More bad news!?

[hskr4life]

You so want to be right...more than you want us to succeed. That's too bad

Anyone see Rosenthal Tweet?

https://twitter.com/huskerextrabr/status/754459349511131136

What is it that I want to be right about? I love that I'm living rent free in a few peoples heads on here.

That's so much better than being right on Andrew.

You're kind of self-oriented like Andrew, so there's that. Doubt you're really living in people's heads, and if you are the proclamation that you love it says it all.

Let me see if I can explain how we got here so that there is continued bickering about this, at least you'll all be on the same page.

Lanigan made a post about Andrew White leaving and then it actually happened.

However, as he knew that this was likely/probable/a fact he then subsequently made the connection that this was because of Miles. Once White actually left and how this went down became public he changed his tone as it's become almost crystal clear how insincere White and company were.

Thus, Lanigan is remembering about being right about White while others are remembering him being wrong about the culpability of Miles in this particular situation.

and that'll do it for our first half wrap up. We'll be right back for the second half after this word from our sponsors.

[Husker4theSpurs]

White seems angry that (he believes) someone from Nebraska leaked the information before he had a chance to do damage control PR. Sounds like it's more likely someone who knew White leaked the info. Some thoughts and best guesses:

- Miles and White weren't seeing eye to eye 100% on how he might be used next year. To better put it ... how the offense would be formed around him. Where my main frustration lies is the quotes from White earlier about how Nebraska could change the offense to help him work on what he needs to work on in order to make the NBA. I like AWIII but this was where I really started to question him a bit. It doesn't speak as very team friendly if you're making quotes that seem like you're all about everything else changing to suit you.

- I think the team knew for quite a while that AWIII likely wasn't returning, so they weren't really shocked like some were.

 

- My frustration toward White is based on him reneging on the "it's Nebraska or the NBA" talk.

 

- Overall I don't blame AWIII for making the move if he truly wants to have the best chance to go to the NBA. He got a taste of what it would be like to be the focal point when Shields went down and his numbers didn't exactly show he is a great "first option" guy. I wish he were more honest about his motives for leaving, but basically he wants to go somewhere where he will be more of a catch and shoot (which is his way to possibly make an NBA team). He's not a great "first option" on any team as his all-around game isn't superb.

- Again, I don't blame him one bit for leaving ... but the way he went about it was mishandled. He doesn't really have anyone to blame but himself. Miles has done a good job of keeping his mouth shut for the most part although I'd imagine he let AWIII know how he felt about a lot of this.

- The clock is ticking on Miles big time. You can live on transfers, but you're also going to get burned. He has talked up the roster and how he's improved recruiting (and he has) but the results are going to have to come pretty darn soon. I think his goodwill is eroding. I'm super concerned about our guard play (save Glynn Watson) and it's not like we're solid in the post either. Sometimes it feels like we have a bunch of guys that don't really have a true position (which isn't necessarily bad).

- Miles could be a victim of his own success in getting to the NCAA a bit earlier than he'd figured. I have fairly low expectations for this year, but I've been a Nebrasketball fan for a long time so it's part of the deal

- Rosenthal really seemed to take this thing personal. He has likely been privy to a lot more information (obviously) than we have and has a better big scheme picture of what went down. I will look forward to hearing him talk about it more on the local radio show podcasts this week.
 

[Donkey]

White seems angry that (he believes) someone from Nebraska leaked the information before he had a chance to do damage control PR. Sounds like it's more likely someone who knew White leaked the info. Some thoughts and best guesses:

- Miles and White weren't seeing eye to eye 100% on how he might be used next year. To better put it ... how the offense would be formed around him. Where my main frustration lies is the quotes from White earlier about how Nebraska could change the offense to help him work on what he needs to work on in order to make the NBA. I like AWIII but this was where I really started to question him a bit. It doesn't speak as very team friendly if you're making quotes that seem like you're all about everything else changing to suit you.

 

I agree with most of this point.  The offense will feature Watson and Morrow, and it would not surprise me if AWIII did not like that.  Notice the lack of discussion concerning AWIII needed to improve himself defensively as well.  

- I think the team knew for quite a while that AWIII likely wasn't returning, so they weren't really shocked like some were.

 

Needless to say, they were still pissed the way he left.

 

- My frustration toward White is based on him reneging on the "it's Nebraska or the NBA" talk.

 

- Overall I don't blame AWIII for making the move if he truly wants to have the best chance to go to the NBA. He got a taste of what it would be like to be the focal point when Shields went down and his numbers didn't exactly show he is a great "first option" guy. I wish he were more honest about his motives for leaving, but basically he wants to go somewhere where he will be more of a catch and shoot (which is his way to possibly make an NBA team). He's not a great "first option" on any team as his all-around game isn't superb.

 

Completely agree.  AWIII is a good supporting cast guy.  He never was an alpha.  Remember a year ago when people from Kansas were saying AWIII was incredible during practice and disappeared under the big lights.  He never really took over games for Nebraska.  He was a major contributor yes, but not the leader of the team.

- Again, I don't blame him one bit for leaving ... but the way he went about it was mishandled. He doesn't really have anyone to blame but himself. Miles has done a good job of keeping his mouth shut for the most part although I'd imagine he let AWIII know how he felt about a lot of this.

 

AWIII had every opportunity to control the message and never took control of the situation.  

- The clock is ticking on Miles big time. You can live on transfers, but you're also going to get burned. He has talked up the roster and how he's improved recruiting (and he has) but the results are going to have to come pretty darn soon. I think his goodwill is eroding. I'm super concerned about our guard play (save Glynn Watson) and it's not like we're solid in the post either. Sometimes it feels like we have a bunch of guys that don't really have a true position (which isn't necessarily bad).

 

We have some really solid guards, but the depth is lacking.

- Miles could be a victim of his own success in getting to the NCAA a bit earlier than he'd figured. I have fairly low expectations for this year, but I've been a Nebrasketball fan for a long time so it's part of the deal

 

I guess I am a little more positive than most.

- Rosenthal really seemed to take this thing personal. He has likely been privy to a lot more information (obviously) than we have and has a better big scheme picture of what went down. I will look forward to hearing him talk about it more on the local radio show podcasts this week.

 

Rosenthal mentioned in his article a few times he tried to interview AWIII or the father and received no response.  Then AWIII later does an interview with someone else.  Clearly, Rosenthal's ego was hurt.

[hhcmatt]

Re: Watson/Morrow being featured - He seems like he wants to go to a team where he is secondary anyway. This is the sort of somewhat contradictory possible reasons for White leaving that points to White approaching things under the flawed premise that he would have been drafted this year had Nebraska had better players, had catered more to his strengths, had won more, etc. Also, featuring Morrow? Interesting...

Re Rosenthal - could have been ego but it also could have been that the Whites were hitting him up for stories and stuff like that and the silence at the end pointed at how disingenuous the whole situation was.

[colhusker]

 

 

- The clock is ticking on Miles big time. You can live on transfers, but you're also going to get burned. He has talked up the roster and how he's improved recruiting (and he has) but the results are going to have to come pretty darn soon. I think his goodwill is eroding. I'm super concerned about our guard play (save Glynn Watson) and it's not like we're solid in the post either. Sometimes it feels like we have a bunch of guys that don't really have a true position (which isn't necessarily bad).

White wanted to go then he should have said I am looking into all options so the staff was not left like they were at a point nothing could be done.  As I have said, I don't wish ill will on White, just refuse to wish him good luck.  IF he picks MSU I hope he gets his wish and they change the offense to let him work on what he needs to work on to get into the NBA.  I would love to see him try and dribble vs a Watson or Webster type defender.

 

That said, I am not sure Miles is "living" on transfers.  Yes we seem to get one each year but with what, 500-600 kids transferring each year that is got to be expected.  Looking at roster (ok from memory which at my age is iffy) Watson, Morrow, McVeigh, Roby, Horne, Webster, Jacobson, Fuller, Tshimanga are all high school recruits and not transfers.

[Red Don]

 

 

 

- The clock is ticking on Miles big time. You can live on transfers, but you're also going to get burned. He has talked up the roster and how he's improved recruiting (and he has) but the results are going to have to come pretty darn soon. I think his goodwill is eroding. I'm super concerned about our guard play (save Glynn Watson) and it's not like we're solid in the post either. Sometimes it feels like we have a bunch of guys that don't really have a true position (which isn't necessarily bad).

White wanted to go then he should have said I am looking into all options so the staff was not left like they were at a point nothing could be done.  As I have said, I don't wish ill will on White, just refuse to wish him good luck.  IF he picks MSU I hope he gets his wish and they change the offense to let him work on what he needs to work on to get into the NBA.  I would love to see him try and dribble vs a Watson or Webster type defender.

 

That said, I am not sure Miles is "living" on transfers.  Yes we seem to get one each year but with what, 500-600 kids transferring each year that is got to be expected.  Looking at roster (ok from memory which at my age is iffy) Watson, Morrow, McVeigh, Roby, Horne, Webster, Jacobson, Fuller, Tshimanga are all high school recruits and not transfers.

 

 

Si! Si!  I'm not so sure Miles hears any clock ticking away (nor do I think he should).  Sure, He's got to produce, but I don't necessarily think he is on any sort of a hot-seat - His agenda is being put into place.  Nor do I think Shawn Eichorst (I know he didn't hire Miles) is getting impatient, despite a little slower progress than maybe some of us fans would wish to see.  As long as it is being demonstrated that Miles is improving the talent level of the players, And Staff, I think Eichorst will give him ample time to 'develop' his recruits. 

 

Isn't Miles in on some good future recruits, like Aguek Arop and perhaps some of his contemporaries? (Doesn't Aguek have a younger brother who is also supposed to be a good basketball player?)

 

So far, to me, it seems like Miles can recruit; but maybe the question yet to be answered is, can he coach?

 

It's a little before my time (remember, I only really started following Husker Hoops after Miles was hired), but reading the forums it seems to me that the prevailing wisdom is that the former coach, 'Doc' Sadler, was somebody who could coach, but couldn't recruit.

 

If that is so, which would I rather have?  A HC that can coach, but can't recruit; or one that can recruit, but can't coach?  Think maybe I'd have to go with recruiting better talent!  

[Donkey]

 

 

 

- The clock is ticking on Miles big time. You can live on transfers, but you're also going to get burned. He has talked up the roster and how he's improved recruiting (and he has) but the results are going to have to come pretty darn soon. I think his goodwill is eroding. I'm super concerned about our guard play (save Glynn Watson) and it's not like we're solid in the post either. Sometimes it feels like we have a bunch of guys that don't really have a true position (which isn't necessarily bad).

White wanted to go then he should have said I am looking into all options so the staff was not left like they were at a point nothing could be done.  As I have said, I don't wish ill will on White, just refuse to wish him good luck.  IF he picks MSU I hope he gets his wish and they change the offense to let him work on what he needs to work on to get into the NBA.  I would love to see him try and dribble vs a Watson or Webster type defender.

 

That said, I am not sure Miles is "living" on transfers.  Yes we seem to get one each year but with what, 500-600 kids transferring each year that is got to be expected.  Looking at roster (ok from memory which at my age is iffy) Watson, Morrow, McVeigh, Roby, Horne, Webster, Jacobson, Fuller, Tshimanga are all high school recruits and not transfers.

 

 

 

Do not forget Gill.  He should be starting this year at the 2.  

 

Re: Watson/Morrow being featured - He seems like he wants to go to a team where he is secondary anyway. This is the sort of somewhat contradictory possible reasons for White leaving that points to White approaching things under the flawed premise that he would have been drafted this year had Nebraska had better players, had catered more to his strengths, had won more, etc. Also, featuring Morrow? Interesting...

Re Rosenthal - could have been ego but it also could have been that the Whites were hitting him up for stories and stuff like that and the silence at the end pointed at how disingenuous the whole situation was.

 

 

There are a lot of flaws in AWIII's decision-making that will leave him undesirable for the 2017 NBA draft.  

[colhusker]

 

 

 

 

- The clock is ticking on Miles big time. You can live on transfers, but you're also going to get burned. He has talked up the roster and how he's improved recruiting (and he has) but the results are going to have to come pretty darn soon. I think his goodwill is eroding. I'm super concerned about our guard play (save Glynn Watson) and it's not like we're solid in the post either. Sometimes it feels like we have a bunch of guys that don't really have a true position (which isn't necessarily bad).

White wanted to go then he should have said I am looking into all options so the staff was not left like they were at a point nothing could be done.  As I have said, I don't wish ill will on White, just refuse to wish him good luck.  IF he picks MSU I hope he gets his wish and they change the offense to let him work on what he needs to work on to get into the NBA.  I would love to see him try and dribble vs a Watson or Webster type defender.

 

That said, I am not sure Miles is "living" on transfers.  Yes we seem to get one each year but with what, 500-600 kids transferring each year that is got to be expected.  Looking at roster (ok from memory which at my age is iffy) Watson, Morrow, McVeigh, Roby, Horne, Webster, Jacobson, Fuller, Tshimanga are all high school recruits and not transfers.

 

 

 

Do not forget Gill.  He should be starting this year at the 2.  

 

Re: Watson/Morrow being featured - He seems like he wants to go to a team where he is secondary anyway. This is the sort of somewhat contradictory possible reasons for White leaving that points to White approaching things under the flawed premise that he would have been drafted this year had Nebraska had better players, had catered more to his strengths, had won more, etc. Also, featuring Morrow? Interesting...

Re Rosenthal - could have been ego but it also could have been that the Whites were hitting him up for stories and stuff like that and the silence at the end pointed at how disingenuous the whole situation was.

 

 

There are a lot of flaws in AWIII's decision-making that will leave him undesirable for the 2017 NBA draft.  

 

Gill is a transfer.  Guys I mentioned were all recruited out of high school.  Post I replied to said Miles was living on transfers, just wanted to point out not the case.

 

Could the more bad news be the Roby injury?

[khoock]

No, there wasn't any bad news really. The thread was created to address a Rosenthal tweet that is at the beginning of the thread. The tweet ended up being about a story that Rosenthal wrote regarding AW3.

[Fullbacksympathy]

I think Miles is safe for three more seasons, including this one.  We'll really be able to see how much the culture has changed when Glynn and co. are seniors.  If we're seeing that sort of talent from senior-freshman, I don't see how it doesn't translate into more wins as well.  Right now, I'm looking at freshmen and sophomores.  I'm extremely impressed with the talent we have in our underclassmen.  If Miles can continue that trend, the future is still very, very bright.  

[hhcmatt]

I think Miles is safe for three more seasons, including this one.  

 

On the flipside, I could see Miles leaving before that.

I think he likes it here well enough but he's never been anywhere for too terribly wrong and seems like he might subscribe to the Lon Kruger school of moving. It's probably a lot better if he leaves with another offer than if we have to fire him though.

[Norm Peterson]

Right now, I'm looking at freshmen and sophomores. I'm extremely impressed with the talent we have in our underclassmen.

That's what I'm thinking of when I look at the proverbial "next year." I think we'll be pretty good this year and we only lose one senior off of this year's team. Hell, probably 7 of our top 9 players are going to be freshmen and sophomores.

[Red Don]

 

I think Miles is safe for three more seasons, including this one.  

 

On the flipside, I could see Miles leaving before that.

I think he likes it here well enough but he's never been anywhere for too terribly wrong and seems like he might subscribe to the Lon Kruger school of moving. It's probably a lot better if he leaves with another offer than if we have to fire him though.

 

I know you have your ear to the ground and a lot of sources of information (being remote, I only know what I read on this board), but I'd rather think Miles is 'on a Mission' and unlikely to voluntarily leave until he feels that either he has accomplished that mission or maximized his potential here.

[ajb5856]

I think Miles is safe for three more seasons, including this one.

On the flipside, I could see Miles leaving before that.

I think he likes it here well enough but he's never been anywhere for too terribly wrong and seems like he might subscribe to the Lon Kruger school of moving. It's probably a lot better if he leaves with another offer than if we have to fire him though.

I know you have your ear to the ground and a lot of sources of information (being remote, I only know what I read on this board), but I'd rather think Miles is 'on a Mission' and unlikely to voluntarily leave until he feels that either he has accomplished that mission or maximized his potential here.

Just curious, but where do you think he goes from here if he remains at the level of success of the last couple seasons? Or even if he improves the record only slightly?

Just my opinion, but if Miles believes he can get it done here then he's not leaving the bountiful resources of Nebraska on his own accord. Does anyone think he leaves the resources he has here or the B1G stage by his own choice? He wouldn't be moving to any program that's considered a better job than Nebraska, would he? If he leaves on his own it's because he is admitting failure and then he's going to a lesser program.

I just don't see it.

[Norm Peterson]

I just want him to continue to pull in Rivals 4-stars. 

 

If being the most successful basketball coach in Nebraska history and winning games in the NCAA tourney help him punch his ticket to the next level of basketball jobs, I guess I'll live with it.

[Husker4theSpurs]

I shouldn't have said Miles is living on transfers, but when your best player on the team each year is a different guy for the most part that's not exactly creating a cohesive team. It is the reality of college hoops these days though. And it's kind of what he's had to do.

Gill is not a great shooter from all I've heard but we will see. Not sure I can EVER see Morrow being featured. He is not polished offensively. He seems to be a good 4th or 5th option on a team ... a role player rebounder, hustler, etc. Not really a consistent offensive threat, but again we haven't seen a ton of him.

I'm not very convinced Miles can coach offense but I'm intrigued with the new assistant coach as I think he was hired to shore this up. I'm also not sure that Miles has the respect of his team completely, but I have no reason to really say that more a feeling. He going to have to show he's more substance than show as a coach.

There have been rumors of personal issues with Miles in the past ... mix that with the consistent loss of assistants and one decent year (that was really a hot 5 week run) despite much improved recruiting and I think 2 years max is what he has to work with overall.

[khoock]

If we miss the postseason (NCAA or NIT) in year 6 then Miles is in trouble imo.

It's unfortunate that he has caught a lot of bad breaks with AW3, Terran, and Walt but as the coach he ultimately has to shoulder the blame for the lack of success. That being said, I think we surprise ppl this year and I think the next year is gonna be one for the books.

[Norm Peterson]

H4tS, tell me the last time the Huskers had the same best player more than 2 years in a row.

 

Seems to me, having a new best player every year is more the nature of things.

 

Last year, our best player was a senior.  This year, it's going to have to be someone else because Shields graduated.

 

This year, our best player might very well be a senior again; same thing the year after that and the year after that.

 

Has nothing to do with transfers and everything to do with the fact that college players get better as they get older and more experienced.

 

Also, Petteway, a transfer, argues against your assertion that having transfers means we have a different best player every year.

[AuroranHusker]

Actually, I think that Miles has earned more respect and trust of his team by being firm with AW-III that a player is not in charge of how the team is run. I'd imagine that the other players on the team can see that playing time must be taken by hard work because no spots are a given. And I highly doubt that players would lose any respect or trust in their coach for having good players leave in pursuit of pro aspirations, either. In fact, it might make team chemistry even better [AW-III had already been out of Lincoln since graduation].

 

Lee Barfknecht has another Nebrasketball story that highlights reasons for optimism, pessimism et al:

 http://www.omaha.com/huskers/mens-basketball/barfknecht-huskers-youth-a-blessing-and-a-curse-entering-tim/article_e805536a-7625-54c6-9b42-16133786951d.html

[hhcmatt]

 

 

 

I think Miles is safe for three more seasons, including this one.

On the flipside, I could see Miles leaving before that.

I think he likes it here well enough but he's never been anywhere for too terribly wrong and seems like he might subscribe to the Lon Kruger school of moving. It's probably a lot better if he leaves with another offer than if we have to fire him though.

I know you have your ear to the ground and a lot of sources of information (being remote, I only know what I read on this board), but I'd rather think Miles is 'on a Mission' and unlikely to voluntarily leave until he feels that either he has accomplished that mission or maximized his potential here.

Just curious, but where do you think he goes from here if he remains at the level of success of the last couple seasons? Or even if he improves the record only slightly?

Just my opinion, but if Miles believes he can get it done here then he's not leaving the bountiful resources of Nebraska on his own accord. Does anyone think he leaves the resources he has here or the B1G stage by his own choice? He wouldn't be moving to any program that's considered a better job than Nebraska, would he? If he leaves on his own it's because he is admitting failure and then he's going to a lesser program.

I just don't see it.

 

 

Let me just start by saying I have little to no input from anyone on this...just observation over time.

 

Look at what Buzz Williams did moving from Marquette to VT...it's not always just about moving up to what is perceived to be the higher profile job. I'm not saying he's gone in a year or 5 years or 10 years. What I'm saying is that I don't think he will retire here and I think the more probable exit is leaving as opposed to being fired.

[hhcmatt]

Lee Barfknecht has another Nebrasketball story that highlights reasons for optimism, pessimism et al:

 

I hope Beckner doesn't read the OWH

[lanigan123]

I still find Miles culpable in the White decision. Doesn't mean I didnt renew my season tickets. Ultimately, I want the team to be successful. Id be more than happy being wrong if it meant the team was good.

[basketballjones]

Re: Watson/Morrow being featured - He seems like he wants to go to a team where he is secondary anyway. This is the sort of somewhat contradictory possible reasons for White leaving that points to White approaching things under the flawed premise that he would have been drafted this year had Nebraska had better players, had catered more to his strengths, had won more, etc. Also, featuring Morrow? Interesting...

Re Rosenthal - could have been ego but it also could have been that the Whites were hitting him up for stories and stuff like that and the silence at the end pointed at how disingenuous the whole situation was.

Re: Re: if our offense features Morrow, he really developed, or Miles is nuts.

edit: not a condemnation on Morrow, he's just not a guy an offense is ran through.

[HB]

I still find Miles culpable in the White decision. Doesn't mean I didnt renew my season tickets. Ultimately, I want the team to be successful. Id be more than happy being wrong if it meant the team was good.

 

You've been wrong plenty.

[colhusker]

I shouldn't have said Miles is living on transfers, but when your best player on the team each year is a different guy for the most part that's not exactly creating a cohesive team. It is the reality of college hoops these days though. And it's kind of what he's had to do.

Gill is not a great shooter from all I've heard but we will see. Not sure I can EVER see Morrow being featured. He is not polished offensively. He seems to be a good 4th or 5th option on a team ... a role player rebounder, hustler, etc. Not really a consistent offensive threat, but again we haven't seen a ton of him.

I'm not very convinced Miles can coach offense but I'm intrigued with the new assistant coach as I think he was hired to shore this up. I'm also not sure that Miles has the respect of his team completely, but I have no reason to really say that more a feeling. He going to have to show he's more substance than show as a coach.

There have been rumors of personal issues with Miles in the past ... mix that with the consistent loss of assistants and one decent year (that was really a hot 5 week run) despite much improved recruiting and I think 2 years max is what he has to work with overall.

I hope your wrong on Gill given this is the first time I have heard he is not a good shooter.  That said I really try not to by into the hype of preseason and coach speak.