eligibility.  I thought it was a "use it once" benefit," but in reality it's a "use it on your first transfer" benefit.  I stand corrected.

 

Walker has graduated. I assume Trey will. Grad transfers can transfer without redshirting. 

[Huskerpapa]

Here is an interesting question; name a player on our team that you definitely know will show up tonight, play with passion and are cock-sure will have a good night both offensively and defensively?  Would you pass, or bet on someone(s)?

[aphilso1]

26 minutes ago, hhcmatt said:

 

Walker has graduated. I assume Trey will. Grad transfers can transfer without redshirting. 

 

I have learned my lesson to never publicly admit when I'm wrong. 

Edited February 18, 2022 by aphilso1

[49r]

1 hour ago, hhcmatt said:

 

Walker has graduated. I assume Trey will. Grad transfers can transfer without redshirting. 

 

I'd be shocked if either of them play college ball next year anywhere else.

[hhcmatt]

2 minutes ago, 49r said:

 

I'd be shocked if either of them play college ball next year anywhere else.

 

I'd agree. 

[hskr4life]

4 hours ago, NUdiehard said:

Same coach, different players, different result. 

 

Different results?  Sure, I guess in Defensive stats... but in terms of the results that matter, we've been pretty consistent.  7, 7, 7.

 

I personally wouldn't die on a "yeah but we found a different way to get to 7 wins" hill, but to each their own.

[BannedAccount]

5 hours ago, NUdiehard said:

Why does no one talk about what happens if Fred is fired?  If you think bringing back Fred will be bad, how much worse if Fred it fired?

 

If Fred is fired, most current players and probably a lot of the recruits will leave, forcing the new coach to turn over the roster just like Hoiberg had to do in his year 1.  There is almost zero chance a new coach will be able to assemble a roster with more talent than Fred will if Fred returns.  Why is this such an appealing option?  If you fear fans are leaving, hiring a new coach and turning over the entire roster again is not a great way to bring them back.

 

In contrast, If Fred's new recruits come in and show some effort, talent and progress, the fans will return. 

The old defeatist attitude of if he is fired who we gonna get and do you think it will get better....

[Dead Dog Alley]

11 hours ago, Norm Peterson said:

 

Admittedly, I would support delaying the inevitable failure in order to avoid paying the full buyout.

 

If Fred won't accept a big cut, then make him come back and do it again. We have a decent recruiting class coming in but I don't see a bunch of impact players coming in here.

 

But I really doubt Fred has his heart in this. I suspect he'd be willing to look for an out that pays him a bit to leave but doesn't require him to come back and suffer through another historically disastrous season.

 

 

So, after the season, Fred goes into Trev's office and Trev says, 'I've got some bad news; I really don't know how to break this to you; but, we have to bring you back next year."

 

Fred says, "Is there any way I can talk you out of this?"

 

[Ron Mexico]

11 hours ago, NUdiehard said:

Whether the problems are systemic is up for debate.  Last year's team had a top 40  defense (adjusted for tempo).  This year's defense is terrible.  The difference was last year they had Delano Banton, a long, athletic player who could defend and rebound at a high level, and this year replaced that with Verge and Keisei.  Same coach, different players, different result.  Problem was Delano couldn't shoot, which hurt on the offensive end.  Again, player problem, not coaching problem.  Having players that can shoot, defend and rebound is going to miraculously make the coach and his system look much better.  Does anyone dispute this?

 

It may or may not be be "probable" that Fred will be fired and we will have to start over with a new coach in the next year or 2.  But it is not 100% certain.  There is a chance that if Fred got another year or two, he could turn it around sufficiently that he gets retained for much longer because he is showing improvement and success.  I personally think that probably is higher with Fred (who has proven he can win at a power 5 school) than some no-name mid-major who will come here and think he is different than Collier, Sadler and Miles before him. 

 

Besides, even if Fred fails to meet expectations in years 4 and/or 5, at least he will have already brought in his new highly ranked recruits.  Those recruits are much more likely to stay with the new coach if they are already here and been in the program a year or 2.  If you fire Fred now, most of them likely leave and never set foot on campus.  Keeping Fred another year or 2 could be the difference between leaving the cupboard bare (if fired this year) vs. leaving fairly well stocked (after next year or the year after).  Next year is almost guaranteed to be terrible if we fire Fred now, so I see little downside to keeping him at least one more year.

I can empathize with wanting to stick by a coach, but this is pointless and not even worthy of debate.

What every mojo FH had at ISU is long gone. I don't know what happened, if it was his time as an NBA coach, health issues, the college game passing him by, or he lost his passion, but this is not working anymore and he can't fix it. 

 

 

[Norm Peterson]

Guys, it's the recruiting. But let's keep the recruiter.

 

 

[hugh42]

1 hour ago, Norm Peterson said:

Guys, it's the recruiting. But let's keep the recruiter.

 

 

 

Yes, we need better talent, but the clip has nothing to do with talent. This is basic stuff. Either Trey or Bryce was responsible for blocking out the shooter and neither one did. I could say this is on the coaches, but I can't imagine the McGowens brothers haven't been taught this at some point in time during their basketball career. Having said this, if, and it appears to be a big IF, players are being held accountable by the coaching staff for these types of errors, whatever they are doing isn't working.

[Huskerpapa]

4 minutes ago, hugh42 said:

 

Yes, we need better talent, but the clip has nothing to do with talent. This is basic stuff. Either Trey or Bryce was responsible for blocking out the shooter and neither one did. I could say this is on the coaches, but I can't imagine the McGowens brothers haven't been taught this at some point in time during their basketball career. Having said this, if, and it appears to be a big IF, players are being held accountable by the coaching staff for these types of errors, whatever they are doing isn't working.

This is sort of an interesting conundrum.   At what point in holding players accountable does it become impossible? Shoot, all the players, have flaws.  Every flipping one of them should be benched for their various foibles.   It is a mess when you see the simple mistakes manifest into loss after loss.

Sickening!

[busticket]

1 hour ago, Huskerpapa said:

This is sort of an interesting conundrum.   At what point in holding players accountable does it become impossible? Shoot, all the players, have flaws.  Every flipping one of them should be benched for their various foibles.   It is a mess when you see the simple mistakes manifest into loss after loss.

Sickening!

i guess to me a good coach works around his players flaws to give them the best chance to win.  Benching players is for repeated mental errors, not playing as a team or showing lack of effort.

[throwback]

4 hours ago, Huskerpapa said:

This is sort of an interesting conundrum.   At what point in holding players accountable does it become impossible? Shoot, all the players, have flaws.  Every flipping one of them should be benched for their various foibles.   It is a mess when you see the simple mistakes manifest into loss after loss.

Sickening!

Holding players accountable for repeated mistakes should've been happening in practice in mid-October. It clearly didn't.

 

These errors were obvious in the first couple of games as well. Yet they weren't fixed then either, and we're still discussing them in game 26.

 

Simple stuff. Effort on defense. Effort on the glass. Playing smart. Playing unselfishly. All of which have been fixable with accountability since the birth of the game. Yet, somehow, our coaches won't do it. It's insanity.

 

Put aside the losses. Ultimately by not holding players accountable, Fred is not giving them the best chance to maximize their talents. He is doing them a disservice by treating them like he is.

 

It's gone on long enough to show what the future looks like, regardless of what kinds of players they can recruit. It's not going to improve without a complete 180 in the way the program operates.

 

[uneblinstu]

I watched the last 5 minutes of the Iowa-Ohio State game. There was an intensity and toughness demonstrated by both teams that I don't think I've ever seen NU be able to display with any sort of regularity. Iowa got 20 offensive rebounds. That's a mentality thing. I'd love to see NU embody that kind of thing. Iowa is an offense first program and they still out hustle and out tough teams. It can be done. If a change is made, it doesn't have to be a return to the days of we're going to play good, hard defense and make the game as ugly as possible and beat maybe beat you 48-45. I hope we don't over correct like that.