Wisc. transfer Kobe King is 'N'

[basketballjones]

It's becoming more and more clear that we will not even remotely have the same team next year, and that we will see some pretty significant attrition this offseason. 

Hopefully at some point in the Hoiberg era we find a happy medium. As much as I like being ruthless and always trying to find the best players - I also like consistency and development. 

[dustystehl]

I like winning. Whatever needs to happen in order to win, I'm all for it.

[basketballjones]

14 minutes ago, dustystehl said:

I like winning. Whatever needs to happen in order to win, I'm all for it.

So does everyone. At some point the things you do to win at all costs backfire. You have to start finding consistency (and that consistency can't be consistent chaos) and cohesion at some point. 

[Chuck Taylor]

1 minute ago, basketballjones said:

So does everyone. At some point the things you do to win at all costs backfire. You have to start finding consistency (and that consistency can't be consistent chaos) and cohesion at some point. 

Yeah, it's easy to look at who's coming next year and think it's all going to be great, but they have to learn to play together, like this team did (or didn't). Coming into the season, we had a couple of JC all Americans, couple of good transfers and what looked like a good bunch of freshmen. There's no way the noncon should have been that bad just looking at talent level vs. most of our opponents. But you can't account for what it takes to come together when the roster has had massive turnover.

 

That Cheatham comment about what appealed to him about NU stuck with me. He said, "11 roster openings," or something like that. Everybody comes in thinking they're playing major minutes, and the adjustment doesn't always go well. 

[colhusker]

1 hour ago, basketballjones said:

It's becoming more and more clear that we will not even remotely have the same team next year, and that we will see some pretty significant attrition this offseason. 

Hopefully at some point in the Hoiberg era we find a happy medium. As much as I like being ruthless and always trying to find the best players - I also like consistency and development. 

Why I agree we will have several new faces, not sure what has happen to make you think attrition will be significant.  Not saying you're wrong.  Just curious what has transpired so far to make you feel that way?

[royalfan]

12 minutes ago, basketballjones said:

So does everyone. At some point the things you do to win at all costs backfire. You have to start finding consistency (and that consistency can't be consistent chaos) and cohesion at some point. 

What do you mean by “win at all costs”?  It seems like we are doing things that are consistent with his model of success.  

[49r]

mmm, salty...

 

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/buckyville/kobe-king-leaving-the-wisconsin-men-s-basketball-t-t100871-s1950.html#p1932169

[basketballjones]

13 minutes ago, royalfan said:

What do you mean by “win at all costs”?  It seems like we are doing things that are consistent with his model of success.  

I'm not sure that's true for every year while at Iowa State. It's what he does in the first year, but then sprinkles in others. I'm getting a hunch we're gonna have a big flip again this year. That's just my opinion. 

 

@hhcmatt can we get an answer here?

[basketballjones]

18 minutes ago, colhusker said:

Why I agree we will have several new faces, not sure what has happen to make you think attrition will be significant.  Not saying you're wrong.  Just curious what has transpired so far to make you feel that way?

I just feel like we're bringing in a lot of guys who expect to play early, and have guys on the bench who will immediately take other's spots. There's going to be some unhappy guys, imo. 

[hhcmatt]

1 minute ago, basketballjones said:

I'm not sure that's true for every year while at Iowa State. It's what he does in the first year, but then sprinkles in others. I'm getting a hunch we're gonna have a big flip again this year. That's just my opinion. 

 

@hhcmatt can we get an answer here?

 

On what, HCFH roster turnover numbers at Iowa St?

[basketballjones]

4 minutes ago, hhcmatt said:

 

On what, HCFH roster turnover numbers at Iowa St?

As far as, is this his "consistent model?" Without knowing the exact details, I've always got more of the impression that at Iowa State, Hoiberg only did that massive overhaul in his first year, but eventually worked towards a relatively consistent roster. 

[REDZONEDAN]

26 minutes ago, 49r said:

mmm, salty...

 

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/buckyville/kobe-king-leaving-the-wisconsin-men-s-basketball-t-t100871-s1950.html#p1932169

It makes me laugh that Wisconsin fans are butt hurt that he stayed in conference.  They took a kid that transferred from Ohio St.  Whats the difference?

[hhcmatt]

23 hours ago, basketballjones said:

As far as, is this his "consistent model?" Without knowing the exact details, I've always got more of the impression that at Iowa State, Hoiberg only did that massive overhaul in his first year, but eventually worked towards a relatively consistent roster. 

 

Here is something to ballpark consistency if you define it in terms of KenPom's continuity

 

Hoiberg Minute Continuity (at ISU)

Year 1 - 30.6% 320

Year 2 - 32.8% 282

Year 3 - 50.0% 178

Year 4 - 27.7% 324

Year 5 - 60.6% 86

 

Here are those numbers again with "experience" aka how old are the teams

Year 1 - 30.6% 320 - Ex 1.81 yrs 153 

Year 2 - 32.8% 282 - Ex 1.89 yrs 100 

Year 3 - 50.0% 178 - Ex 2.34 yrs 16 (5 seniors on the team)

Year 4 - 27.7% 324 - Ex 1.57 yrs 231

Year 5 - 60.6%   86 - Ex 1.99 yrs 83

 

Seems like he had churn the first two years, got a decent number of returns year 3, graduated a lot of those guys and had to replace them for year 4, and then brought back almost everyone year 5.  We seem to be on a similar sort of trajectory as it seems by year 3 we will have a team heavy with Juniors and Seniors even with inevitable roster churn.

[The Polish Rifle]

6 minutes ago, hhcmatt said:

 

Here is something to ballpark consistency if you define it in terms of KenPom's continuity

 

Hoiberg Minute Continuity 

Year 1 - 30.6% 320

Year 2 - 32.8% 282

Year 3 - 50.0% 178

Year 4 - 27.7% 324

Year 5 - 60.6% 86

 

Here are those numbers again with "experience" aka how old are the teams

Year 1 - 30.6% 320 - Ex 1.81 yrs 153 

Year 2 - 32.8% 282 - Ex 1.89 yrs 100 

Year 3 - 50.0% 178 - Ex 2.34 yrs 16 (5 seniors on the team)

Year 4 - 27.7% 324 - Ex 1.57 yrs 231

Year 5 - 60.6%   86 - Ex 1.99 yrs 83

 

Seems like he had churn the first two years, got a decent number of returns year 3, graduated a lot of those guys and had to replace them for year 4, and then brought back almost everyone year 5.  We seem to be on a similar sort of trajectory it seems as it seems by year 3 we will have a team heavy with Juniors and Seniors even with inevitable roster churn.

I’ll piggy back, during Hoibergs 2nd season, when they made the jump, there was 9 guys that averaged double digit minutes - 6 of those guys didn’t play a minute at ISU the previous season. 

[Chuck Taylor]

27 minutes ago, The Polish Rifle said:

I’ll piggy back, during Hoibergs 2nd season, when they made the jump, there was 9 guys that averaged double digit minutes - 6 of those guys didn’t play a minute at ISU the previous season. 

OK, now that's a great stat! Thanks!

[basketballjones]

1 hour ago, hhcmatt said:

 

Here is something to ballpark consistency if you define it in terms of KenPom's continuity

 

Hoiberg Minute Continuity 

Year 1 - 30.6% 320

Year 2 - 32.8% 282

Year 3 - 50.0% 178

Year 4 - 27.7% 324

Year 5 - 60.6% 86

 

Here are those numbers again with "experience" aka how old are the teams

Year 1 - 30.6% 320 - Ex 1.81 yrs 153 

Year 2 - 32.8% 282 - Ex 1.89 yrs 100 

Year 3 - 50.0% 178 - Ex 2.34 yrs 16 (5 seniors on the team)

Year 4 - 27.7% 324 - Ex 1.57 yrs 231

Year 5 - 60.6%   86 - Ex 1.99 yrs 83

 

Seems like he had churn the first two years, got a decent number of returns year 3, graduated a lot of those guys and had to replace them for year 4, and then brought back almost everyone year 5.  We seem to be on a similar sort of trajectory it seems as it seems by year 3 we will have a team heavy with Juniors and Seniors even with inevitable roster churn.

@royalfan Looks like you are right. Thanks for those numbers Matt. 

[royalfan]

21 minutes ago, basketballjones said:

@royalfan Looks like you are right. Thanks for those numbers Matt. 

 

Not a matter of right or wrong at all.  I was just curious if there was a reason for your concern that I was missing.  I certainly do understand that this might not be some folks preferred method of going about things.  I guess if it works I am down.  Will be interesting for sure.  

[nustudent]

20 hours ago, basketballjones said:

So does everyone. At some point the things you do to win at all costs backfire. You have to start finding consistency (and that consistency can't be consistent chaos) and cohesion at some point. 

I agree with this.   But I also don't think by the end of year 1 is the baseline for that, especially considering what he was inheriting and what he had to do in 6 weeks last year.   If we're still losing 4-5 guys a year in 2-3 years...then it's something to consider.   But this was always a make shift roster and it shouldn't be a surprise that there are casualties.

[basketballjones]

1 hour ago, nustudent said:

I agree with this.   But I also don't think by the end of year 1 is the baseline for that, especially considering what he was inheriting and what he had to do in 6 weeks last year.   If we're still losing 4-5 guys a year in 2-3 years...then it's something to consider.   But this was always a make shift roster and it shouldn't be a surprise that there are casualties.

10/4 good buddy. Spot on. 

[hhcmatt]

He gone

 

Statement from Nebraska Men’s Basketball Coach Fred Hoiberg
“Kobe King has informed us that he will not be attending the University of Nebraska for personal reasons. We respect his decision and wish him the best in his future endeavors.”

[jimmykc]

Succinct and cryptic.

[The Polish Rifle]

Was this a rare 1 Burno? Usually people make it at least 2-3 Burnos if not more.

[HuskerFever]

Fred: "There can only be one Kobe on our roster."

 

Kobes:

 

[hhcmatt]

Considering there was a season and then a pandemic going on I don't think King ever made it to campus other than as a player for Wisconsin.

It's hard to get emotionally worked up one way or the other about someone with who I'd put in no emotional investment. Not much to say other than hope everything is ok for him.

[hskr4life]

Title change:  Kobe King is N and Out