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Handy Johnson

Who Starts?

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39 minutes ago, huskercwg said:

IF we go with a conventional line up, true.  But the flexibility this group brings to the floor will allow us to play combinations that perhaps are a bit less conventional. 

I see no reason to be unconventional when we will have a (what i expect to be) center is that the real deal and top half in the conference.

 

However, with our lack of depth at the 5 i could definetly see us doing what you are talking about for spurts of the game. I'd like to see what problems a lineup of Watson, Allen/Nana/Gill ??, McVeigh, Roby, and Copeland could cause.

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10 hours ago, hhcdimes said:

 

Glynn and Jordy are currently the guys I have written down in permanent marker. 

If Copeland is cleared/healthy I don't think I'd be that confident that Jordy starts. He could potentially go:

 

1. Glynn/Taylor

2. Taylor/Gill

3. Palmer/McVeigh/Gill

4. Roby/McVeigh

5. Copeland 

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1 hour ago, basketballjones said:

If Copeland is cleared/healthy I don't think I'd be that confident that Jordy starts. He could potentially go:

 

1. Glynn/Taylor

2. Taylor/Gill

3. Palmer/McVeigh/Gill

4. Roby/McVeigh

5. Copeland 

 

I don't see it.  I think Copeland actually could be a 3 and Roby a 4.  But I don't see Copeland at 220# being a 5.  I bet he probably doesn't see it either.  Especially not with prior back problems.  

 

I think Jordy is most likely to start at the 5.  The only way Jordy doesn't start is if Duby is somehow better.  Glynn is almost a lock to start at point.  And I think you have options at 2-4.

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11 minutes ago, Norm Peterson said:

 

I don't see it.  I think Copeland actually could be a 3 and Roby a 4.  But I don't see Copeland at 220# being a 5.  I bet he probably doesn't see it either.  Especially not with prior back problems.  

 

I think Jordy is most likely to start at the 5.  The only way Jordy doesn't start is if Duby is somehow better.  Glynn is almost a lock to start at point.  And I think you have options at 2-4.

Agreed. I think all the competition will take place between the 2 through 4 positions.

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On ‎7‎/‎11‎/‎2017 at 3:08 PM, khoock said:

G Glynn Watson 6'0 Jr

G James Palmer 6'6 Jr

F Isaiah Roby 6'8 So

F Isaac Copeland 6'9 Jr

C Jordy Tshimanga 6'11 So

 

This length alone will hopefully solve our three point defensive woes.  The ruling on Copeland is going to be critical.  I'm thinking the coaches have to like the chances of getting Copeland the full year.  If not, I'm guessing they would have utilized atleast one of the two remaining scholarships we have open. 

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10 hours ago, basketballjones said:

If Copeland is cleared/healthy I don't think I'd be that confident that Jordy starts. He could potentially go:

 

1. Glynn/Taylor

2. Taylor/Gill

3. Palmer/McVeigh/Gill

4. Roby/McVeigh

5. Copeland 

 

That's a viable option and something I think we see, especially against teams that don't have a true center or when we get into foul trouble.

However, with no MJ and Ed to throw out there I have to think we will want Jordy out there for rim protection/rebounding/post buckets

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I can see Copeland going to the 5 in situational lineups.   Not full time though.

 

I don't see anyway that Jordy doesn't start either.   If Duby beats him out, my hopes/expectations for Jordy go down dramatically.

 

The questions are how the 2/3/4 positons shake out.   And that's both somewhat intriguing and somewhat concerning as well because there are a lot of different ways they could shake out.

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20 hours ago, hhcdimes said:

 

Palmer and Taylor are approximately the same size.

Just looking at their offensive output it would seem to me that Palmer is the superior option.  Unless Taylor is a superior defender, I would think that Palmer gets the start over him.

 

I hear you, and i agree that Palmer is likely to start over Taylor by season's end (or maybe even start of conference play).  But with one starter graduated and another couple transferred, I fully expect Miles to rely on what little roster consistancy he has in early November.  And that's what this mental excercise is, right?  Predicting who Miles will trot out for the season's opening tip?  Doesn't mean that's the starting lineup I want to see.  Just means that's who I expect to jog out onto the floor.

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2 hours ago, nustudent said:

I can see Copeland going to the 5 in situational lineups.   Not full time though.

 

I don't see anyway that Jordy doesn't start either.   If Duby beats him out, my hopes/expectations for Jordy go down dramatically.

 

The questions are how the 2/3/4 positons shake out.   And that's both somewhat intriguing and somewhat concerning as well because there are a lot of different ways they could shake out.

 

This I agree with.  Except for the Duby part.  I think I know what we have with Jordy and I think Jordy will be very good.  I'm leaving open the possibility (not probability, just possibility) that Duby could be even better.  If Duby beats him out, IMO, it will be because Duby was a lot better than we realized or thought and not because Jordy isn't as good.

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27 minutes ago, Norm Peterson said:

 

This I agree with.  Except for the Duby part.  I think I know what we have with Jordy and I think Jordy will be very good.  I'm leaving open the possibility (not probability, just possibility) that Duby could be even better.  If Duby beats him out, IMO, it will be because Duby was a lot better than we realized or thought and not because Jordy isn't as good.

 

I could see it. If Nebraska has a lot of shooter/scorer types on the first unit, then Jordy could be better off getting buckets on the 2nd unit while Duby is rebounding & blocking shots as a defensive stalwart against an opponent's stud center. It's certainly possible, Normy.

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20 hours ago, Norm Peterson said:

 

I think he would have been great on the soccer pitch. 

 

Srsly, tho, I was just havin' some fun with ya.

I'd expect nothing less Mr. Peterson... BTW if anyone knows, when oh WHEN will there be a ruling on Copeland?

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53 minutes ago, Norm Peterson said:

 

  If Duby beats him out, IMO, it will be because Duby was a lot better than we realized or thought and not because Jordy isn't as good.

I'd be disappointed.  Just not likely that Duby all of a sudden becomes a guy with skill and scoring potential.  Jordy showed enough potential that we dismissed the departures of Ed and Jacobson.  He's been labeled by some as the next big (pun not intended) thing in the Big 10.   Jordy, Jacobson and Ed were all more productive as freshmen and sophomores against Big 10 teams than Duby was as a 4th year player at Winthrop.   And I don't buy the style of play angle either.  Duby was a nice pickup in the sense we had open scholies and needed 5 fouls behind Jordy.  I suppose it's possible that he all of a sudden becomes a different player.   It's also possible I win the lottery this weekend.   I'm not counting on either happening.  If Duby is playing over Jordy...it's likely that something bad happened.

Edited by nustudent

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1 hour ago, dustystehl said:

If you think there is any chance Jordy doesn't start, you're nuts.

Really? Nuts? He got 5 and 4 in our 12-19 season. Had almost the same amount of turnovers in nearly a third amount of playing time as Glynn Watson and had 9 more than Evan Taylor in half the playing time.

 

In an era of basketball that is moving away from the back to the basket, space eating hog post, and moving towards posts who can either pick and pop, stay out of the way and get dump offs for dunks, or pick and roll and be nimble with your finish --- then block shots on the other end (in which Roby had 10 more last year and Duby has 165 in his career) --- his skill set isn't always going to be the best option. 

 

Good chance he'll start? Absolutely. Do I have high hopes for Jordy and think he could be a stud? Absolutely. But could we go more nimble and spaced? Absolutely. Could Duby end up filling a need better? Absolutely. 

 

Nuts? Don't think so... crazy like a fox, maybe.... 

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2 hours ago, aphilso1 said:

 

I hear you, and i agree that Palmer is likely to start over Taylor by season's end (or maybe even start of conference play).  But with one starter graduated and another couple transferred, I fully expect Miles to rely on what little roster consistancy he has in early November.  And that's what this mental excercise is, right?  Predicting who Miles will trot out for the season's opening tip?  Doesn't mean that's the starting lineup I want to see.  Just means that's who I expect to jog out onto the floor.

 

While I'd agree that Miles likes to start with what he knows, Palmer has been here for a year. The other 3 Div-1 guys who redshirted a year (Petteway, Pitchford, White) all ended up starting game 1.

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1 hour ago, hhcdimes said:

The other 3 Div-1 guys who redshirted a year (Petteway, Pitchford, White) all ended up starting game 1.

 

Gill was a Div-1 transfer who redshirted a year but did not start Game 1.

 

I wouldn't put it past Miles to start Taylor and/or McVeigh the first game of the season. Doesn't mean they'll play more minutes than some players coming off the bench, though.

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3 hours ago, nustudent said:

(Snipped)  Jordy, Jacobson and Ed were all more productive as freshmen and sophomores against Big 10 teams than Duby was as a 4th year player at Winthrop.   And I don't buy the style of play angle either.  Duby was a nice pickup in the sense we had open scholies and needed 5 fouls behind Jordy.  I suppose it's possible that he all of a sudden becomes a different player.   It's also possible I win the lottery this weekend.   I'm not counting on either happening.  If Duby is playing over Jordy...it's likely that something bad happened.

 

Well, yeah, based on what we know.  Which isn't much.

 

I mean I'm not disagreeing with you.  I'm just saying if you're looking strictly at the information in front of us, at the known, you could draw the conclusion that Duby is a downgrade from Ed, Michael, etc.

 

And, therefore, if he ends up starting over Jordy, that means really bad things about Jordy.

 

You could look at it that way.

 

I come from a different direction, which is that I think there's a lot about Duby we just don't know.  Based on what we knew about Evan Taylor last year, nobody expected him to be anywhere near as good as he ended up being either.  It's possible the same could be true about Duby.  One thing we do know is that he's athletic as hell.  His game might be more suited to the Big Ten than the Big South.

 

IMO, Jordy is pretty good and will come back better than he was. I agree with you that it's unlikely Duby starts over Jordy.  But, if he does, my feeling is it'll be because he's better than we thought rather than that Jordy isn't as good as we hoped. 

 

Again, I think I know what we're going to be getting with Jordy.  I don't think we know a whole lot about Duby.  At least I don't think I do.

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1 hour ago, Norm Peterson said:

 

Well, yeah, based on what we know.  Which isn't much.

 

I mean I'm not disagreeing with you.  I'm just saying if you're looking strictly at the information in front of us, at the known, you could draw the conclusion that Duby is a downgrade from Ed, Michael, etc.

 

And, therefore, if he ends up starting over Jordy, that means really bad things about Jordy.

 

You could look at it that way.

 

I come from a different direction, which is that I think there's a lot about Duby we just don't know.  Based on what we knew about Evan Taylor last year, nobody expected him to be anywhere near as good as he ended up being either.  It's possible the same could be true about Duby.  One thing we do know is that he's athletic as hell.  His game might be more suited to the Big Ten than the Big South.

 

IMO, Jordy is pretty good and will come back better than he was. I agree with you that it's unlikely Duby starts over Jordy.  But, if he does, my feeling is it'll be because he's better than we thought rather than that Jordy isn't as good as we hoped. 

 

Again, I think I know what we're going to be getting with Jordy.  I don't think we know a whole lot about Duby.  At least I don't think I do.

I don't think there is a lot about Duby we don't know.   We aren't talking about a freshmen here.   We're talking about a 4th year junior.   I suppose it's not impossible that he all of a sudden overnight resembles a skilled offensive player.   I also suppose it's also not impossible Charlotte McKinney and Lindsey Pelas will show up on my doorstep tonight.  Point being....neither are realistic or likely.    And while I will give you he is athletic, and can have a role on the team, you are still talking about a jump from the Big South to the Big Ten.   Role players on Big South teams don't all of a sudden breakout by moving to the Big 10.

 

And while I was pleased with Taylor's contributions last year, let's also not paint a picture that he was anything more than an average Big 10 player fitting a role (with some help from a Gill injury).

 

I think Duby's size and athleticsm give him a role.  I do.   Don't take this as taking that away from him.   But I don't believe tiger's change their stripes.   This isn't a kid who is transferring after his freshman year because of an odd fit.   This is more of a finish product.  You have 4 years of criteria here, not one or even two.  He was a role player in the Big South.  I think it's a bit foolish and naïve to realistically expect he would be anything above that by stepping up several levels in competition.  IMO, he is who he is.  A role guy.    Jordy has the potential to be so much more than that.   Which is why I say, it's not a good thing if he is starting over Jordy.

Edited by nustudent

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